Policing women’s clothes or reasonable expectation?

[SorryAuntLydia]

I dropped my teens at school yesterday and instead of the usual 2 teachers at the gate, there were 10 (possibly more I couldn’t see). They were stopping all the girls and commenting on skirt length. Those whose were deemed too short (almost every year 10 and 11) were told to stand in a particular area of the playground where names were taken before they were allowed to go to class.

And subsequently the parents were sent an email about skirt length needing to be on or below the knee, failure to adhere means detention etc.

I am really uncomfortable about this.
On the one hand it’s the uniform policy so it’s what we signed up to.
On the other hand I couldn’t help but look at the girls being herded into a corner of the playground and feel uncomfortable. And I also think that skirt length should be personal choice for young women - it doesn’t impact their learning so why does it matter?

This is probably an aibu. But I need a feminist view on it, please.

Do you think it’s fair for me to complain? Either at the way in which this was done? Or that the uniform policy should be changed? I’m sure my imagination is being overly dramatic and don’t mean to offend, but it reminded me of the images of Iranian women being berated for being improperly veiled.
Please help me untangle my thoughts on this.

I don’t have a problem with the rule. It’s necessary because girls like to roll their skirts up. I did too when I was at school. It then becomes competitive as to who can roll their up to the most mini length. You then have what I saw this morning - a girl on her way to school with a skirt so short I could see the bottom of her bum (she was wearing tights). It looked ridiculous and slightly concerning for her sake.

Saying on or below the knee is a simple, easy to remember rule. It’s not policing girls’ bodies, it’s just ensuring a uniform policy.

The thing that is making the girls roll their skirts up is the fact that it is against the rules and is a minor act of rebellion. If as OP suggests, the rule was taken away, girls may well loose the desire to roll their skirt up.
My 3 DD's went to non uniform school. Never had any of this bollocks. Teachers just seem to get on with teaching. My girls wore jeans, leggings and joggers, shorts in summer.
I really object to the schools that insist on a particular supplier - great way to make girls feel shit about not being the right body shape.

*I work in secondary schools. The skirts can be VERY short. Nobody really cares about knee length, but knee length is safe ground.

It is creepy for teachers to comment “your skirt is too short because I can see your bum”. Then teachers have then admitted to looking at her bum, and you can see the problem.

The policy of knee length leaves a bit of room for minor rebellion, and keeps the conversation comfortable for everyone. It is reasonable.*

This makes a great deal of sense. They do clearly need to give some leeway to tall thin girls and just had a growth spurt.

As you say the things I see some girls wearing are ridiculous. It's bought skirt in year 7 at above knee length because 'that's how everyone else has it', then didn't replace for four years. They're bursting out at the seams. The boys and girls wearing trousers don't expect to be in the same pair from year 7 to year 10.

I don't think any uniform is really necessary for learning, plenty of countries manage fine without it. But if we're going to have uniform I don't think it's unreasonable to ask for some degree of uniformity to it.

When i lived on the continent they pretty much self imposed uniform of jeans and t-shirts and hoodies. While in the UK we'd probably get some silliness initially just out of novelty value, I suspect if we ditched uniform people would quickly lose interest in what other people are wearing.

UK school uniform rules are batshit. However, if you're signed up to it, then you wear it correctly.

If you want to change it, do what we did and form a school council, and come up with a practical, accessible, alternative.

" The difference being a work place would find themselves in court if they herded up all the female staff and separated them based on their clothing. The issue is not the school uniform policy, it’s how they’re treating the girls in order to police it."

THIS response is spot on. I wouldn't have bothered to ask on here and would have the complaint in already. Uniform policy, signed up or not they way the girls were being treated, herded into the playground at drop off in full view of parents and other students is a disgrace.

When I was at school shirts were supposed to be fully buttoned up. Boys would often wear 1, 2 or 3 buttons open. I couldn't imagine a situation where boys were stopped in the morning, blazers opened by teachers and how much chest was exposed checked.

There would be outcry and if letters were sent home they would be sent straight to the bin. No doubt parents would argue why was their time being wasted on something that was neither an educational or behavioural issue.

Girls on the other hand are supposed to put up with this and an inordinate amount of time is wasted worrying about petty uniform issues. We have to ask ourselves what is the purpose of some of the uniform policies when it comes to girls. What about no make up at 18 years of age? Yet if the same girl were to be out in the world working she might find herself being told she was not professionally dressed for lack of make up.

Yet if the same girl were to be out in the world working she might find herself being told she was not professionally dressed for lack of make up.
I'm 51, and no one's said that to me so far. Good thing too. I'll start wearing make-up when all my male peers do.

I'm very anti-uniform so probably the wrong person to comment in any event. The US and the European continent manage perfectly well without it, and in some instances the achievement rates at these schools are measurably better than ours.

A better approach would simply be to have everyone wear jeans. At least this dispenses with this ridiculous hauling girls over the coals in relation to skirt length, or pulling out the fabric of trousers to see how far away it comes from the leg (do they do the same trick on boys who wear trousers to school?)

IMO it's a ridiculous waste of time. IMO schools have better things to be focusing on, like stamping out the endemic problem with bullying, for instance.

And it's okay to say 'well you signed up to it so you know The Rules!' Good luck with finding any school in Britain without a strident uniform policy. For some odd reason the British seem to have quite a hang-up about it.

What? You lost me here. Why can’t they run? To class, to sport, at lunchtime. Or is running and casual sport Ie not in your pe uniform just for boys past 12?
I support a useful length skirt to be functional and agree peer pressure is a thing.

They're not allowed to run to class, but at break time yes.