Stonewall releases report on "dehumanising" discrimination against asexuals

[GinAllAround]

I'm not doubting that you can be judged socially for saying you're asexual but is it really the same as being gay or lesbian?

Although I agree that it shouldn't be classed as a MH condition, I've never heard of anyone being denied a job or housing for being asexual or being beaten up or taunted in the streets.

And what extra legal protection/rights do asexual people need? Surely they have the same rights as anyone else?

www.stonewall.org.uk/about-us/news/new-research-shining-light-‘dehumanising’-discrimination-faced-ace-people

You haven't actually explained why they can't be equated.

Both individuals are not able to get pregnant without having sex that, due to their sexual orientation, they do not want to have.

Telling one of them 'just go have sex with a man to get pregnant' but offering the other fertility treatment seems to demand a more coherent rationale.

Stonewall are just trying to stay relevant. They will fold within 10 years if not sooner.

Lets hope so. They appear to be well past their sell by date.

You're wrong here: So technically an asexual woman who has tried and failed 12 rounds of insemination can qualify.
No, 6 of those have to be IUI insemination in a clinic. Massive difference between using a turkey baster at home and having IUI.
IUI would be the first line treatment. You get referred to a fertility clinic who don't just jump in with IVF as it's the most invasive and most expensive intervention.

If you read the link I'd posted directly from the NHS website and namechecked you in instead of screenshotting an unreferenced picture from some undetermined corner of the internet you would have seen the correct information.

I have literally pasted the NHS IVF guidelines above. Lesbians aren't handed IVF without trying with sperm either! Is it a reading comprehension issue?

Maybe those guidelines are so busy trying to be nice, inclusive and not mention the role that sex plays in human reproduction that they need to be redone.

Because the NHS should be sending ostensibly heterosexual couples who just don’t want to have sex away with a flea in their ear if they’re whinging about problems conceiving. No matter what label they apply to themselves.

And single women too.

Private clinics can make their own decisions, and charge accordingly.

It’s like having fallen down a bloody rabbit hole dealing with the wide reaching effects of identity-ideology.

No you weren't replying to me. That's how internet forums work. One person (you) asks a question (whatabout lesbiansss) that someone else (me) has already answered to the other whataboutery posters asking the same bullshit gotcha. You then read the answer. If you want a private conversation you need to use the PM system with the poster of your choice.

Wish people would give over with the "what about lesbians? Huh? Huh? GOTCHA YOU HETERONORMATIVE WOMEN YOU!"

It's getting old and the assumptions that we're a bunch of straight women are making some people look like hypocrites with regards to handing out labels and making assumptions about people.

It also goes to show that one side of the alphabet soup debate has taken the time to inform themselves in great depth and detail about the multifaceted nature of the issues and people involved, and the other side just mashes the keyboard with their noses then hits post when they run out of dogma to copy and paste. Then when you give them answers to the whataboutery they don't want to read them because that gets in the way of the whataboutery. It's like they don't even want an informed discussion.

@PlanetJanette they can’t be equated because one group are same sex attracted. The other group just have really, really low sex drive me have decided that’s an identity.

Telling lesbians they must have sex with men is homophobic, whatever the pretext.

Telling an asexual woman that she should just have sec with her own bloody husband if they want to have a baby is a basic biology lesson.

It simply isn’t dehumanising to say to a married man and woman (that’s the actual example in that report) that babies are conceived via sexual intercourse.

It may well be dehumanising to tell lesbians that they should be having sex with men.

The issue of who should pay for any fertility treatment is separate.

I think we all know that this is a load of claptrap and the “ace community” isn’t in fact being discriminated against and persecuted.

Someone on TwitteX suggested that this is preparation. In the near future there will be a significant number of people who were put on puberty blockers and then surgically sterilised. Many of those people will be at best semi-functional sexually and unable to orgasm, ever. So it makes sense to create another special protected group to campaign about. It creates the illusion that these people weren’t damaged by medical interventions, they are simply asexual which is just another way of being, perfectly natural. And at the same time they are a vulnerable group who need protection from discrimination. Thus the undesirable effects of “gender reassignment” treatment are normalised - these people haven’t been damaged, they’re just asexual.

I think she has a very good point.

But who I was replying too was relevant as it matched the quote I was replying too you came with an argument that had nothing to do with what I was replying too.

Funny you take a jab at comprehension when you can’t comprehend what you posted yourself, so I’ve screenshotted the literal first part of the link you shared and a shot further down further explaining IUI.

So I’m repeating myself. As long as a woman has tried those things, she can qualify. Even if she’s single.

Depending on where you live the NHS might not even provide it for free if you are a woman who has been having unprotected sex with a man for over a year and has been unable to conceive.

And possibly having a first name which sounds like another word for an HGV and a surname which sounds like a unit of currency.

What I really don't get is why the need to share that you're asexual.

And what is the opposite of asexual? Nymphomaniac?

I love sex and could happily do it 3 or 4 and more times a day. Do i need to share that with anyone at work?

Fuck no!

So why share you're asexual?

Just really really don't understand it.

Is it coz they're special?

are lesbians also considered in this statement?

Why wouldn't they be?

But I wasn’t replying to you, I was replying to the poster who said this: No one should be given fertility treatment on the NHS if they are fertile without any other issue than not having PIV sex.

not quite the same, is it?

I’ve also shared that link, and it can still apply to asexual women as the information does not specify ‘lesbians’, just ‘women’.

Yes, @BodegaSushi, I'm not clear on what issue you have with my post?

So many people to con,so little time....

So Stonewall is taking something completely normal (not being interested in sex), which no one much is interested in, and trying to get people to obsess about this. And how is this helpful to those who could be described this way? Stonewall, go away you grifting parasites.

Is that why the author and champion of asexuality is partially showing her breasts and has a come-hither look in her eyes?

All fertility treatments involve sperm.

The NHS womens health framework commits to providing artificial insemination options for lesbian couples before resorting to IVF. That is fair enough. I'm not claiming asexual women should have more rapid access to IVF specifically.

But I fail to see why two people, both of whom are unwilling to conceive a child through sex with a man due to their sexual orientation, should be treated differently when it coms to fertility treatment.

But that all relies on denying that asexuality is a thing.

There is a difference between sexual behaviour and sexual orientation. Lesbians and asexual women face the same issue in respect of conception - namely that they do not want, by reason of their sexual orientation, to have sex with a man.

Saying that either of those women should be denied fertility treatment and should not be able to have a family unless they are willing to act contrary to their sexual orientation is a pretty good demonstration of why asexual people might feel they need to talk about the issues they face.

That's so obvious, when you think about it. And so very, very sad.

I was asking for an answer to my question for clarity, which I see you’ve now provided. My issue is that I think your belief is discriminatory against gay women, but luckily you aren’t the one who sets the guidelines.