There has been quite a lot of in the past year how women are now choosing to stay single and they rather be alone. Are you actually seeing this in real life?

[ThisWillBeMyDay]

Also there is big talk how women won’t date just any man, women have standards and no woman now NEEDS a man.
I’m not really sure why they push these articles, often times they are total hyperbole too (apperently in 2030, 45% of women aged 25-44 are unmarried and childless. Like not being married and not having kids in your 20’s is even worth saying - nevermind a headline!)

To be clear, I support all of this. Being or staying long term, or whole life, single. Being childfree.
I personally am single and don’t want kids. So definitely not saying anything bad about these news and studies and what-not. I’m just not seeing it in real life.

That being said, I don’t really see this in the real world. Most women still want boyfriends/husbands. So many put with shit (biggest is porn watching, honestly can’t understand how any woman can stay and love a man like this) I could never.

And I’ve been looking for women to be friends with, who have something else than men in mind, they are HARD to find, impossible.
I don’t know one women who isin’t/doesn’t want a relationship and don’t do hook-up’s (sorry, but these women are often times worse than women in relationships, men take so much of their mental space).

Anyway, that was my linger than intented rant.
My question and point was: have you personally seen these ’women are walking away from men’ thing happening?

I've just been trying to persuade the cat in and whilst stood outside did a quick count up both sides of the road. I reckon about 75% of the houses have single people living in them, majority of those have been single for years, not many of those have kids. The other 25% I think about 20% of them are with someone and about 5% I have no clue who lives in them at all.

Maybe certain locations within towns and cities attract single inhabitants more. Knowing where I live, which im not about to divulge, would explain why it's so single person heavy though.

I'm seeing it. In my group of six friends, only two of us are in relationships; the others (all late thirties/early forties) are single and not looking. We are all childless.

I've been seeing it with my friends in the US but the truth of the matter won't be popular. Most of these friends of mine are not happy people. They are lonely. They get deeply upset when a friend meets a person and dates them seriously because they start spending less time with them and even more upset when they have kids.

They are not understanding at all about different people making different life decisions. Or that those decisions affect time management.

I'll get flack for saying this but my married friends are not constantly going on about mental health problems the way my "strong independent" friends do. I'm not trying to be unkind about mental health problems as I've had my own issues a few years ago. But I do think it's a sign that something is off.

It makes me wonder if they're just trying to put on a brave face because they haven't found the right person.

I also find it curious that someone can simultaneously say they are happy being alone but dating simultaneously. Surely the point of dating is that you have some sort of goal of finding a person you hope to fall in love with and commit yourself to even if the goal isn't necessarily to get married or have kids? In which case you might be okay being alone for now but not forever. As the act of dating suggests to me that you aspire to not be alone forever. I talk to a lot of these personality types. They baffle me. Lol.

I'd be really interested in learning about the numbers of men who don't have children, too, but for some reason this is not an interesting topic to discuss.

TBF, it is harder to count. They don't always know, whereas women do tend to notice if they have one.

I know a small number of women who by choice have never had a long term relationship. I know a considerably larger number who have had one, no longer have it, and definitely don't want another. And a lot who, by choice, don't have children - some in relationships, some not. Almost all my friends and colleagues are 40+ (often quite a bit plus) and unlikely to change their minds now.

Surely the point of dating is that you have some sort of goal of finding a person you hope to fall in love with and commit yourself to even if the goal isn't necessarily to get married or have kids?

No, for some people dating someone means just to have a good time for a while with someone you like but don't plan on the relationship actually having legs. Soon as the novelty wears off (or they leave the toilet seat up) you get rid

I don’t think that a U.S. projection of 45% of US women being unmarried and childless by 2030 reflects the number of women choosing to be single as in “rather be alone” or “walking away from men.”

That % is more a measure of the decline of marriage, not a decline in the % of women in long term heterosexual cohabiting relationships.

This is nuts. I’ve never in 55 years heard anyone say or write that women shouldn’t have a university degree.

@Boiledbeetle

I see. Well thank you for shedding light on this issue. I do hope the other person is on the same page that it's not long term! Seems a bit harsh but not my business I suppose. 😅

Pleasure! Not my problem whether they are or not to be perfectly honest though I don't owe them anything.

Of course these days I prefer Tunnocks caramel wafer and a cuppa, which I will be happy to spend the rest of my life being faithful to, although I may have a fling every now and again with a Tunnocks tea cake tho spice things up!

I’m 48 and been single for six years. No men. No sex. I’m just not bothered.

I know a few of us and I don't think any are dating.
We're in a medium-sized town in the south of England. I think we're all quite social.

Indeed.

@Boiledbeetle

That's awful. Why not just be honest and upfront and find a friend with benefits. Dating usually comes with the intent of an end goal of looking for a life partner. You don't have that desire so, unless I am misunderstanding, you are openly admitting to lying to them (whether verbally or by omission) and using them to temporarily meet your emotional and sexual needs by giving them the impression that you want more. Wasting their time and then tossing them out when you get bored of them.

If it was the other way around mumsnet would have a field day.

Pretty heartless in my opinion.

Can't see it and wouldn't want it but each to their own, good for them

Also 'while obviously there will be individual examples of happy singles, happy married, miserably married, miserable singles and everything in-between there have been quite a few different studies that all found overall that single women are the happiest, and married men!

That is definitely right Tokennamechange. I agreed with a lot of your post, SweetBirdsong but this is quite a consistent message across a lot of different studies, including those with samples that are representative of the wider population.

The people who don't know me well would probably describe me as single by choice. That's not true at all. I have tried OLD but with one exception found it was not great for my self esteem to be treated as not good enough.

Single can include such a wide group of people, including people who have been in LTRs that have ended as well as those who have not.

As someone who was in a LTR for more than 25 years and now dating again for first time since early 90’s, the dating game is very different and casual dating without expectations is very much a thing.

Im pretty upfront in that I only really want exclusive but casual and I’m not looking to ever live with a man again. And theatre men who feel the same so it’s fairly common with older people who have been married, want more than a FWB but don’t want a life partner.

If you’re younger and want marriage and kids obviously it’s not the truth that thing but for older people, it’s a perfect scenario for some.

It’s always so interesting hiw different we are.
I could never do casual/fuck buddy thing.
And I would very much like a partner, someone kind, to share and build a life with - no kids.
But I don’t want / like sex / can’t have it, so I have no luck in the dating scene.
No wonder if most only want casual.
Only sex and no love and companion would be worse of both worlds to me personally.
It’s always fascinating to read about people who only want sex, not the companion part. And that makes me wonder how bad are relationships if people don’t want that once they’ve done it before 😃!

Dating these days it seems is just a way to get sex, both men and women appear to want the same thing. Pretty sure both sides know it.

If men want more than casual sex, they should up their game. Same for women, but as we are discussing, fewer women want a relationship especially with someone who wont pull their weight.

Going by the relationship board, men are not upping their game at all.

Nowhere near London (non-UK) but I agree that I don’t know a single woman who would contemplate the male behaviours so often described as normal, if unpalatable, on here.

I’m 51 and have always had a mix of coupled and longterm single by choice friends, most of whom are childfree, though one adopted a daughter. Some of the divorced wouldn’t contemplate another relationship. One has a longterm FWB situation but wouldn’t want more.

@ThisWillBeMyDay

Being exclusive but casual isn’t about having a FWB or casual shag, it’s dating but both having your own lives and not wanting to cohabitate as an endgame.
Ive got friends who have been these relationships gif several years where they both have their own homes and lives but go on dates, spend time together etc and no plans to change that status quo. Maybe it’s an older age group thing but it’s not just about sex, it’s about a companion when it works for both parties.

And not wanting to settle down again is nothing to do with having a bad previous relationship. My marriage was really good other than the last couple of years where we drifted apart but there’s no animosity and my ex is still a really good friend.

It’s maybe just about older women realising they want a different life to the one they grew up thinking was the holy grail and enjoying that sense of freedom.

Recently married at the grand old age of 53. (Not married before or had kids myself). Coincidentally, three sets of friends, also in their 50s, married this year, two couples for the first time too. None of the newlyweds are parents.

Most of my female friends (from cities) have never married or had children. One had a child in her 30s but left her partner when he was small. She's met someone now in her 50s.

Nearly all my single friends have good careers, travel and own their own places. My oldest friend, from our hometown, stayed put and became the primary carer for a parent. She had had a long term dysfunctional relationship in her thirties but nothing since. She doesn't find many opportunities to meet someone. Another also became a carer for parents and lives rurally but has zero interest in meeting anyone.

The majority of my friends, married or not, don't have children. Mostly due to not meeting someone in their fertile years. Significantly, I don't have anyone close who has been through the pain of trying for a baby. My friends seem to fall into the "I didnt meet anyone" category.

I noticed a shift in either expectations or opportunities back in my early 20s because the friends I was making were making different choices to my older sister's friends. Nearly everyone she was friends with (mostly from school) were settling down locally in their 20s (shes 8 years older than me). She also met her life partner at 18. Nearly all my oldest friends (those I met after school in my early 20s) I met whilst travelling. When I came back to the UK, in my mid 20s, I moved to London and fell into a media career - which can lead to quite a Peter Pan way of life. I wonder if that's why our life choices became so starkly different? Like finds like. Its interesting to read that there is a trend towards child-free single living in light of my experience. I do think it's sad. Whilst my 30s, in particular, were absolutely brilliant in many respects - central London garden flat, well paid job, exciting social life - I was also lonely. I was never driven by the need to have a child but I did wish I had someone to share my life with. (That happened, quite unexpectedly, in my 40s)

But most of my experiences and those of my friends, who are broadly Gen X, happened before social media took hold and I'm sure our online existence is having a profound effect on relationships, intimacy, expectations and psychosocial development.

It’s not that new. Some women have always chosen to remain single and childless. There have been such in every generation of my family, as far back as I can go. Nuns, nurses, teachers, housekeepers, carers for older relatives, women who were simply disinclined to marry and who had the means to stay single. Some stayed in professions that women were required to leave if married (and potentially mothers, in times when motherhood and work weren’t compatible). Some were quite reasonably afraid of childbirth, in times when it was more dangerous than it is now (though given recent maternity scandals, perhaps we’re a little too complacent). Some probably didn’t like the idea of sex, or disliked and mistrusted men, and who can blame them?
We like to think that modern women, liberated, enfranchised and educated, are different and far better off than their grandmothers and great grandmothers, but I wonder how true that is. I see women pressured on women all sides to be the perfect working mother, caught up in a spiral of family related consumerism, full of anxiety for and over-protective of their children, and obsessively concerned with personal appearance and the desire to preserve an unnaturally youthful appearance well into middle age.
In the spirit of two of my aunts and many great and great-great aunts, I’ve personally avoided any permanent relationships for the last forty years, and am very glad of it.

In the spirit of two of my aunts and many great and great-great aunts, I’ve personally avoided any permanent relationships for the last forty years, and am very glad of it.

Nodding in agreement with every word of your post, @borntobequiet . This is me, as well. (Have just realised it IS forty years for me, or as near as).

Those of my friends who are 60 plus, single and looking tell me they have difficulty finding men who are reasonably healthy, undertake self care are solvent, clean, addiction free or not porn addled.
In other words, as said upthread, they are not of the same calibre.
Also at this age men often seem to be seeking a “nurse with a purse”

Most of my older friends don't want to disturb their calm, free, well ordered lives. If DH wasn't here, it is unlikely that I would either.