Woman denied cancer treatment for "transphobic" views and discharged from future care

[HootyMcBooby76]

Have we discussed this?
Apologies if so.
Woman Accuses Hospital of Denying Cancer Treatment Over Transphobic Comment (newsweek.com)

So the mantra is LITERALLY accept this ideology or be prepared to die.
And THEY have the gall to call us (insert word for a member of the far-right National Socialist German Workers' Party).

This is why healthcare and this ideology should be kept very far apart. Healthcare is no longer neutral and unbiased.
Believe or die.

Whatever is still being done to women, it is still not comparable to the slavery of Black people in the Americas.

Not as a sort of competition, but due to fundamental differences that are hard for many white people to grasp.

So, taking your example of rape as an atrocity that women face.

There is a fundamental difference between rape as a crime occurring as a sort of lottery random strike on free women living their lives and rape as a state sanctioned, legalised part of a slave breeding program that is done to all women of a certain race.

Then when you consider the fact that slavery itself was much much more than legalised and socially encouraged rape…

There is no comparison.

Absolutely yes. I don't ever deny that race matters.

@MillicentBystandr

There is a fundamental difference between rape as a crime occurring as a sort of lottery random strike on free women living their lives and rape as a state sanctioned, legalised part of a slave breeding program that is done to all women of a certain race.

Without in any way mimising what was done to Black women under slavery, or indeed to Black people under slavery, I think you are wrong to characterise other rapes as "a sort of lottery random strike on free women living their lives".

There are "free" women who live in fear of their husbands, "free" women who have been trafficked for sex, "free" women who are raped as a weapon of war, "free" women married young with little agency to men who rape them.

These rapes may not be part of a slave breeding program, which is undeniably abhorrent, but they are part of the apparatus by which men dominate women all over the world and they should not be shrugged off.

Why do people always talk about slavery like it was a thing of the past? There are more slaves now than ever before.

Something like 12 million Africans were enslaved over more than 400 years with the transatlantic slave trade. I read the other day that there's nearly 8 million in India alone today!

And sadly African countries are some of the worst offenders nowadays.

No one is shrugging off anything.
Don’t compare the incomparable is all I am saying.

In short it's a wholesale misrepresentation of history. Women as a sex-based class have never been given a break, not even a single iota of anything resembling a break. To this very day they can very much be considered second class citizens. I can't see anything / anyone in the thread disputing that. However it does an enormous amount of damage to specific groups of women to paint the struggles of women as a 'collective' fight in which we're all in together.

@MillicentBystandr I think that unless you experience racism as well as sexism it is difficult to grasp how completly different they are.

What I don't understand is why people who don't experience racism feel that they are in a position to argue about this with black women. I wonder if white women who do this believe us to be liars or unable to understand our own experience in the world.

Firstly, I'm still not sure what "nefarious" thing I'm being accused of. I believe differently to you, yes. But "nefarious"?

Secondly and more importantly, I can't see how your last sentence follows from the previous. Am I supposed to ignore the suffering and opression of other women if they don't happen to be close enough socially or culturally to me? Am I supposed to ignore the suffering and oppression of women who are socially or culturally close to me because other women have it worse? Should we not notice that we have certain types of experiences and indeed oppressions in common because there are also differences?

You are clear about what you think should not be done, but what should be done instead?

@NewNameNigel

What I don't understand is why people who don't experience racism feel that they are in a position to argue about this with black women. I wonder if white women who do this believe us to be liars or unable to understand our own experience in the world.

Am I one of these women? If so, can I answer that?

I'm not sure @FlirtsWithRhinos
If you don't experience racism yourself but feel qualified to argue with those that do about it then yes.

We all know how frustrating it is when men draw false equiviliancies with their experiences about sexism and then double down on it if people who actually experience sexism respond. White people often do the same thing with race. Given that 82% of the population is white compared with around 50% male can you understand why it's exhausting for black women to hear?

Yes. FWIW I rarely talk (and definitely don't argue) about racism not because I don't care or believe about it, but exactly because I think my role is to listen.

I've always taken exactly the perspective you gave...that people who experience racism experience it as pervasively and structurally as women experience sexism, and people who don't experience it miss it happening as blindly as men (and frankly, a lot of women) miss sexism, especially the ingrained, cultural, "no word for water" stuff. And I also recognise that as a product of my culture, I'm not free of the ingrained cultural stuff. All I can do is try consciously to recognise it and reject it.

I don't think I am one of the women you were thinking of - at least I hope not.

It was a fucking flag. Change the word ‘trans’ for another minority group and see how vile and inappropriate she was.

Just bloody no need for it.

In a fucking doctor's office. I don't want to see a Trump flag either. In the US:

Doctors are prohibited from refusing treatment only if their decision is based on some form of illegal discrimination. These discriminations include age, gender, sexual orientation, race, nationality, or religion.

Ah ok so being offensive to trans is ok! Have views by all means but really? She’s being treated for bc and she acts a twat over a flag?!

I think Trump hates Trans too. And same sex relationships, and Mexicans. You might like a Trump flag?

I said I wouldn't want to see a Trump flag. Apparently you missed that.

Why though? Why change the word to another minority group?

I don't really want to see any political or religious or ideological flags in hospitals, doctors' surgeries, banks, schools, because they are invariably part of some unregulated EDI exercise that draws people in without their agreement.

Pointing that out isn't a crime deserving of punishment.

I agree. I try to explain it. Many just don’t get it. A few do and that gives me hope 🫤

Pointing out you don’t want to see a flag is ok.

It’s when Barbera went on to compare the trans flag to a Nazi flag that she crossed the line into anti-Semitism. Why? Because minimising the Holocaust to make it comparable to the fear of about “what might happen” if TW are in single sex spaces is a form of Holocaust denial- the form that says what happened is an exaggeration.

Barbera’s comment should be viewed as highly offensive by anyone reading it and it is deserving of being denied service by a private health clinic in a country where healthcare is not a human right.

No flags, no religious symbolism in a hc environment. Simple, cheap, inoffensive and environmentally friendly.

Pointing out you don't want to see a flag is fine.

Calling it a Nazi flag is unacceptable. Ranting at your doctor demanding he remove it is unacceptable. Making snide, nasty comments about "did I hurt the trans persons feelings" on the phone is unacceptable.

Some of these may actually be crimes. And the medical practice has decided that it means she is not someone they can deal with. Even the NHS reserves the right to refuse to treat you if you are abusive to staff.

The state of Oregon recently amended its constitution.

“It is the obligation of the state to ensure that every resident of Oregon has access to cost-effective, clinically appropriate and affordable health care as a fundamental right.”

Regardless of whether some find this woman's statements offensive, she has a constitutional right to health care.

And she can still access it at any one of the other three health care systems in town that I listed upthread.

No, she cannot. She has been dismissed from all OHSU affiliated health services. It says so right in the letter.

OHSU is one of four independent private healthcare providers in the area that do cancer treatment. She has three others she can toddle off to.