Sources help - cis

[NoBinturongsHereMate]

I know many here have splendid reference catalogues, so I hope you can hit me with some written sources about not using 'cis'.

Ideally including an explanation of why - although I can do that part myself if needed - but mainly I need to demonstrate that there's a significant level of objection.

So surveys with numbers objecting to the term would be ideal, or docs from multiple groups stating their objection.

If you believe that gay people are going to hell, you can preach that in church, but not at work. The same with other gender critical beliefs.

Also, that is the most outrageous misrepresentation of gender critical beliefs I think I've seen here in a while. No, @DadJoke we don't believe that gay people are going to hell just because we don't share your nonsensical beliefs that some men are women.

Quoting @DadJoke. It's good to see his true colours and the dropping of any pretence to a rational argument.

If you believe that gay people are going to hell, you can preach that in church, but not at work. The same with other gender critical beliefs.

It wasn't enough for him to use religion as an analogy. He had to sneak in an other, in order to insinuate that beliefs in hell, and that it's sinful to be gay, are intrinsically "gender critical" beliefs.

YY, Pots, exactly.

Yeah, I know 😁

So many men do. The ideology is like a magnet.

Without knowing the data on which that claim is based, I can't say. What did the researchers mean by 'trans' and 'cis'?

I am comparing two beliefs which are protected by law, but are incredibly offensive to people with certain protected characteristics. "Gay people are going to hell" is not a gender critical belief, nor are any other examples directed against other protected characteristics I can think of.

I am comparing two beliefs which are protected by law, but are incredibly offensive people with certain protected characteristics. "Gay people are going to hell" is not a gender critical belief.

Yes, I know that, that's my point. @NeighbourhoodWatchPotholeDivision demonstrated how you had casually slipped in "other" to imply that it is. You know how the English language works @DadJoke.

Shit, I see I said "other gender critical beliefs." I apologise, I don't think that at all.

I don't believe in gender identity ideology. I think as a belief it is nonsensical and incoherent. I don't believe males when they say they are women. I don't see that they have any basis for such a claim. I'm an atheist, not a religious believer.

That isn't really analogous with thinking all gay people are hellbound, however genderists choose to frame it.

Really? I think you knew exactly what you were doing when you phrased it that way.

I'm sure MNHQ will delete your post, if you flag it to them @DadJoke and then you can make a less misleading post.

Thank you - I have done that. I disagree with many, many things here, but I do not believe that "gay people go to hell" is a gender critical belief.

Thank you for withdrawing it.

This word wasn’t being used a few years back. It just appeared.

why do we need a word for differentiate natal men/women from pretenders?

'Cisgender' does NOT mean just someone who is not transgender. It means someone who a) believes in having an inner, abstract gender identity which b) just happens to match the sex of that person's own body.

If you don't have an abstract gender identity of that kind, then you are not 'cisgender.'

There is no word for this (most likely very large) group of people inside the gender identity ideology, but we we are all forced into the ideology when it states that we all must have this inner feminine or masculine or both or neither feeling which is not at all based on what sex we happen to have.

Taken in a wider context the material category of the female sex (which used to be called women and girls) is now erased and replaced with a gender identity category (cisgender) into which only the very privileged fall.

From being the more oppressed sex, globally, women are sneakily turned into the more privileged identity category.

As a consequence, fighting female genital mutilation, sex-selective abortions, sex trafficking, sexual violence (which overwhelmingly is aimed at female people), sex discrimination at work, in education, in religions etc: all those become much, much harder if not impossible.

So I am not cis because of all this.

'Cisgender' does NOT mean just someone who is not transgender.

quite.

I certainly don't identify with the societal imposed gender expected of my sex.

So I'm not cis.

And I'm sure as shit not trans.

Do you understand phrase "Gay people are more likely to suffer crime than heterosexual people?"

Those are both clearly defined terms.

It's a nonsense statement.

Are they more likely to suffer crime than homeless people?

They are, of course going to suffer more homophobic crime than heterosexuals.

But if you're talking crime, you're going to have to start defining transphobic crime. What is, and who it applies to.

And we're back to the drawing board.

What is trans?

How would you phrase "Transgender people are more likely to suffer discrimination than cisgender people"?

I would rephrase it to, "People who believe they are transgender (using people-first language out of respect for humans) may feel they suffer more discrimination than everyone else, but the data doesn't support this claim."

How would you phrase "Transgender people are more likely to suffer discrimination than cisgender people"?

"Cisgender" is not a protected characteristic so "cisgender people" will by definition not suffer any discrimination according to the law.

(Unless, of course, they have another PC, in which case does your assertion stand?)

Otherwise, what do you mean by "discrimination"?

Despite increased preoperative comorbidities, transgender women undergoing chest reconstruction have similar peri-operative safety profiles to cisgender women undergoing cosmetic breast augmentation.

Transgender women do not undergo 'chest reconstruction', there is no such thing. BREAST reconstruction is for cancer patients who have had theirs removed for medical reasons (a mastectomy).

Transgender women and 'cis' gender women (male sex and female sex people) opt to have breast augmentation for cosmetic, visual purposes. Reasons vary but usually to fulfil the male belief that the female shape should have large ones. Drag queens are a prime example of acting out men's perception of the female shape.

It seems that the women who have knowledge of this word refute it.
Considering its origins that is probably for the best.
It's really hard to add anything considering the context or need or intention is not clear.
Would natal or biological not suffice and if not, why not?

There is no recognition of the term cis in legislation and personally I think it will be used in future discrimination cases to show an organisations bias for one belief (GI) over another. In the UK it is a diagnosis of gender dysphoria that allows for a GRC not a belief in GI. Sex is still a protected category in its own right and I’d be wary when it comes to situations where single sex spaces etc are being disputed that it will be used against an organisation.