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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions
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IcakethereforeIam · 06/03/2024 11:13

I'm surprised I've not seen anything in the Times about it. Unless I've missed it, not even a comment or opinion piece. I'm hoping they're planning a big exposé in the weekend edition. I expect the Guardian to ignore it for as long as possible though.

ArabellaScott · 06/03/2024 11:38

Datun · 06/03/2024 10:33

I hope Doyle addresses the castration fetishisation and awful paedophilia aspect.

Many people seem to think it's only legitimate to focus on the risks involved in the surgery, and lack of consent, kids' understanding of the implications, etc.

That the possibility it's all driven by sex is just too difficult to contemplate. Money? yes, absolutely. Sex? Oh, that's a bit much.

I absolutely think it's too difficult to contemplate. It's beyond horrifying to consider that an organisation with many links to paedophiles has been the organisation the NHS has based treatments on.

StephanieSuperpowers · 06/03/2024 13:07

Well, we knew it was going to happen and I thought I'd feel vindicated. But I just feel so, so sad and sorry for the poor young people who've been damaged by these conscience free charlatans and the ridiculous parents who've outsourced their judgement to lunatics and perverts.

MrsOvertonsWindow · 06/03/2024 13:13

IcakethereforeIam · 06/03/2024 10:44

What a good article. And hundreds of appalled readers commenting.

Emotionalsupportviper · 06/03/2024 13:17

StephanieSuperpowers · 06/03/2024 13:07

Well, we knew it was going to happen and I thought I'd feel vindicated. But I just feel so, so sad and sorry for the poor young people who've been damaged by these conscience free charlatans and the ridiculous parents who've outsourced their judgement to lunatics and perverts.

I agree - I think of the number of pictures I've seen online, with proud parents wearing "trans" flag tee-shirts and joyfully proclaiming that they "support their trans child", standing next to a hospital bed where a desperately unjoyful young girl is trying to convince herself that she has done the right thing by having a double mastectomy.

Some of them really believe that getting rid of their healthy breasts will open the doors to a new and wonderful life; others. . . well, you can see behind the smile and the pain in their eyes is obvious. They are hoping for acceptance and a new and wonderful life, but they aren't altogether sure - and it shows.

It breaks my heart. I hope those young people of both sexes DO have happy lives - but they are not going to be healthy lives, or pain-free lives (I know none of our lives are pain-free, but you know what I mean). Heaven help them.

ArabellaScott · 06/03/2024 13:40

StephanieSuperpowers · 06/03/2024 13:07

Well, we knew it was going to happen and I thought I'd feel vindicated. But I just feel so, so sad and sorry for the poor young people who've been damaged by these conscience free charlatans and the ridiculous parents who've outsourced their judgement to lunatics and perverts.

What I've found with these issues is that every time we're proved right it's a fucking bummer.

I've said before I really wish I was just being a hysterical/prudish/bigoted/stupid/old/etc person, and that children aren't being sterilised on the basis of a sexist and homophobic ideology.

There is absolutely no pleasure to be had in this fight. It's just trying to stop bad shit from happening. If you gain a victory, at best, nothing happens. Generally, sunlight is cast when something bad has happened. And when you fail, you know that bad shit is happening and is going to happen.

Rainbowshit · 06/03/2024 15:22

The number of people on Twitter saying they can't see any issue with a doctor gaining consent from each of a patient's alternate identities, before irreversibly altering the patient's body to match their "identity" is quite astonishing.

🙈

domineastronomy · 06/03/2024 16:14

StephanieSuperpowers · 06/03/2024 13:07

Well, we knew it was going to happen and I thought I'd feel vindicated. But I just feel so, so sad and sorry for the poor young people who've been damaged by these conscience free charlatans and the ridiculous parents who've outsourced their judgement to lunatics and perverts.

Totally agree. I just feel despair.

duc748 · 06/03/2024 16:37

Ah, Jennifer Pritzker, again. They really are quite the family.

AlisonDonut · 06/03/2024 16:52

Rainbowshit · 06/03/2024 15:22

The number of people on Twitter saying they can't see any issue with a doctor gaining consent from each of a patient's alternate identities, before irreversibly altering the patient's body to match their "identity" is quite astonishing.

🙈

The identity of which 'alter' though?

IcakethereforeIam · 06/03/2024 17:05

And the tras have the nerve to make up shit about GC and Turton Street.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 06/03/2024 17:44

I think that would guarantee a Trump victory or whatever candidate the republicans put up.

Helleofabore · 06/03/2024 20:20

This is a rather interesting analysis if it is true.

https://x.com/JamesCantorPhD/status/1765412026627784743?s=20

It is also a rather good table of studies.

https://x.com/JamesCantorPhD/status/1765412026627784743?s=20

BettyFilous · 06/03/2024 20:34

Is that Cantor tweet part of a longer thread Helleofabore? If so, has anyone in the replies submitted it for Threadreader?

Helleofabore · 06/03/2024 20:37

It didn't seem to be Betty. Because I thought it was interesting too.

But I think it was a couple of stand alone tweets that pointed out the deficiencies in the Endocrine Society etc. I found it interesting the availability between when NICE did the review and when Sweden did the review. And both came to the same conclusion. Evidence was too weak.

Helleofabore · 06/03/2024 20:40

But Michael Shellenberger is doing a space now on twitter. I hope that it will be available afterwards.

x.com/shellenberger/status/1765429753191006337?s=20

Helleofabore · 06/03/2024 20:57

Leor Sapir has made a good point on the twitter 'space' that we need to consider WPATH as a 'network'. Therefore when WPATH sets a policy, the people who are writing that policy are also members of different organisations that then update those organisation's policies. Because the other organisations such as the Endocrine Society's policy committee includes a WPATH senior person who worked on the WPATH policies / SOC.

StephanieSuperpowers · 06/03/2024 21:19

God, digging all these influencers out of all organisations is going to be a nightmare.

Mermoose · 06/03/2024 21:23

Janice Turner has mentioned the WPATH files in her column.

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/saudi-arabia-rebrand-just-reminds-me-of-sun-city-kbc2w36zw

WPATH leaks
WPATH leaks
Helleofabore · 06/03/2024 21:30

StephanieSuperpowers · 06/03/2024 21:19

God, digging all these influencers out of all organisations is going to be a nightmare.

I reckon so.

Helleofabore · 06/03/2024 21:35

11 detransitioner law suits in the USA listed so far.

Britinme · 06/03/2024 21:40

Given the way that health care works over here law suits are undoubtedly the best way to tackle the issue. Depending on the results of course, insurance companies will back off and medical practices are likely to be cautious. It has been a bit Wild West here. Among my own acquaintances I know one 14 year old girl who has been on puberty blockers for at least a year and one 18 year old girl who has had "top surgery," having been on puberty blockers followed by testosterone.

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