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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Trans Kids Demographics

41 replies

TokyoGhoul · 28/09/2023 15:50

Hi does anyone know of any data on the demographics of trans identifying kids?

I know the data on boys and girls, but is there anything on socioeconomic status and ethinicity?

From my own expereince I suspect this is largely a white middle class university educated family phenonmenon, but I might be wrong on this and just applying my own bias/ experience.

Is it more common in private and grammar shools?

Thanks for pointing me any direction on data or thoughts on this hypothesis.

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IcakethereforeIam · 28/09/2023 15:59

I believe 'looked after' children are over represented. For example there a lots of children claiming trans identities in Blackpool. Which, as an area, is economically deprived and has more than its fair share of children's home. I think former guesthouses could be bought cheaply and relatively easily converted.

I'm sorry this is anecdata, but it might serve as a starting point for looking into it further.

I wonder if a middle class bias, if there is one, is because there is no-one to 'celebrate' or defend the poorer kids?

Lamelie · 28/09/2023 16:00

I think social contagion looms large as well.

RebelliousCow · 28/09/2023 16:03

I recall reading in my local paper about a boy - aged about 14, who started identifying as trans, a few years ago. His father was a super-macho MMA fighter, and lived in a working class estate in the city. I suspected at the time the boy was most likely gay - and for some reason didn't feel he couldn't come out as such. His father was posing for photos with him, though, clearly accepting of his trans identity.

I also observed a trans child ( a boy) trying on girl's shoes in the shoe shop with his mum and Auntie. They didn't seem middle class at all.

Circumferences · 28/09/2023 21:05

Insecure, "misfit" or attention seeking children who spend too much time on the internet. They could come from any demographic.

UsefulChocReindeer · 28/09/2023 21:24

More anecdata: practically every one of my autistic, trans-identifying child's friends are also autistic and transgender. Make of that what you will.

Somewhere along the line I did read that 2/3 of transgender teens were autistic.

FannyBawz · 28/09/2023 21:29

Yep it’s an autism comorbidity. I believe up to 75% if teams kids are autistic - there isn’t enough awareness of this link.

I know two and both are autistic.

Helleofabore · 28/09/2023 21:33

The Cass interim report had some stats. You might find what you are looking for there

https://cass.independent-review.uk/publications/interim-report/

Interim report – Cass Review

https://cass.independent-review.uk/publications/interim-report/

Circumferences · 28/09/2023 21:38

The promotion of gender ideology as a pursuit is definitely a privileged, middle/upper class, Anglosphere affectation, heavily promoted by Northern America (liberal left cohort) and Canada. Heavily accepted by Europe.

TRActivist folk will be generally from white, "liberal left", middle class, economically privileged backgrounds. They're the ones in our universities and HR admin offices promoting the ideology because they know they'll never be on the sharp end of it. (Eg they'll never find themselves in a woman's prison waking up to a bloke with morning wood).
Please recognise that the majority of these activists aren't actually transgender themselves. They simply adhere to the ideology very dogmatically.

People who actually identify as trans, or are transgender as a consequence of the ideology are from all walks of life. Many are vulnerable in different ways, eg existing mental health issues and socioeconomic problems.
Many transpeople hate the direction that the activism is going in, in their name.

The activism seems to attract every extreme homophobic/misogynist out there. (Who knew there were so many).

Trans children as a cohort are victims in this deranged ideology. They're the ones who have been utterly interfered with, not been given a chance to grow in their own timeframe without being told they're wrong in their own body, or wrong to be gender non-conforming.

They've had to sacrifice their future health, become lifelong patients for the benefit of medical corporations, for the benefit of adults around them who are hellbent on proving some sort of pointless point. It's an utter tragedy.

BCCoach · 28/09/2023 21:52

“From my own expereince I suspect this is largely a white middle class university educated family phenonmenon, but I might be wrong on this and just applying my own bias/ experience.”

Yeah, you are wrong. Looked after children (in care and fostered) are significantly over-represented. Sorry if this doesn’t fit your narrative that it’s just attention-seeking middle class prats who are victims of TRAs and social contagion.

https://gendercriticalwoman.blog/2021/05/15/gender-dysphoria-looked-after-children-part-3-u-k-gids/

Gender Dysphoria: Looked after Children. Part 3. U.K. GIDS

Why aren’t child safeguarding organisations expressing concern about how children in Foster Care/Adopted kids are over-represented in Gender Identity Clinics?

https://gendercriticalwoman.blog/2021/05/15/gender-dysphoria-looked-after-children-part-3-u-k-gids/

WhereAreWeNow · 28/09/2023 22:23

That's really interesting about looked after kids. I wasn't aware of that.

caulibutter · 28/09/2023 23:59

More anecdata really but i'm foster carer and the number of trans identifying looked after children I know is off the scale. Lot and lots of girls opting out of being girls. And lots of boys with horrendous pasts and homophobic parents and birth families. It's a social contagion alright, one that is hitting some of the most damaged and disadvantaged kids in our country. Aided and abetted by social workers and local authorities waving that bloody progress flag.

AnnaMagnani · 29/09/2023 09:40

I'd guess there are broadly 2 cohorts:

White Middle class kids - social contagion, autism, be kind parents

Socially deprived kids especially looked after children- lots of attachment disorder, history of abuse, struggles to fit in, neurodiversity again.

RebelliousCow · 29/09/2023 09:46

WhereAreWeNow · 28/09/2023 22:23

That's really interesting about looked after kids. I wasn't aware of that.

Julie bindel wrote an article about. Blackpool has the biggest % of trans identifyng children:

https://unherd.com/2023/01/blackpools-forsaken-children/

Blackpool's forsaken children

Abused girls are choosing to transition

https://unherd.com/2023/01/blackpools-forsaken-children

RebelliousCow · 29/09/2023 09:51

Gender tends to be more heavily pushed in working class communities - and so it would not surprise me if lots of non conforming working class kids decided to rebel by coming out as trans.

AnnaMagnani · 29/09/2023 09:55

Some of us became TERFy because we are autistic adult women. Puberty for autistic girls is absolutely awful.

DH and I are both autistic. I asked him what his Puberty was like- absolutely awesome, all those great hormones.

Mine - hideous pain from periods, weird painful things growing on my chest, mood swings, bitchy girls... the list goes on. Can 100% see how I would have loved a puberty blocker and mastectomy.

StephanieSuperpowers · 29/09/2023 10:00

caulibutter · 28/09/2023 23:59

More anecdata really but i'm foster carer and the number of trans identifying looked after children I know is off the scale. Lot and lots of girls opting out of being girls. And lots of boys with horrendous pasts and homophobic parents and birth families. It's a social contagion alright, one that is hitting some of the most damaged and disadvantaged kids in our country. Aided and abetted by social workers and local authorities waving that bloody progress flag.

I read an article recently about how you meet more perverts when you're poor. Can't find it now. But that would clearly point up a reason why girls in very vulnerable situations might identify out of being female.

AnnaMagnani · 29/09/2023 10:05

Yup. I work with prisoners and if you read about their early lives, lots of them never had a chance as the abuse is multi generational.

puffyisgood · 29/09/2023 10:12

really it's an empirical question, one we don't have the data for, and which would doubtless be complicated by rubbish like people claiming to be 'midway' rather than male or female.

most of the high profile TW's are I suppose upper middle class, but then so are most of the high profile anything.

OvaHere · 29/09/2023 10:38

StephanieSuperpowers · 29/09/2023 10:00

I read an article recently about how you meet more perverts when you're poor. Can't find it now. But that would clearly point up a reason why girls in very vulnerable situations might identify out of being female.

https://4w.pub/you-meet-more-perverts-when-poor/

You Meet More Perverts When You're Poor

The pampered activists running our institutions have no idea what they're unleashing on women.

https://4w.pub/you-meet-more-perverts-when-poor

BCCoach · 29/09/2023 13:44

@AnnaMagnani socially deprived kids are as likely, if not more so, than the m/c kids to fall foul of online social contagion. They are less likely to have their internet usage closely monitored by engaged carers, and will spend more time online as a retreat from the horrors of their real life. It's easy to stumble on a reddit thread and from there fall down a rabbit hole of TRA affirmation.

SpiderMaam · 29/09/2023 13:58

AnnaMagnani · 29/09/2023 09:40

I'd guess there are broadly 2 cohorts:

White Middle class kids - social contagion, autism, be kind parents

Socially deprived kids especially looked after children- lots of attachment disorder, history of abuse, struggles to fit in, neurodiversity again.

I agree with this. It’s two different social contagions at once.

IME the working class kids are often naturally gender non conforming and are transitioning away from family homophobia (these are usually GNC before puberty) and the middle class kids are most likely autistic and struggling with the new social expectations of secondary school and puberty.

Both groups may have experienced genuine, life altering traumas. Both groups are sincerely distressed. Both groups are being let down by the adults who are meant to protect them (sometimes families, sometimes professionals, sometimes both).

AutumnSalad · 29/09/2023 14:09

Firstly I think we have a problem with the data, I saw that the ONS has been criticised for inaccuracy over this.

And for example I listen to a programme about the amount of trans gender people in prisons, it said that this was difficult as on entry a man could say he was a woman, or trans woman, and it would be recorded solely as female sex rather than male biological sex with trans gender.

So that’s a mess.

And another part is that surveys or other reports had selection bias, self selecting people taking part.

The report into the Tavistock Clinic showed some data about those referred, and I think 30% were autistic and high numbers also were from looked after children. This may show that high numbers are trans gender, or it might only show that more of these kids are progressed into medical transition.

It’s so important to know!

Which is frustrating as this is one of my main frustrations with trans ideology and those who take it on board - it plays around with facts, biological facts so we don’t know what people’s journeys or experiences are.

On the ONS site, it says that London had the highest % of those who identified as trans gender. Lowest in south west. Brighton and Hove were highest in populations over 16 years who identified as non binary.

AutumnSalad · 29/09/2023 14:12

Also I think the Tavistock clinic report had a striking rise in teenage girls being referred.

Bosky · 29/09/2023 14:28

TokyoGhoul there seems to be a difference between the kids most likely to express their "trans identity" by superficial means of hair style, clothing, etc. and those who are being medicalised.

"An open letter to Dr Polly Carmichael from a former GIDS clinician"
2019 - Leeds

"I was also shocked by the complexity of referrals. I read many referrals of children who have been sexually abused and many children have witnessed and/or been subjected to domestic violence.

I also felt that was an overrepresentation of the young people who were living in poverty. I had a young person whose family were living within such extreme financial constraints that he considered it a treat to buy a can of pop. I also had another young person who was living in a very complex and unstable arrangement who arrived to sessions in a poor state of hygiene and said that there wasn’t money for hygiene products. How is it ethical to undertake a gender identity assessment with the view to a medical pathway when there are children and young people do not have their most basic needs met?

In terms of complexity I also had on my caseload several young people who declined to communicate verbally or communicated verbally to a very limited extent. I think that at GIDS verbal communication difficulties are often minimised as transmales being afraid to speak because they have a ‘feminine voice’ but in all of these cases I believe that there was something more complex than that going on. Again, it’s very difficult to undertake a gender identity assessment with a young person who struggles to communicate verbally, especially within the time constraints of the service."

https://medium.com/@kirstyentwistle/an-open-letter-to-dr-polly-carmichael-from-a-former-gids-clinician-53c541276b8d

Archived: https://archive.ph/k5vdd

The situation in Canada is the same, although there is also a high proportion of indigenous children being transitioned as they are over-represented in the Foster care system:

"Petition to the Government of Canada"
July 2020

There is enormous evidence suggesting psychologically and emotionally vulnerable children are identifying as transgender at enormously disproportionate rates;

Recent information suggests that Foster children are identifying as transgender at rates 15 to 20 times higher than children not in government care;

Full info:
https://petitions.ourcommons.ca/en/Petition/Details?Petition=e-2443

"“Gender therapy” doctor admits to advising kids to fake being suicidal to get transgender “treatments”
April 2019

"Dr. Wallace Wong…is facing calls for an inquiry into the conduct of his practice. On February 28…Wong spoke at an event hosted by Vancouver Public Library. In a tape of the event obtained by Canadian pro-family group Culture Guard, Wong is heard proudly describing the scope of his children-only “gender therapy” practice, noting that his youngest client is not yet three years old and that he has 501 orphans and foster kids in his local practice.

If true, this indicates Wong has likely used his relationship with the BC Ministry of Children and Family to diagnose more than 10 to 20 percent of local children in government care as needing his “gender therapy,” according to Culture Guard President Kari Simpson.

In Wong’s own words, his practice began in 2010 with just “four clients at the ministry” but in the course of nine years, there was such an enormous surge of need within that population that he now has “more than 500 kids, [with] just the Ministry alone…. So we can imagine the demand of service is soaring…. The phenomenon is happening a lot faster than – than we expected.”

Simpson expressed outrage at this “soaring” demand, claiming Wong was “gender-jacking” vulnerable children from the Ministry and “profiting” handsomely into the bargain.

Wong also had some startling advice for a parent seeking to get a child referred to his program. Although the questioner had not indicated any particular urgency, Wong explained that parents should exaggerate the severity of their child’s condition to their local health offices.

Wong said a suicide threat was an effective means of accomplishing this goal. While Wong framed the matter as the government’s fault and explained to his audience that it is “up to us as advocates” to change the situation, his message could not have been lost on anyone present.

“So what you need is, you know what? Pull a stunt. Suicide, every time, [then] they will give you what you need,” Wong said, adding that gender-dysphoric kids “learn that. They learn it very fast.”

Full article:
https://thebridgehead.ca/2019/04/22/gender-therapy-doctor-admits-to-advising-kids-to-fake-being-suicidal-to-get-transgender-treatments/

In the USA there is a gleaming temple to trans surgery in a Detroit ghetto where they are taking kids off the streets and churning out the icons of the most oppressed: black transwomen.

"Chris Rufo’s new exposé links “transgender empire” back to large-scale medical experiments in a Detroit ghetto"

"Chris explains how over the years, some of the wealthiest people in America have heavily funded the trans movement. But one of the most disturbing elements in Chris’s mini-film involves the medical experiments conducted in a Detroit ghetto, specifically at a place called “The Ruth Ellis Center.” This center is considered the epicenter for transgender “science,” . . ."

https://www.naturalnews.com/2023-07-14-chris-rufos-expose-transgender-empire-medical-experiments.html

As irritating and high profile as the screaming, protesting, middle-class trans activist university students are, it is children living in poverty, vulnerable children, traumatised children, children in care, children with autism and learning difficulties and "proto-gay/lesbian" children the world over who are being medicalised. In Canada and the UK, the tax-payer stumps the bill. In the USA, billionaire philanthropists build and staff clinics and health insurance pays out vast sums per patient when they don't also fund the experimental treatments themselves.