My 13 year old says she is trans. How do I deal with this?

[ProfessorInkling]

It's been a slow burn for the last 18 months or so, since puberty really took off.

I don't know where to even begin to try and explain her earlier years and how we got here because she used to be interested in my views of the world, as kids tend to be of course.

She's always been such a girls girl - not stereotypically girly in any way but in touch with her identity as female, looking for and to female role models BECAUSE of their sex, Mary Anning, Rosa Parks, flipping Artemis Athena Cleopatra, and on and on...

NOW it's all 'I feel like a boy' and 'top surgery will be everything' 'why can't you use he/him pronouns for me'....

How do I deal with this?

So far I have tried listening, reasoning, and reassuring her that while she is free to express herself in any way she likes (boys shoes, clothes, short hair at the moment) I cannot deny her biological reality blah blah blah... but am I going to lose her this way?

If it's a phase I can do nothing of course but every day she seems further from me and more entranced with the idea that she can 'become' a boy.

No diagnosis but have always wondered ASD/ADHD.

I have no advice, if it was me with my own daughter I would likely be doing the same as you, but she already knows my views as we’ve talked about it before in an age appropriate way.

What so you think has triggered this for your daughter, was it puberty itself?

Out of curiousity, what is her school like? Is it single/mixed sex? Does the school tacitly encourage teaching trans ideology or has it come up in PSHE recently? What about her friendship circle?

You need to watch some Gender A Wider Lens podcasts and look at different ways of approaching this.

Stella O'Malley has a new book, When Kids Say They're Trans which may offer some help/advice.

Best of luck to both of you, very tricky situation.

Personally I wouldn't indulge her. My kids know my opinion on the trans issue and seem to be fine with it.

It depends on your parenting style. I can't be doing with any woo shit (religious beliefs, trans etc) and so am quite no-nonsense. I would just shut any talk of "maybe I'm a boy" immediately with " well you're not so deal with it". I get that this isn't the way other people may parent 😆but it works for us.

I honestly do wonder if there's a bit of a class divide when it comes to the trans stuff. I'm working class, my kids are I suppose middle class (im northern, they're southern, they grew up with more.moneybthan i did) it would never enter my head to indulge this nonsense but a lot of my friends are ( how to put this politely) middle class yummy mummys who never set boundaries. I can see them going along with this shit just for an easy life tbh.

I think the fact you're wondering if she has adhd/asd is the real issue here. Maybe see if you can get a diagnosis for her so you can help her manage the world through that lense.

I would have a sneaky peek at her internet history to see where she is getting this from. Possibly talk to the school about friendships. It's natural to find your body weird during puberty but the talk of surgery is worrying and a recent trend. Keep an open dialogue with her and encourage her to talk without judgement. Working in a school, a lot of girls are transing and rejecting female vulnerability/ Instagram female messaging rather than wanting to be male. Hopefully, she'll reach a place where she's found comfort in her own female body and loves her life as a female.

It’s nonsense and I am a parent, a biology graduate and tell them so. It’s a dangerous ideology, relies on outdated gender stereotypes ,a social media trend and is totally batshit when you dig into it. Tell her she’s a girl but if she wants to dress in trousers and a shirt then go ahead.

No nonsense in our family either.

Oh and @menopausalmare is right. It’s a rejection of girlhood and girls bodies during puberty in the same way anorexia is. This is just the new trend on the block. Dangerous thing is we never affirmed anorexia but for some reason people are running around calling this brave. I just roll my eyes. And yes funny how there has been a massive uptick in this in girls and middle class girls at that.

I agree with that too.

I feel like a boy...what does a boy feel like? Who knows. Every boy feels different, every girl feels different.

People getting mad about switching pronouns and misgendering someone - it is so hard to suddenly start using the opposite or a different name.

Take a look at this also:

I"m with you but this this approach depends on the child. A child who needs reasoning and only gets a flat one sided authoritarian style response will instantly put the parent in enemy mode and go and speak to those lovely understanding people on the internet who talk to them and care about their feeeeezzzlliings.

@that was to @WitchyFingers I don't kniw why the quote button doesn't then translate agter pressing post sometimes

Oh🤦🏿‍♀️

Can I speak as a male, and a non parent? Maybe I'm totally unqualified. I often wonder how I'd react to your situation if it was mine, knowing what we all do.

Deep down, we know this is all wrong. I do liken it to a cult, would you be ok allowing your child to pack his or her bags and walk into the distance? I know I wouldn't.

Unfortunately the cult is not only the cult itself, but civic society assisting the cult, you can't even approach the school, GP, police etc.

My advice (yes, as a man, yes, as a non parent). Keep talking, keep questioning, keep interrogating. Impress upon her the enormity and irreversibility of all this. Have your arguments honed and your facts rehearsed.

Ask her how she'd feel if you chose to voluntarily amputate a healthy limb, just because you wanted to. Would she be happy, would she wave you on, especially if you could never justify it? Ask her how upset she'd feel.

Now tell her she's contemplating the same. Ask her to imagine the sheer terror you're feeling.

Talk, keep talking, never stop talking, and hold your nerve.

I really wish you good fortune, hug her tight and don't let go.

@DysonSpheres you are right. But with a vulnerable girl age 13 I would then switch her access to the internet off. I used to work for a company in which we saw the evidence of how social media is affecting our girls especially. If this really continued I would shut down her access to all these people online who say they care about her.

Agreed. I think this approach works more with my son than my daughter. But with something this insidious and harmful I would have to go full authoritarian on them. Their lives are too important to me to basically allow them to.join a cult.

My daughter (13) pretty much disagrees with everything I say and thats fine. But if she wanted to harm herself? No, I would shut that shit down real quick. Of course depends on the child, I think my two must take after me 😬

Also we monitor their Internet usage so if we saw them accessing a website that advocates for harming children, we'd know about it and block it immediately.

I honestly do wonder if there's a bit of a class divide when it comes to the trans stuff.

I’ve been wondering that too. The school my kids go to is in a predominantly working class area and trans ideology doesn’t seem to be much of an issue at all.

I think you should support her. Do some research how to support her, going forward if she wants to transition. Don't inflict your opinions. You could push her away if you are against.

I read an account of a woman who went along with the pronouns in a kind of "yes yes dear whatever you say" kind of way, rented a cabin in the middle of nowhere and took her child out of school for a few months, spent the time living off grid, hiking, talking, making things. All the time using their preferred pronouns etc. A few weeks in the child told them they weren't so sure anymore. At the point the woman wrote the post on twitter her child had been back to using their old pronouns and name for months. It's not an option for most people to walk away from everyday life like that but it does make you think about how outside influences are affecting children.

I think you give it the least amount of oxygen possible and keep reiterating that her gender feelings are the least interesting thing about her and quite boring really.

I would look at an ASD diagnosis, but don't let her think the two are related. Teens would love the "I said i was trans and my mum thinks that means I must be autistic..." sympathy. Keep the issues separate.

Are Magdalene Burns videos too sweary?

When did young women stop being angry about being treated like second class citizens/sex objects and start deciding that apeing men is the answer?

'I would just shut any talk of "maybe I'm a boy" immediately with " well you're not so deal with it"'

I think this would be my approach too, with some added empathising about how it's perfectly normal to question who you are when you're going through puberty. As you say, experimenting with clothes, hairstyle etc, absolutely fine but you need to hold the line on biological reality. Absolutely no question of changing names or pronouns or talking about 'top surgery' as a possibility.

I can't believe how indulgent some parents are on this issue. That said, I really do feel for you OP, it must be very scary to hear your child talk like this, knowing how much affirmation is out there

As my mum used to say when I was whinging about having to wear a brace, not being beautiful, not having a ‘cool’ name, etc - “tough titty, get on with it”

Really appreciating the responses and will respond in more detail when I can but in brief:

She knows my opinions and always has done - she used to agree with them - I have worked in sex-based charities since my kids were tiny and always explained - in an age-appropriate way - what my work involves and the context within society (again, keeping it appropriate) - I have worked with DV, FGM, county lines victims. There has been fundraising and volunteering along the way and presented to the kids, broadly, as working to help women and children who need support, etc.

I don't indulge any ideas about changing sex, my DD came with me to tie ribbons in support of Maya Forstater, Marion Millar, Milli Hill, JKR - we used to write labels about no one being born in the wrong body and tie them on road signs and lamp posts. We'd buy stickers from Posie Parker's site and put them up together.

then she started secondary school and met the now-best friend. Now 'feelings' matter more than biology and it is all about respect and 'being kind' and she thinks TWAW and would never use that to enter women's spaces, and so on and so on.

But my fear now is less that this will last, and more that the alienation will - that she will detach from her stupid outdated mother and find her echo chamber to live in.

We rowed yesterday, I threw this weeks copy of The Week Junior in her direction and said she should look in the mirror less and widen her perspective, kids in Gaza, etc etc - not my finest moment. But it's so naval-gazey and I hate that. So insular, and frankly boring - your body is your body, deal with it. Told her she is so privileged, can walk and run and get to school independently and take part in lessons, activities, engage in clubs and friendships, what a lot she really has, so she doesn't like her growing breasts? Big deal, first world problem. Then I showed her my self-harm scars from my teenage years and said I know what it's like to hate your body but those feelings aren't forever.

I am just trying to connect with her.

Here are some good resources from therapists Stella O'Malley and Sasha Ayad:

Their YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/@widerlenspod/videos

The book that they've just written for parents just like you: https://www.amazon.co.uk/When-Kids-Say-Theyre-Trans-ebook/dp/B0C5Q276C2