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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

KJK

687 replies

Notaflippinclue · 04/11/2023 22:14

Why the fuck has MUMSNET cancelled her

OP posts:
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33
Signalbox · 05/11/2023 09:38

AlphaTransWoman · 05/11/2023 00:09

I love freedom of speech. It makes it a lot easier for people to figure out who the bad guys are.

The era of “no debate” is over then?

ApocalipstickNow · 05/11/2023 09:40

AlisonDonut · 05/11/2023 09:31

You can call her up on TERF Talk Tuesday next week and do it.

Go on, put your money where your mouth is.

Excellent suggestion.

FreddysSquishyBollock · 05/11/2023 09:43

Signalbox · 05/11/2023 09:38

The era of “no debate” is over then?

Does this mean Grace Lavery can now debate Helen Joyce?

Because that event’s cancellation is my personal Great Sadness of the Terf Wars.

Grace would be even funnier than Freda, and might even sling the wine over Tatchell!

Froodwithatowel · 05/11/2023 09:50

Hm. KJK isn't the gullible type, and besides, it would overstress supply lines on tissues.

OldCrone · 05/11/2023 09:51

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 05/11/2023 09:51

@TheHappyCarrot Grin quite

Girlontherailreplacementbusservice · 05/11/2023 09:54

AlphaTransWoman · 05/11/2023 03:48

I'm a lady.

It's the 21st century 'ladies' can box if they want to.
It's our job to make sure they continue to be able to and don't find themselves facing a man with lady feels.
Considering how many perfectly reasonable questions from Mumsnetters you have failed to answer with plenty of time and space to consider your answers I wouldn't be rushing into live debate with anyone if I were you.

Helleofabore · 05/11/2023 10:03

Froodwithatowel · 05/11/2023 09:50

Hm. KJK isn't the gullible type, and besides, it would overstress supply lines on tissues.

Particularly if it is recorded. That would be a lifetime supply needed there.

ZuttZeVootEeeVo · 05/11/2023 10:06

TRA dont used platforms to change minds - they dont think highly enough of women to care about what we think. They use them as a means to perform 'woman' in front of an audience. Thats why wallis was drunk and flashing, because to him that what 'woman' is.

Its why they are so bad a debating - its not their aim. Its to show off their definition of woman - shaved legs, or clothes or sexual fetish.

donquixotedelamancha · 05/11/2023 10:07

Not long before the first KJK episode (Nov 2019) they interviewed India Willoughby (April 2019) who back then was trying to pretend to be a ‘Reasonable Trans Person’, and the Triggerpod boys were sympathetic bordering on sycophantic.

In fairness, IW has changed her position back and forth several times since then. She was clearly figuring out what would get her the most attention and decided screaming Genderist loon is the most profitable.

PorcelinaV · 05/11/2023 10:08

AlphaTransWoman · 04/11/2023 23:58

As a trans rights activist, I would be delighted for her to have as much airtime as possible. The more people hear her express her views, the better.

Good to know you're on the side of free speech.

Strangely, your fellow activists don't have the same confidence you do. They are very scared of open discussion for some reason.

What position is going to win?

"Women don't have a penis"

Or...

"Sex is so much more complex that you think; it's not a binary, and that's why this 100% normally developed male is somehow a woman just because they said so"

??

SheGotACamouflagedFace · 05/11/2023 10:14

https://x.com/theposieparker/status/1720956553753203014?s=46&t=omuKeAgAjscgni2jfxrNng

‘I said I’d drink a bottle of Prosecco through my nose if @stellacreasy could tell us what a woman was.’

SinnerBoy · 05/11/2023 10:24

*Catsanfan" · Today 09:34

I mean indeed, if Peter 'let's fuck children' Tatchell has to step in, you know you're done for.

Well, quite...

Boiledbeetle · 05/11/2023 10:26

AlisonDonut · 05/11/2023 09:31

You can call her up on TERF Talk Tuesday next week and do it.

Go on, put your money where your mouth is.

No one ever seems to do this though do they! They pontificate about all the things they would say to put that woman in her place and yet don't seem to grasp the fact that they can call her every Tuesday and actually talk to her!

I wonder why they all seen to be so busy that they miss the opportunity week after week after week after week!

BonfireLady · 05/11/2023 10:31

When I first came in to this whole subject, I found voices like KJK's too extreme (same with Glinner). I didn't want to listen because their delivery style sounded (to me) that it would be hurtful to those that believe that they have a gender identity and have gender dysphoria.

I have a totally different "style" to both of them but I also value them both hugely.

I appreciate this is a thread about KJK and not Glinner but I see them both in the same way on this. With both of them I share common ground that a) children are being harmed by all of the ways that gender identity belief is being compelled as a truth, particularly in schools and mental health care and b) transwomen don't belong in women's spaces, sports and associations.

KJK's voice in this is incredibly important and incredibly powerful. I'm really glad that she speaks up.

This has been posted on Twitter this week https://twitter.com/melliehellie42/status/1720361618528157903?t=KcWmkcYO2vhjcR63n_RgOQ&s=19 , where someone is trying to say that her views from 5 years ago (for those not on Twitter, it's a video with her saying that post-op transwomen might be OK in women's spaces) show that she is a "fraud". On the contrary, I'd say that it shows that her views come from a place of reasoned thinking, where she has a firm foundation as a decent and caring human being; that she's not being unfair or unreasonable. Like most/many of us, she's had a journey of awakening.

On a personal note, my one and only interaction with KJK on Twitter was about compelled speech. I said that a poster was free to use preferred pronouns if she wanted to, and that I did the same (never a child, and never where context is important) because I support each of us having our own free will. This was in response to a KJK comment, where KJK had explicitly told the poster not to use the transwoman's preferred pronouns. In response to my comment, where I said that it was a matter of freedom of choice, she told me that I was a part of the problem. I don't consider myself part of the problem at all - I'm using my voice in my own way. Some people shut down when she speaks and she pushes them away with her abrasiveness. Some people listen to her and it helps them a lot.

Personally, I think her format to Let Women Speak is much better in person and doesn't really translate to MN. I also really enjoy listening to her no-nonsense delivery when she is interviewed on TV. I should imagine that if she was here on MN arguing her (excellent) points, she would firstly be held back by the rules (i.e. she wouldn't be able to express herself as she'd want to) and secondly she'd risk alienating people (like me) if they try and interact on some of the nuances. I'm very comfortable in my own understanding of what is harmful in relation to gender identity belief and, while I'll accept that it's possible that I'm still on a peaking journey, I don't need to be whacked around the head with blunt comments telling me that I'm part of the problem.

https://twitter.com/melliehellie42/status/1720361618528157903?s=19&t=KcWmkcYO2vhjcR63n_RgOQ

FreddysSquishyBollock · 05/11/2023 10:43

Gosh yes.

That’s defo been my journey too. Thought there were teeny tiny numbers of Blair White style transsexuals that weren’t a problem, didn’t understand what the terves where banging on about…

Cue the picture of the enormous, middle aged basketball player on the high school team, an accidental layover at Malaga Airport and Cancer Research rebranding me a ‘Cervix Haver’ and I’ve been one of the Fully Fledged Tervish for nigh on 6 years.

I’ve gone from ‘Be Kind’ to ‘Cock Off’.

PatatiPatatras · 05/11/2023 10:48

For those asking what is nonsensical about kjk - nothing. I'm encouraging the TRA to demand her return.

Catsanfan · 05/11/2023 10:54

AlphaTransWoman · 04/11/2023 23:58

As a trans rights activist, I would be delighted for her to have as much airtime as possible. The more people hear her express her views, the better.

Her views that women are adult human females? Do you regard yourself as an adult human female?

ZuttZeVootEeeVo · 05/11/2023 11:19

FreddysSquishyBollock · 05/11/2023 10:43

Gosh yes.

That’s defo been my journey too. Thought there were teeny tiny numbers of Blair White style transsexuals that weren’t a problem, didn’t understand what the terves where banging on about…

Cue the picture of the enormous, middle aged basketball player on the high school team, an accidental layover at Malaga Airport and Cancer Research rebranding me a ‘Cervix Haver’ and I’ve been one of the Fully Fledged Tervish for nigh on 6 years.

I’ve gone from ‘Be Kind’ to ‘Cock Off’.

We were conned into believing that theres differences between different men claiming to be women, or wanting to be treated as woman or not like other men.

Theres no difference between blaire white and a tall man wanting to be in a womans sport.

JoodyBlue · 05/11/2023 11:26

In one of the very few (only) panels interviews discussing transgender ideology, the proponent in support of it could only mention getting "f**d" in a club by other women's husbands and women shaming men for "who they really are". Really is this the best non-argument on offer? It speaks volumes. That mainstream political parties support these characters in any way needs highlighting properly to everyone who will listen. So yes debate away please go for it. At least Wallace was honest. Tatchell is incoherent because the T is in no way comparable to the LGB unless one takes into account views like Wallace's. Is it a sexual orientation or is it people trying to quietly get on with their lives. Does quietly getting on with your life mean forcing yourself into women's spaces. If it does it is problematic for the women who object and even for the ones who don't. I know we know all this already. But it bears repeating.

FreddysSquishyBollock · 05/11/2023 11:28

ZuttZeVootEeeVo · 05/11/2023 11:19

We were conned into believing that theres differences between different men claiming to be women, or wanting to be treated as woman or not like other men.

Theres no difference between blaire white and a tall man wanting to be in a womans sport.

Yep. There is only one logical place to draw the line between women and men who say they are women.

No males in female single sex spaces. Full stop.

Women aren’t Penis-People, Women aren’t Amputated-Penis-People.

Nippi · 05/11/2023 11:34

I first came across her years ago on MN and she peaked me. She was blunt and to the point when everyone else was tiptoing around being nice.
I've followed her in various ways and used find her very engaging but I can't stand the weirdly filmed tiktoc things she has going on at the moment. I don't use TT but she reposts them on IG and Twitter.

lady69 · 05/11/2023 11:52

AlphaTransWoman · 05/11/2023 00:09

I love freedom of speech. It makes it a lot easier for people to figure out who the bad guys are.

“Guys”

You said it bro, you said it.

SinnerBoy · 05/11/2023 12:18

BonfireLady · Today 10:31

When I first came in to this whole subject, I found voices like KJK's too extreme (same with Glinner). I didn't want to listen because their delivery style ...

I think that she's just Bloody Well Had About Enough and is sick of being patronised, condescended to and shouted over by blokes who are arrogant, with no actual reason to be arrogant.

It seems to me that she gives it a chance, then bitter experience has led her to conclude that it's best to be terse and "For goodness sake!" to be able to make her point. She can seem abrasive, but it's for good reason.

quantumbutterfly · 05/11/2023 12:42

AlphaTransWoman · 05/11/2023 00:09

I love freedom of speech. It makes it a lot easier for people to figure out who the bad guys are.

Bad 'guys'- are you misgendering kjk Shock