Page 4 | Bud Light and Dylan Mulvaney

Leafstamp · 2023-08-03T18:45:03+00:00

Loads of news outlets reporting this story : [[https://www.bbc.com/news/business-66398296 Bud Light boycott over trans influencer Dylan Mulvaney hits beer giant's sales - BBC News]] BBC being its usual self and calling him 'Ms' 🙄 But good that companies might start learning the financial cost of promoting this insulting nonsense.

PTSDBarbiegirl · 04/08/2023 15:55

Flickersy · 03/08/2023 21:26

I'm not really comfortable with boycotting a brand just because they used a trans person in an advert for beer. Anyone can drink beer. Anyone can advertise it.

I think it verges into transphobia if you're celebrating a brand doing less well because they used a trans person. Are we saying no trans people are ever allowed to appear in advertisements? I hope not.

If you're a woman then I strongly advise you learn a bit more about why there is a backlash against adult males with penis and testicles who dress up as 'girls' whilst celebrating and pushing sex based stereotypes, ridiculing females & female biology and cheerleading for biological women to be reduced and their rights curbed. DM was a male stand up comedian who got lucky when a bunch of fools bought his trans shtick and monetised his apparant 'transition'. DM is a parody and an extreme misogynist.

SuperNewMe · 04/08/2023 16:04

Flickersy · 03/08/2023 21:26

I'm not really comfortable with boycotting a brand just because they used a trans person in an advert for beer. Anyone can drink beer. Anyone can advertise it.

I think it verges into transphobia if you're celebrating a brand doing less well because they used a trans person. Are we saying no trans people are ever allowed to appear in advertisements? I hope not.

Completely agree. What exactly has she done wrong, I mean apart from being trans and appearing in an advert advertising beer that is?!
It doesn't sit right, just like people saying they were going to boycott Co OP for daring to have someone trans in an advert about strawberries.
Can people who are trans not appear in adverts or something?

Flickersy · 04/08/2023 16:05

PTSDBarbiegirl · 04/08/2023 15:55

If you're a woman then I strongly advise you learn a bit more about why there is a backlash against adult males with penis and testicles who dress up as 'girls' whilst celebrating and pushing sex based stereotypes, ridiculing females & female biology and cheerleading for biological women to be reduced and their rights curbed. DM was a male stand up comedian who got lucky when a bunch of fools bought his trans shtick and monetised his apparant 'transition'. DM is a parody and an extreme misogynist.

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I am a woman who has been around on FWR for a loooong time under one name or another thank you very much.

SuperNewMe · 04/08/2023 16:10

Flickersy · 04/08/2023 16:05

I am a woman who has been around on FWR for a loooong time under one name or another thank you very much.

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Same 🙂

ReleasetheCrackHen · 04/08/2023 16:13

PTSDBarbiegirl · 04/08/2023 15:55

If you're a woman then I strongly advise you learn a bit more about why there is a backlash against adult males with penis and testicles who dress up as 'girls' whilst celebrating and pushing sex based stereotypes, ridiculing females & female biology and cheerleading for biological women to be reduced and their rights curbed. DM was a male stand up comedian who got lucky when a bunch of fools bought his trans shtick and monetised his apparant 'transition'. DM is a parody and an extreme misogynist.

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It’s one thing to be against a message but quite another to hate a person you think is a messenger.

DM is just a person who happened to get a personalised beer can and then share it on SM. Something millions of people do every day- post a sponsored post that is.

Why make a scapegoat out of them or the beer brand? So trans people aren’t allowed to be sponsored by any brands for anything?

And what can a Belgian brewing company have to do with or can do about “adult males with penis and testicles who dress up as 'girls' whilst celebrating and pushing sex based stereotypes, ridiculing females & female biology and cheerleading for biological women to be reduced and their rights curbed”?

Plbrookes · 04/08/2023 16:21

ReleasetheCrackHen · 04/08/2023 15:40

I didn’t directly compare the drop in sales by volume to a drop in sales by revenue like you did by doing silly line drawing and thinking they are “the same.”

I used the drop in sales by volume as an illustrative example of how Bud Light beer sales have been on a steady downturn for a dozen years reducing market share as consumers have increasingly gone to buying craft beer.

Increased prices have offset some of the decrease in sales by volume. But they are a plaster over the serious problem of mass produced beer losing market share.

I don’t know what you mean by “can’t have it both ways” ? It’s blatantly obvious that a drop in sales by volume cannot be directly compared to a drop in sales by revenue. They’re two completely different calculations.

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This is twice on the same thread you've misrepresented the facts and then claimed innocence when you've been called out. You used the reduction in volume of sales between 2008 and 2020 to support your claim that the reduction in sales post-DM was merely the continuation of the long-term trend. I pointed out the figures you yourself were using indicated a much slower trend decrease than the decrease post-DM and you are now arguing that you can't use those figures as a comparison! So why did you do that yourself???

dogsweetdog · 04/08/2023 16:32

I hate the way these articles refer to anyone who's GC as "the right". I am definitely not part of "the right"!

ReleasetheCrackHen · 04/08/2023 16:58

Plbrookes · 04/08/2023 16:21

This is twice on the same thread you've misrepresented the facts and then claimed innocence when you've been called out. You used the reduction in volume of sales between 2008 and 2020 to support your claim that the reduction in sales post-DM was merely the continuation of the long-term trend. I pointed out the figures you yourself were using indicated a much slower trend decrease than the decrease post-DM and you are now arguing that you can't use those figures as a comparison! So why did you do that yourself???

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I haven’t “misrepresented facts” at all. The drop in sales, as measured both by volume and by revenue, is part of a larger downward trend in sales of Bud Light beer.

I pointed out the figures you yourself were using indicated a much slower trend decrease than the decrease post-DM
You misused the data points I gave you. I gave you data points on millions of barrels of beer sold in 2008 vs 2020 and you tried to argue that it was a slower decline than a % drop in sales by $$$ in revenues for one quarter. You did that by ignoring the fact that you can’t directly compare millions of barrels sold to $$$ of revenue, and you lazily assumed that the downward trend was linear, which is not the case IRL.

you are now arguing that you can't use those figures as a comparison! So why did you do that yourself???
I didn’t directly compare them, you did. I used barrels of beer sold as an illustrative example of the fact that the downward trend in sales of Bud Light has been going on for a dozen years.

Plbrookes · 04/08/2023 18:04

ReleasetheCrackHen · 04/08/2023 16:58

I haven’t “misrepresented facts” at all. The drop in sales, as measured both by volume and by revenue, is part of a larger downward trend in sales of Bud Light beer.

I pointed out the figures you yourself were using indicated a much slower trend decrease than the decrease post-DM
You misused the data points I gave you. I gave you data points on millions of barrels of beer sold in 2008 vs 2020 and you tried to argue that it was a slower decline than a % drop in sales by $$$ in revenues for one quarter. You did that by ignoring the fact that you can’t directly compare millions of barrels sold to $$$ of revenue, and you lazily assumed that the downward trend was linear, which is not the case IRL.

you are now arguing that you can't use those figures as a comparison! So why did you do that yourself???
I didn’t directly compare them, you did. I used barrels of beer sold as an illustrative example of the fact that the downward trend in sales of Bud Light has been going on for a dozen years.

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Hilarious - you're criticising me for misusing the figures to perform a comparison when it was YOU who was doing it. I caught you dishonestly misrepresenting a chart earlier and now you're admitting you were using sales data misleadingly.

QueenHippolyta · 04/08/2023 18:36

DM is a certified creep, playing a misanthropic parody and saying that's a woman. His Nike ad was insulting.

Why couldn't Bud Lite hire an actual woman,
how about fab Riley Gaines , if they wanted to appeal to a wider, younger market?

FrippEnos · 04/08/2023 19:09

QueenHippolyta · 04/08/2023 18:36

DM is a certified creep, playing a misanthropic parody and saying that's a woman. His Nike ad was insulting.

Why couldn't Bud Lite hire an actual woman,
how about fab Riley Gaines , if they wanted to appeal to a wider, younger market?

because Riley Gaines is being portrayed as right wing if not far right.

ReleasetheCrackHen · 04/08/2023 20:44

Plbrookes · 04/08/2023 18:04

Hilarious - you're criticising me for misusing the figures to perform a comparison when it was YOU who was doing it. I caught you dishonestly misrepresenting a chart earlier and now you're admitting you were using sales data misleadingly.

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Sorry, but you are thoroughly confused.

You didn’t catch me using a chart “misleadingly”.
You accused me of implying the chart was a chart of sales which basically told me you hadn’t even bothered to open it as it is clearly labelled as a chart of share price or bothered to read the quote history as that would have shown you that my original post wasn’t about sales, it was about the financial cost to the company. A poster responded challenging me and said essentially it had to have had a financial cost to the company because sales of bud light dropped blah blah. I then responded showing the financial health of the company was absolutely fine as I had originally posted.

I also haven’t used sales data “misleadingly” there is nothing misleading about stating that this drop is part of a larger downward trend and then posting concrete data points that evidence the larger downward trend. I’ve found it in picture form for you. See, it goes down like I said. Perhaps what is misleading is you insisting I’m wrong about the existence of this downward trend, which you have not and cannot substantiate at all.

oh, and back to the OP’s point on the financial cost, AB’s revenues from the boycott 2nd quarter of this year were 7.2% higher than they were second quarter of last year rising to $15.1bn so an estimated loss in Bud Light sales of $400m is nothing to them. Especially when you consider that Modelo Especiale went up on sales…which AB also owns! It’s not much of a boycott if you are doing the equivalent of boycotting Diet Coke and drinking Fanta instead.

Plbrookes · 04/08/2023 20:59

ReleasetheCrackHen · 04/08/2023 20:44

Sorry, but you are thoroughly confused.

You didn’t catch me using a chart “misleadingly”.
You accused me of implying the chart was a chart of sales which basically told me you hadn’t even bothered to open it as it is clearly labelled as a chart of share price or bothered to read the quote history as that would have shown you that my original post wasn’t about sales, it was about the financial cost to the company. A poster responded challenging me and said essentially it had to have had a financial cost to the company because sales of bud light dropped blah blah. I then responded showing the financial health of the company was absolutely fine as I had originally posted.

I also haven’t used sales data “misleadingly” there is nothing misleading about stating that this drop is part of a larger downward trend and then posting concrete data points that evidence the larger downward trend. I’ve found it in picture form for you. See, it goes down like I said. Perhaps what is misleading is you insisting I’m wrong about the existence of this downward trend, which you have not and cannot substantiate at all.

oh, and back to the OP’s point on the financial cost, AB’s revenues from the boycott 2nd quarter of this year were 7.2% higher than they were second quarter of last year rising to $15.1bn so an estimated loss in Bud Light sales of $400m is nothing to them. Especially when you consider that Modelo Especiale went up on sales…which AB also owns! It’s not much of a boycott if you are doing the equivalent of boycotting Diet Coke and drinking Fanta instead.

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No, you are not telling the truth (again). On page 1 of this thread Louloulouenna said "Bud light sales dropped a whopping 23% in the wake of the Dylan Mulvaney endorsement, one of the biggest drops ever recorded by a major brand and far more dramatic than the continuation of a downward trend."

You replied with "The data doesn’t match your description. This [the chart] was posted by another MN on the other thread who agrees with me.

"The red arrow points to the drop after the DM launch. It’s not whopping, biggest ever or even remotely a tad more dramatic than the downward trend. In fact, if you had never heard of DM and a boycott, you would be hard pressed to locate any evidence of a boycott."

You might think you can get away by claiming you never meant to imply that the chart showed sales. Anyone who read your reply knows that that's not true.

You're trying to misrepresent what I'm saying too. Going to invent a quote where I denied there is a downward trend in Bud Light sales? That would be about the standard of honesty people expect from you now. Appalling.

ReleasetheCrackHen · 04/08/2023 22:27

Plbrookes · 04/08/2023 20:59

No, you are not telling the truth (again). On page 1 of this thread Louloulouenna said "Bud light sales dropped a whopping 23% in the wake of the Dylan Mulvaney endorsement, one of the biggest drops ever recorded by a major brand and far more dramatic than the continuation of a downward trend."

You replied with "The data doesn’t match your description. This [the chart] was posted by another MN on the other thread who agrees with me.

"The red arrow points to the drop after the DM launch. It’s not whopping, biggest ever or even remotely a tad more dramatic than the downward trend. In fact, if you had never heard of DM and a boycott, you would be hard pressed to locate any evidence of a boycott."

You might think you can get away by claiming you never meant to imply that the chart showed sales. Anyone who read your reply knows that that's not true.

You're trying to misrepresent what I'm saying too. Going to invent a quote where I denied there is a downward trend in Bud Light sales? That would be about the standard of honesty people expect from you now. Appalling.

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You have neglected to note that I first posted this, not in reply to anyone other than the OP:

“ReleasetheCrackHen · Yesterday 20:25
It’s all spin. The boycott isn’t affecting anything with Bud Light. It’s been on a steady decline in popularity since 2008. The recent drop is in line with that trend line. There’s been no additional financial cost to the company Anhauser-Busch as it’s one of over 100 brands of beer they sell.”

(Please note, I do not once mention sales)

Then I was tagged and this reply to my first post was written:
“Louloulouenna · Yesterday 20:48
@ReleasetheCrackHen Bud light sales dropped a whopping 23% in the wake of the Dylan Mulvaney endorsement, one of the biggest drops ever recorded by a major brand and far more dramatic than the continuation of a downward trend. Sales of other light beers have risen to compensate as customers switched brands.”

(See that? She inserted sales as a bit of whataboutery to deflect from my core point, that there’s been no additional cost to AB. I then brought the conversation back on the track of my post which was on the theme of it’s not made a financial difference when I replied back to her:)

“ReleasetheCrackHen · Yesterday 21:13
The data doesn’t match your description. This was posted by another MN on the other thread who agrees with me.

The red arrow points to the drop after the DM launch. It’s not whopping, biggest ever or even remotely a tad more dramatic than the downward trend. In fact, if you had never heard of DM and a boycott, you would be hard pressed to locate any evidence of a boycott.”

Not once did I write the word “sales” in either of my posts. Not once. So of course I was not “implying” or “meaning sales” it was Lou Lou that did a whataboutery on sales, which I ignored.

I am utterly fed up with your seeing “sales” in my posts when it was not said nor was it implied. You inferred it by not reading all the quote history and confusing me with Lou Lou. Even when Lou Lou claimed my graph was “unlabelled” I corrected her as it is clearly labelled to be the stock value of the company - the usual measure of whether a company has suffered a big financial hit, not the sales figures for one quarter in one of 14 countries for one of over 400 brands a a trillion $ company sells FFS.

ReleasetheCrackHen · 04/08/2023 22:37

donquixotedelamancha · 04/08/2023 09:13

The axes definitely aren't labelled.

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Yes they are. The x axis is calendar years, and the y axis is share price in $. The title of the chart in Annhauser-Busch InBev. It is clearly a stock price chart.

SuperNewMe · 04/08/2023 22:41

QueenHippolyta · 04/08/2023 18:36

DM is a certified creep, playing a misanthropic parody and saying that's a woman. His Nike ad was insulting.

Why couldn't Bud Lite hire an actual woman,
how about fab Riley Gaines , if they wanted to appeal to a wider, younger market?

Why is Dylan a creep?
What are you basing that on?
With the repeated use of his and seemingly getting upset at someone trans "not being a real woman" I can take a guess...

PorcelinaV · 04/08/2023 23:04

What are you basing that on?

He certainly acted out a ridiculous caricature of a woman. Just watch his videos.

https://youtube.com/shorts/FttyV9IEzlc

https://youtube.com/shorts/L9yKdqhDa3k

As for why the boycott was successful, I think it's part conservatives are unhappy about what they see as companies taking sides in the culture war.

And maybe part, yes, "homophobia", as they branded themselves as, "queer beer". A lot of beer drinkers aren't going to like that image I suspect.

Before you continue to YouTube

https://youtube.com/shorts/FttyV9IEzlc?si=HfTTmdmTyyrmvONH

ReleasetheCrackHen · 04/08/2023 23:07

You're trying to misrepresent what I'm saying too. Going to invent a quote where I denied there is a downward trend in Bud Light sales? That would be about the standard of honesty people expect from you now. Appalling.

Well, as I just posted the true & complete record, we have now seen that you have misrepresented what I have said. You haven’t invented a quote, but you’ve omitted a quote/post of mine and then edited another post by deleting where I was tagged (@) to curate the appearance of a conversation starting with LouLou when in fact, I started it with my first post. All to misrepresent this whole “sales” confusion you have been labouring under as somehow being all my fault.

Is it that hard to just admit you skimmed the thread too fast and had the wrong end of the stick?

Louloulouenna · 04/08/2023 23:43

It is beyond parody for anyone to argue against the reality that the Dylan Mulvaney tie up has been anything other than disastrous for Bud Light, either in terms of sales or brand value. But then I guess if you’re willing to play along with the fiction that Dylan Mulvaney is a woman then reality isn’t your thing.

SuperNewMe · 05/08/2023 01:20

PorcelinaV · 04/08/2023 23:04

What are you basing that on?

He certainly acted out a ridiculous caricature of a woman. Just watch his videos.

https://youtube.com/shorts/FttyV9IEzlc

https://youtube.com/shorts/L9yKdqhDa3k

As for why the boycott was successful, I think it's part conservatives are unhappy about what they see as companies taking sides in the culture war.

And maybe part, yes, "homophobia", as they branded themselves as, "queer beer". A lot of beer drinkers aren't going to like that image I suspect.

He certainly acted out a ridiculous caricature of a woman. Just watch his videos.
We're obviously going to have to disagree as I don't see trans women as mocking me.
I just don't. Each to their own. No amount of someone else identifying as a woman will make me any less of one.

FlirtsWithRhinos · 05/08/2023 01:35

ReleasetheCrackHen · 03/08/2023 21:34

Same here. It’s so weird to have the attitude that if a trans person is in an ad that it’s ‘insulting nonsense.’

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Trans identities require belief that men and women have the same bodies but different minds. In the light of both the ongoing belittlement and marginalisation of female people because of cultural stereotypes about how woman think and act, and the ongoing abuse of female people by male because of their sexed bodies, I find that breathtakingly sexist and offensive.

I have no issue with gender non conformity. Generally I think that's great as long as it's aligned to sex reality. Going further, I don't think it's even possible to be gender non-conforming and trans since the whole point of trans is to conform to some pre-existing idea of gender, albeit one more traditionally associated with the other sex.

I think one of the great tragedies of 21st century genderism is that it took the acceptance and experimentation that was blooming towards the end of the twentieth gender and turned it right back into genderised boxes and labels.

So in general I'm not likely to warm to a brand that chooses a transgender figurehead, any more than I would one that chooses a mens rights activist or a big game hunter, because they stand for something I believe is regressive and harmful.

But a trans woman (or man) who said "no, I'm not a woman (or man), I'm a man (or woman) who wants to adopt the cultural constructions of the opposite sex but that doesn't mean I am the opposite sex nor that I expect to have the rights of the opposite sex, it just means those cultural constructions really had nothing to do with sex in the first place" - that person I can see myself respecting.

duc748 · 05/08/2023 01:41

Just that, exactly.

PorcelinaV · 05/08/2023 02:12

SuperNewMe · 05/08/2023 01:20

He certainly acted out a ridiculous caricature of a woman. Just watch his videos.
We're obviously going to have to disagree as I don't see trans women as mocking me.
I just don't. Each to their own. No amount of someone else identifying as a woman will make me any less of one.

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So what if a white person claimed to identify as black, and whether they are being genuine about that or not, they then play off stereotypes to do a ridiculous caricature of a black person in videos they post.

They aren't mocking black people, because they claim to identify as one?

"Day 1 of being black" would be fine as a video?

Plbrookes · 05/08/2023 07:18

ReleasetheCrackHen · 04/08/2023 22:27

You have neglected to note that I first posted this, not in reply to anyone other than the OP:

“ReleasetheCrackHen · Yesterday 20:25
It’s all spin. The boycott isn’t affecting anything with Bud Light. It’s been on a steady decline in popularity since 2008. The recent drop is in line with that trend line. There’s been no additional financial cost to the company Anhauser-Busch as it’s one of over 100 brands of beer they sell.”

(Please note, I do not once mention sales)

Then I was tagged and this reply to my first post was written:
“Louloulouenna · Yesterday 20:48
@ReleasetheCrackHen Bud light sales dropped a whopping 23% in the wake of the Dylan Mulvaney endorsement, one of the biggest drops ever recorded by a major brand and far more dramatic than the continuation of a downward trend. Sales of other light beers have risen to compensate as customers switched brands.”

(See that? She inserted sales as a bit of whataboutery to deflect from my core point, that there’s been no additional cost to AB. I then brought the conversation back on the track of my post which was on the theme of it’s not made a financial difference when I replied back to her:)

“ReleasetheCrackHen · Yesterday 21:13
The data doesn’t match your description. This was posted by another MN on the other thread who agrees with me.

The red arrow points to the drop after the DM launch. It’s not whopping, biggest ever or even remotely a tad more dramatic than the downward trend. In fact, if you had never heard of DM and a boycott, you would be hard pressed to locate any evidence of a boycott.”

Not once did I write the word “sales” in either of my posts. Not once. So of course I was not “implying” or “meaning sales” it was Lou Lou that did a whataboutery on sales, which I ignored.

I am utterly fed up with your seeing “sales” in my posts when it was not said nor was it implied. You inferred it by not reading all the quote history and confusing me with Lou Lou. Even when Lou Lou claimed my graph was “unlabelled” I corrected her as it is clearly labelled to be the stock value of the company - the usual measure of whether a company has suffered a big financial hit, not the sales figures for one quarter in one of 14 countries for one of over 400 brands a a trillion $ company sells FFS.

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So you're admitting you said "The boycott isn’t affecting anything with Bud Light. It’s been on a steady decline in popularity since 2008. The recent drop is in line with that trend line." But you weren't talking about sales! Your chosen measure of Bud Light's popularity is the share price of the company that owns it despite the brand contributing only a small proportion of the company's revenue. Is that right? I wouldn't like to misrepresent you. Honesty is SO important. Isn't it?

Plbrookes · 05/08/2023 07:22

ReleasetheCrackHen · 04/08/2023 23:07

You're trying to misrepresent what I'm saying too. Going to invent a quote where I denied there is a downward trend in Bud Light sales? That would be about the standard of honesty people expect from you now. Appalling.

Well, as I just posted the true & complete record, we have now seen that you have misrepresented what I have said. You haven’t invented a quote, but you’ve omitted a quote/post of mine and then edited another post by deleting where I was tagged (@) to curate the appearance of a conversation starting with LouLou when in fact, I started it with my first post. All to misrepresent this whole “sales” confusion you have been labouring under as somehow being all my fault.

Is it that hard to just admit you skimmed the thread too fast and had the wrong end of the stick?

Is it too hard for you to admit that twice on this thread you've tried to mislead people by misrepresenting statistics? Evidently so. Unfortunately for you, there are people like me who keep an eye out for that sort of thing and won't be slow to call you out. Just a helpful tip.