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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

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Original poster

Oh FFS another brand captured

90 replies

Unchristmascadeau · 20/12/2023 17:49

Lemonade Dolls this time. Loved their comfy pretty underwear, I think they’re also a women owned business. Then I’m treated to this on their Insta today.

https://www.instagram.com/p/C1EecNCsc3y/?igshid=ZDE1MWVjZGVmZQ==

Because of course we cannot have a women’s underwear brand who don’t pander to male fetishes, can we.

Pic attached.

OP posts:
LentilFaculties · 20/12/2023 19:19

I am annoyed that bras for trans people with no boobs are cheaper than bras for women with no boobs. Guess I'll go back to the teen range 🙄

Ha. That's quite terfy of them too. Almost as if they know that men aren't used to paying over inflated prices for everything like women are supposed to.

Flickersy · 20/12/2023 20:17

Underwear brand makes underwear for men. Scandalous - has anyone alerted the church elders??

toomanytrees · 20/12/2023 20:25

Judging from the other pictures on instagram, this company can't actually make anything that fits anyone, male or female, large or small, special identity or none. In that way the company is very inclusive.

PaterPower · 20/12/2023 20:32

Don’t particularly care what people choose to wear, but those pants would be fucking awful on just about anyone.

They're definitely not doing anything for the decidedly unhealthy looking model. Isn’t the point of advertising to make you think “ooh, I’d look good in those?”

Rather than, for instance, “ooh I’d look like an extra in Trainspotters in those.”

DarkDayforMN · 20/12/2023 21:01

HangingOver · 20/12/2023 18:46

They have a range of bras for men but as a 34aa I'm actually like oooh 👀

Man-bras in a 34 band?

It’s almost like this post purporting to be from a woman who is bizarrely excited to wear TW-targeted underwear… was actually posted by a man who doesn’t know how bras work.

Tacotortoise · 20/12/2023 21:09

So is somebody, anybody, going to explain why men moving away from stereotypical male clothing is a feminist issue?

Codlingmoths · 20/12/2023 21:20

LentilFaculties · 20/12/2023 19:17

It's a range specifically for the bepenised. It says so on the website. It means they recognise the physical differences in anatomy and design accordingly (sshhh nobody tell them that admitting this makes them Terfy old bigots).

Sure I disagree with the ideology behind the idea and I wish humans could feel free to like non stereotypical stuff without getting caught up in the authoritarian and quasi religious aspects of transgenderism. But what this company have done is not a million miles away from M&S having a "modest" collection.

It will be interesting to see if it makes the ££ they hope. I imagine there will be some who feel insufficiently validated by the website.

I don’t disagree at all with the idea that people should be able to wear whatever they want. This is fine.

SirChenjins · 20/12/2023 21:28

Is there a particular reason for a bloke wearing what looks a first bra?

The pants are reminiscent of the swirly nylon variety that used to hang from washing lines up and down the country in the 70s.

Tacotortoise · 20/12/2023 21:43

@SirChenjins my guess is because he's been paid to model it. In the hope that somebody (or many somebodies) will want to buy it.

LeonieSN93 · 20/12/2023 21:52

"Why would a man need/want a bra"

Why do women wear necklaces? Earrings? Thongs?

Clothes aren't exclusively about function and comfort. Some people buy clothes and accessories for how they feel, look or for how they make the individual feel. I certainly don't need half of my wardrobe but people are allowed to enjoy and have fun with clothing.

DarkDayforMN · 20/12/2023 21:57

This reply has been withdrawn

This message has been withdrawn at the poster's request

DarkDayforMN · 20/12/2023 22:00

This reply has been deleted

This message has been withdrawn at the poster's request

Oh god, I'm sorry, I thought you were a completely different poster making a different point not just showing us where the stuff is on the site! Still could have done without that photo lol.

SirChenjins · 20/12/2023 22:13

Tacotortoise · 20/12/2023 21:43

@SirChenjins my guess is because he's been paid to model it. In the hope that somebody (or many somebodies) will want to buy it.

I’m sure he has - I don’t imagine he’s doing it gratis.

HangingOver · 20/12/2023 22:18

It’s almost like this post purporting to be from a woman who is bizarrely excited to wear TW-targeted underwear… was actually posted by a man who doesn’t know how bras work.

Oh piss off, not all women are the same size. I have a wide ribcage due to a congenital disease. As for the tiny boobs, who the hell knows, ask my genetics. Buying bras for really small boobs is a nightmare (and before anyone says 'don't wear one then' you do still need one otherwise your nipples always show and it still hurts going up and down stairs etc especially when you're hormonal). So your options are sportwear, teen bras which are always pastel and have cutesy stuff on them or brands like Pepper which are amazing looking but you have to basically re-mortgage your house to afford. The only ones that fit me are from Bonds and you don't seem to be able to get the bras in the UK.

PaperWalkAndTalk · 20/12/2023 23:10

Tacotortoise · 20/12/2023 21:09

So is somebody, anybody, going to explain why men moving away from stereotypical male clothing is a feminist issue?

Probably because it's from a company selling women's underwear talking about female empowerment and then using men to market their underwear.

This is part of their trans collection, but that's not immediately clear on their socials.

Tacotortoise · 20/12/2023 23:32

OK but that's patently not women's underwear is it? It's clearly designed for, and being marketed to, men.

catduckgoose · 21/12/2023 01:55

A male model wearing underwear that is clearly designed to accommodate the shape of a male body. I don't see any problem with this.

PriOn1 · 21/12/2023 06:32

It’s a bit sad as I see from the owner’s comment below that she claims she started because she wanted to boost women’s confidence - something she notes men don’t generally need. And now she’s marketing for men as well, and it is frustrating that women can’t ever have things exclusivity for them. Seems like a marketing ploy and now she’s conquered the women’s market, she’s employing a new marketing ploy. Not surprised if a few women feel let down.

“All this started because I was unhappy with the lack of confidence a lot of my friends had about themselves. They were incredible and talented and I wanted them to see themselves the way they I saw them and feel how they deserved to feel. My background in the entertainment industry taught me that most men do not have this issue and that, in honestly, annoyed me a lot.”

Flickersy · 21/12/2023 07:20

PriOn1 · 21/12/2023 06:32

It’s a bit sad as I see from the owner’s comment below that she claims she started because she wanted to boost women’s confidence - something she notes men don’t generally need. And now she’s marketing for men as well, and it is frustrating that women can’t ever have things exclusivity for them. Seems like a marketing ploy and now she’s conquered the women’s market, she’s employing a new marketing ploy. Not surprised if a few women feel let down.

“All this started because I was unhappy with the lack of confidence a lot of my friends had about themselves. They were incredible and talented and I wanted them to see themselves the way they I saw them and feel how they deserved to feel. My background in the entertainment industry taught me that most men do not have this issue and that, in honestly, annoyed me a lot.”

it is frustrating that women can’t ever have things exclusivity for them

Don't be daft. There are far more underwear brands catering exclusively for women than there are brands which make lingerie for men. This is ridiculous hyperbole. And besides, the owner of the brand can do what she likes with it. She has no responsibility to provide you with an "exclusive" space.

Socksforxmas · 21/12/2023 08:58

Flickersy · 21/12/2023 07:20

it is frustrating that women can’t ever have things exclusivity for them

Don't be daft. There are far more underwear brands catering exclusively for women than there are brands which make lingerie for men. This is ridiculous hyperbole. And besides, the owner of the brand can do what she likes with it. She has no responsibility to provide you with an "exclusive" space.

Show quote history

👏

I wonder why female owned small businesses like this struggle when the minute they try to expand to a broader market they get all sorts acting like it's some kind of betrayal of women, and that they've been 'captured' by the wOkEs. I guess it's the height of feminism to think that women just shouldn't make money and succeed in business?...

PaperWalkAndTalk · 21/12/2023 08:59

Tacotortoise · 20/12/2023 23:32

OK but that's patently not women's underwear is it? It's clearly designed for, and being marketed to, men.

Are you including the bra that the man is wearing in other photographs too?

Maaate · 21/12/2023 09:01

If they're just women's pants with "wider and longer gussets"

Would be good if a women's underwear company could make womens pants to fit women

A lot of women's underwear these days has short, narrow and flimsy gussets which just don't stay where they're meant to 😫

Tacotortoise · 21/12/2023 09:01

PaperWalkAndTalk · 21/12/2023 08:59

Are you including the bra that the man is wearing in other photographs too?

Show quote history

Yes, why?

Helleofabore · 21/12/2023 09:18

“I guess it's the height of feminism to think that women just shouldn't make money and succeed in business?..”

If this was a company who started as a female centred company and built their consumer base using that branding, and then have expanded, there is a reason to discuss this in feminism. Because that brand leveraged women and girls to make money and are now using that reputation and that consumer base as an asset to then sell to male people.

They are in the business of making money. How they choose to do that is their business and people can analyse this however they wish. When it comes to ‘ethics’, a brand who positions themselves as ethical, and that is inferred with the communication of ‘inclusivity’, needs to be able to show that they are indeed ethical as they claim.

There is cause for discussion if a business positioning themselves as ethical uses a female target segment to then attract a male target segment after a change of direction.

And that would fit into a feminist discussion.

Has this company changed direction? Were they originally marketing themselves anything like ‘made for women by women’? If so, women unhappy about this have justification.