Telegraph: Parents who refuse children gender change face seven years in jail in Scotland

[ResisterRex]

What to say? They'll stop at nothing. Women and children, and parents are just cannon fodder. Who cares if they get hurt.

For shame.

"Parents who refuse to allow their children to change gender would face up to seven years in jail under SNP plans to ban “conversion therapy”.
Proposals published on Tuesday state that actions designed to “change or suppress” another individual’s gender identity, causing them physical or psychological harm, would become illegal under the radical law.
SNP ministers acknowledged that so-called conversion practices often took place in a “family setting”, raising the prospect that parents could be criminalisedd_ if they refuse to go along with their child’s declaration that they are transgender.
Stopping someone from “dressing in a way that reflects their sexual orientation or gender identity” was put forward as an example of an action that would become illegal, even if a parent believed they were acting in a child’s best interests.
A consultation states that alongside new criminal sanctions, preemptive civil orders could be obtained against parents or religious leaders, even where conversion practices had not yet taken place.
The plans are the latest controversial measure put forward by the SNPP_. Critics argue the proposals would have a devastating impact on freedom of speech, privacy and family life in Scotland.
Religious campaigners have vowed to fight the ban in the courts.
“We have grave concerns that these plans will criminalise loving parents, who could face years in jail simply for refusing to sign up to the gender ideology cult,” Marion Calder, a director at the campaign group For Women Scotlandd_, said.
“They will also hand activists and social workers unprecedented powers to meddle in family life, while having a chilling impact on therapists and counsellors.
“If the SNP and Greens insist on pushing this through, it is likely to go the same way as the toxic self-ID and named person laws and be blocked in the courts.”"

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/01/09/parents-refuse-child-gender-change-jail-snp-conversion-ban/

It's exactly like the named person nonsense. How can they not see the parallels?

We're going to have to take them to court again aren't we?

Agreed, and it is perhaps worth noting that the Tories (yes them again) seemed to have been made to understand that, which is why they postponed the Conversion Bill that was plan which was totally Stonewalled.

Although unfortunately some MPs from various parties took up the cry that it was a cruel thing to do to vulnerable trans children.

That's another Bill on the back burner that unfortunately Labour will push through, so good (or rather bad) that Scotland is going ahead with their propoals but it may show how to oppose the lumping together of those who are same sex attracted, with those who indentify as a gender.

You'll get the same if Labour gets in at the next election. Starmer and.his MPs are daft about Trans so called rights.

Yes. One path is gentle and wishes to align mind and body for a mental and physically healthy future. The other involves irreversible permanent and disfiguring change, sterilisation and an often substandard outcome. And the first is being referred to as the conversion therapy. And jail for parents who try to protect their child. Fuck me.

I saw a reference further up to incompetence. This isn’t incompetence, it’s child abuse.

I was wondering this. Have I accidentally been dressing in a way that expressed I'm demipan aromantic? Which clothing expresses which sexual orientation, is there a list? I don't want to be misleading.

Oh wait, no it's just TRAs using homosexual people as a shield for their euphoria boners. Again.

Why does the Scottish government seem to be so keen to destroy families? This is madness.

What's horrifying, on reflection, is if they do this and we have a Labour government and they don't stop it via S35.

That's probably the plan.

"Given the Scottish government is so keen to break up families, I can only assume Scotland must have a surplus of foster parents and excellent outcomes for looked after children."

No, Scotland doesn't have an excellent childrens care service and they know it too.
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/3050de55-0566-41d5-af6f-35b484bc57d3?shareToken=006e107ef486629632bbf89ca26e5d1a

Agree MrsO. Breaking up social constructs to pursue their agenda. Putting children and vulnerable young people at risk. Leaving the door wide open to abuse.

Insane. So as a parent you would have to agree to castrate your child or say a cheery 'sorry I am not going to allow this, see you in 7 years when I get out of the slammer!' Cos neither scenario would fuck a child's mind.

Compare and contrast the proposed sentence with the sentence given to a man in April 2023 for raping a 13 year old girl five years ago, and the sentence he would have received if he'd been over 25 at the time.

A man who raped a 13-year-old schoolgirl in a park when he was 17 has avoided a prison sentence.

Sean Hogg, 21, attacked the girl in Dalkeith Country Park, Midlothian, on various occasions between March and June 2018.

Judge Lord Lake said that if the rape had been committed by an adult over 25, Hogg would have received a jail sentence of four or five years.

Instead he was ordered to do 270 hours of unpaid work.

Court papers stated Hogg, of Hamilton, South Lanarkshire, threatened the girl, seized her by the wrists and forced her to carry out a sex act before raping her.

He was found guilty by a jury and appeared in the dock for sentencing in tears at the High Court in Glasgow.

Exactly.

Failing to enable a political position is far, far more serious (apparently) than raping a child, or abusing one until (eventually) they are reluctantly removed.

Batshit.

But we can see now what a useful tool the mantra 'literal violence' was, to get everyone pre programmed.

Probably. It’s depressing as hell

Social services agreed with us and said the school were causing division.

Watson’s ignored this and refused to discuss the social services referral with us. When we filed a formal complaint with the Registrar for Independent Schools about our whole experience, Watson’s lied and said they had been “unable to persuade us” to meet to discuss ir. We had the full email trail showing our asking to meet to specifically discuss both the clinical advice we had received and the social services position, but that made no difference to the outcome of the complaint which was dismissed by the Registrar. As far as he was concerned, the school policy for trans identified pupils was in line with the ScotGov guidance so all fine and their child protection policy was in line with other independent schools so all fine there as well. He didn’t care that they hadn’t bothered to follow their own child protection policy.

Since then, they have revised their child protection policy, including a page on how to escalate when you disagree with the social services outcome. Coincidence? They have also revised their policy for trans identified pupils, making it clear that they will support social transition without parental knowledge where the child wishes so long as the child is 12+. (Previously there was no age specified), There’s an article in the Telegraph about their policy and I provided a quote to the journalist.

What happened to us is not unique but if this bill passes, many more parents will go through the same experience and worse with the new threat of criminalisation. It’s abhorrent.

Have the SNP been asking the Taliban for policy advice?

This is horrifying and - as far as I can tell - it's actually breaking the law in that parents do have legal responsibilities for keeping their children safe. It's Orwellian perversion of language so normal, reasonable parental care for children is cast as abuse.

Who does that serve? Seriously, I can think of ONLY one group of people who breaking the bond between parents and their children - destroying their legal rights and either separating them physically or forcing them to stop safeguarding their child and giving them drugs so they remain forever in a pre-pubescent state serves.

This plus the whole letting young men who rape 13 year olds get away with it in Scotland would have me moving south of the border if I possibly could as a woman with children.

I'm not kidding, if we were living in Scotland now I'd be demanding DH start his job search (I wfh remotely so can move wherever).

Absolutely horrific.

Apart from all else, the absolute gall of this group of Scottish politicians and the SNP dictating to ordinary loving parents what is best for their children... yes that august bunch none of whom have ever been involved in any unsavoury behaviour such as poor financial record keeping dishonest financial misconduct, embezzlement, sending sexual emails to teenagers etc etc. And of course how wonderful the outcomes are for children 'in care' in Scotland - these outcomes demonstrate the level of care and expertise we can expect from the dear Scottish state as a parent

So that not too far down the line they have a plethora of immature looking, mentally fucked up, sterile people available for whoever is interested in that type of victim, to do with what they will.

SNP/Greenies are despicable- desperate to remove parental responsiblity and have the State responsible for our children. Won't be returning hame anytime soon sadly. Glad ma weans are up. And how the bloody hell will social work and police enforce this since Children and Families Servicea are already massively underfunded up there with bugger all resources for children with additional support needs, looked after/cared for children and the children of /involved in substance misuse issues(highest drug death rate in Western European - Nicola's Legacy). What a bunch of absolute fruitloops. And no viable Opposition

There is a much simpler explanation which doesn't require bizarre contortions and sinister insinuations about policymakers.

But does however require severe wilful naivety and not looking at unpleasant facts and reality, and also involves knowing bugger all about safeguarding.

So rather than wanting a tiny proportion of children to be able to more readily access a heavily restricted and monitored reversible treatment which has already been in use for decades and which exists largely as a concessionary 'buying time' alternative to administering cross-sex hormones from the outset - which, it should be pointed out, is what the majority of trans kids actually want and are forced to wait to access - you are saying what, exactly?

That this is a sinister plot from policymakers to...what?

I can think of another explanation.

Children claiming to be transsexual is now so commonplace that it's likely that some MSPs have children themselves who identify as transsexual or have other children in their extended families who do.

TRAs have been saying for ages that "trans children" would be the reason for changes in transgender legislation, because "they demystify it and take the sex right out of the trans experience". It also puts their parents and other adult relatives in a difficult position as any pushback against the ideology is seen by many as not "supporting" their child.

Had this conversation with you many, many times, it's been consistently purposeless, and I'm not participating in a derail.

Returning to the OP.

The "buying time" theory was debunked when the Tavistock released their data showing that all but one of their young patients on hormone blocking medication went on to have opposite sex hormones. Their brains don't develop normally if their puberty is blocked as they would if they went through a normal puberty, so they are still making decisions as pre-pubescent children.

How can a pre-pubescent child know what it will be like to be a adult with impaired sexual function? These children cannot consent to this or to being sterilised.

What sort of adult thinks it's right to sterilise children?