Barbie

[h1d1ng1npla1ns1ght]

I’m so sick of having to say “no I’m not seeing it”, “but you’re a feminist, you know it’s a feminist movie!” “I’m not that kind of feminist.” I don’t care about barbie and I don’t think it’s an appropriate medium for a feminist message, even ironically. I’m sure it’s a good movie, I’m sure it’s very feminist FOR a barbie movie. I have no interest in it. I’ve been called a bad feminist for not seeing a movie about a symbol of female oppression and body dysmorphia. I don’t care if “barbie can do anything she wants”, I’m a real woman in the real world and I can barely walk down the street safely. I don’t care if they have a slightly overweight barbie, a disabled barbie, a doctor/lawyer/farmer barbie, it’s not good enough. I have no desire to hear a feminist message from barbie’s mouth, nor defend my feminism against it.
I get that for some people it’s just a movie about a doll and they don’t care, that’s fine. But it means something actively negative to me. Can anyone either commiserate or help me to come around to the idea?

Sorry, hadn't noticed the bit I copied had links.

I've seen it, loved it, more importantly watched the most important women in my life, my 15+17 year old nieces walk out feeling empowered and feeling seen. That's all I needed from the movie. Don't know if you are on TikTok but it has thousands of women making changes to their lives since watching the movie. Putting themselves first and men second. It's fantastic.

@Cranberriesandtea I'm surprised they felt empowered, as much as I liked the film it left leave me feeling powerLESS tbh! Agree to the seen bit.

@IcakethereforeIam not sure what a nef is but I didn't notice anything about transgenderism in the film unless there was some casting that went over my head, all the Barbies looked like biological women to me.

In what way did you leave feeling powerless?

@Twonewcats it shows the flaws of the patriarchy and that's the reality we are living in, it was funny because of all the jokes about the male heavy leadership, "undercurrent of violence" in the air, America's speech etc, we can laugh at the ironic jokes, but it's the world we live in....and are stuck in.

@kikigen Nef is the tw who played a Doctor Barbie, I believe. Anyway my post was a derail about Mattel rather than the film, so apologies.

The gender neutral ones are Mattel but not Barbie brand. The transgender one is a Laverne Cox edition Barbie.

https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2019/sep/25/barbie-maker-gender-neutral-dolls-release

https://www.bbc.com/news/business-61596845

I think the article writing "a Nef" is a typo, it should just be "casting of Nef", who played doctor barbie.

@IcakethereforeIam oh I didn't even realise, I was pleased they didn't make any of the dialogue "inclusive" it felt very woman focussed in that regard, you see so many transgender characters show horned into tv series these days, I didn't know about the casting though, I don't know who they are.

*shoe

I'd see it for Ryan alone.

<not the point.>

The sindy horses were more realistic though I did lust after and get a barbie palomino. Loved all the tack.

Still have them and was ferocious with Dh when he suggested we hand them to the girls next door. Our boys now have them but can't play with them

<still not the point>

Hmm, fair enough. Although there's a lot of SM posts from women/girls who are standing up for themselves now that they've really become aware of the shit we often put up with

@Twonewcats yeah that's why I understand the "being seen" element, it's important to shine a light on it because so many people, men and women, live in ignorance over it all, but it doesn't fix the problem and feels like a mammoth if not impossible task, but awareness is definitely a first step!

And therein lies the truth. Men are telling you to see it.
I wholly agree with you. I'm on the fence about taking teen DD. It could be good for her, but I'm loathing the thought of seeing it.
Men just want to see Margot Robbie (no disrespect to either) okay... A LOT of men will endure it with their little ones, because.
I always had my brother's hand me downs so was an Action Man girl myself. Do I want to see a movie if him? God no.

I loved it! It's very lighthearted, silly and funny. The kind of film you want to watch when slightly inebriated.

It addresses sexism, feminism, the patriarchy while taking the piss out of itself at the same time. I laughed the whole way through but then I was slightly inebriated.

And what I meant more succinctly, is that men are telling you what a feminist should be.

I work in the film industry and watched this during a special screening for the staff. I did not realise that Barbie was a transwoman at all until I just read this thread.

Saying that though, I found the character annoying so didn’t pay too much attention to them when they were on screen.

Do you really need to say that someone must have watched a muffled grainy version just because they didn’t realise the person was Trans? Does our transrader need to be on 24/7 and if you don’t realise someone is Trans then shame on you as they can never be one of us? Just get a grip

I enjoyed the Barbie movie. Clever visuals and witty dialogue. Definitely not for young children.

As a feminist of course I do have many Questions. For example the film sidestepped looks and body image (apart from one funny meta-remark by the narrator)

The film was at its best and most feminist when it was lightly poking fun, with some whiplash-sharp one-liners all the way through. The first half was a delight and the Battle of the Kens later on was hilarious. The Alan role was a bit of a waste, they could have made more of his relationship to the Kens if they'd really wanted to do something about masculinity.

It fell down a bit when it tried to do the Real World and work an Uplifting Not-Exactly-Feminist Message into the second half while claiming that Mattel is Not That Bad Really. All these commercial films try to have their cake and eat it too.

I'd be very happy if 30 seconds of ranting was enough enough to deprogramme everyone from a lifetime of patriarchy!

So, I think the men in your life are right to the extent that you'd probably get quite a few good feminist laughs from the film. But it's not calling out all the sexism that's built in Barbie and Mattel, not by a long way.

I didn’t say that at all, as you well know. I just found it obvious that it was a transwoman, the voice was obvious and so were the physiological features, nowhere did I say that the PP’s radar had to be on 24/7. Get a grip yourself.

@AmaryllisNightAndDay I really like your summary. One of the low points for me was America's (never remember her character's name!) husband who was portrayed as a goof. It felt like there were no positive male characters in the film and all were poked fun at, not that I feel particularly sorry for men as such, perhaps it was an attempt at ironically reflecting on the lack of development of female characters over the years in film and tv, but we all know how harmful the characterisation of males as goofs can be (see Daddy Pig of Peppa Pig!) and how this still hurts women as it puts certain expectations on us to do everything, but it also made it easy fodder for the "anti-men" brigade to dismiss the film quickly, despite it clearly being anti patriarchy as opposed to anti men. I suppose there's a part of me as well, as a mum of sons who took them, who would have liked to have seen a male ally, or at least just a man with half a brain cell....

@kikigen
How dare you forget about Alan.

I’m going to see it tomorrow because I have secondary school & university aged children and I find it useful to have first hand knowledge of the media and social media messaging they are consuming.

FWIW I have noticed several Reddit posts from young FtM and ‘Nonbinary AFAB’ people saying that the film has made them question their transition plans and feel more positive about a possible future presenting as their actual sex

Basically, they don’t want to be Ken anymore (because Ken looks like a bit of a twit).

We’re going to see Heathers the Musical next week, so I’m hoping we can have some good discussions about films (and spin offs) aimed at adolescents and young adults and what has changed between my teen-goth-era (Heathers was one of my favourite films) and now.

I have my critical thinking cheat sheet poised and ready!

I want to know what happened to Alan, did he get a happy ever after?