Now that some *men* are commenting, it's all changing over on Twitter...

[Qbishy]

So Andrew Neil is tweeting about a detransitioner today, Richard Dawkins wrote that piece in the NS that has been shared and commented widely, and Wes Streeting has (kind of) apologised to Rosie Duffield.

It seems like now some men are getting in on the act, people are paying attention 🙄 I'm not criticising them, but honestly, WHERE HAVE THEY BEEN ALL THIS TIME???

Suzanne Moore is, understandably, furious now that Labour has (supposedly) changed its tune, having been terfed out (see what I did there) of the Guardian by Kath Viner. Helen Lewis equally fed up. As are many more women.

It's lovely that men are finally taking notice. But so incredibly frustrating that women's voices just don't count.

(One person on X posited that the tide turned when Elon Musk took it over and allowed wrongthink to be published... that could be the case, too.)

Glinner and JKR and many others deserve honours like the lady from Transgender Trend got.

Can I just pay tribute to Stephanie Davies-Arai? Although a lot of women have campaigned on the issue of gender self-ID, she was the first to spot what was happening with children, and the first to do something about it. She was a lone voice, or near enough, for a long time, and received extraordinary, terrifying amounts of abuse for publishing a schools guide that now aligns with government policy. And yet there's a real danger that people will forget her contribution.

If Andrew Neil ends up drawing attention to the issue of the surgical transition of children and tries to claim credit for it, let's all remember that Stephanie was banging her lone drum about it eight years ago.

Plenty of previous polling has shown that men, on average, are far less supporting of TRA's than women. It's women that are more divided on the issue.

Sure. But we're not talking about average people. We're talking about whistleblowers; those who have been the first to notice the issues, and those who have been willing to speak up, even in the face of social opprobrium, threats, and genuine risks to their safety.

Most of those have been women.

Women have been fucking brave on this, risking their jobs, peace of mind, social standing. And it's true that as the bubble bursts many will be forgotten. But some of us won't forget.

Ahh really?? Man, you won't believe if if you don't see it with your own eyes. Everything is turned into male vs female feminism these days.
Plenty men were veryy vocal about it in the beginning.
Were you under a rock? Or maybe it's the women that zone out when the men speak, probably thought they were mansplaining when they spoke about it, huh?

The tide is turning now because it took some time for people to start listening , not because it was only females that spoke up initially and now males?

The Guardian ran an article yesterday by a man who had a relationship with Sinead O'Connor in the mid-1990s. He said that her favourite show was Father Ted - she absolutely loved it.

I thought that was great. I already liked Sinead, and I like her now a little bit more. I hope Glinner saw it too. If Father Ted: the Musical ever sees the light of day, I'll be first in line.

And because, thanks to Elon, people are actually allowed to have differing opinions without it being banned form YouTube twitter and facebook

I believe the biggest threat to this ideology is themselves.

Yes. It's internally contradictory so it was always going to fall over and fail at some point.

When the TRAs were the outsiders with good t shirt slogans it was easy to miss that and think (like many of us did) this was just another marginalised group asking to be seen and accepted as equal people.

But the more they achieved their aims and got what they wanted - trans women in women's sports, women's prisons, the news stories about women exposing her penis, Isla Bryson, the realisation that if TWAW there is no word for woman any more and what that means for eveything that exists to support women today, the more obvious the incoherence and disconnect from reality became.

(And that's not even mentioning the surgery and the stories of ruined bodies starting to come out, and the people who've been alienated from their families and/or fallen into abusive relationships because their boundaries and sense of self were undermined by the us-against-them rhetoric).

I actually thought it would take longer. I thought the eventual pressures of reality and the ongoing real-word effects of both society's sexism and physical differences on women would lead to the "trans inclusive" narrative picking up gender critical concepts without recognising it, because that way they could avoid the cognitive pain of having to recognise they were wrong about the "TERFs" they demonised.

In fact I think that is what's happening with Starmer and Streeting. They are positioning themselves to be able to say this (accepting sex matters) was what they were always saying, and it was the crazy screeching TERFs that caused all the hate.

It was Boris Johnson who gave her the honour I think. I still remember the relief when he spoke out and said men should not be in women's sport. He reversed Theresa May's gender woo nonsense quite speedily really or at least tried to.

I was never an Elon fan but I am really grateful he bought Twitter and allowed free speech.

In fact I think that is what's happening with Starmer and Streeting. They are positioning themselves to be able to say this (accepting sex matters) was what they were always saying, and it was the crazy screeching TERFs that caused all the hate.

I suppose they could try that…..if they believe women (or indeed CCHQ and the DM) lack the basic digital archiving skills needed to take screenshots etc.

Ha yep

I think next century when this gender woo is in the history books, one of the turning points will be Musk buying twitter. It has helped massively as the legal cases have been so slow to have an effect. The other obvious key event was J KR speaking out. They tried to cancel her but she was too rich to cancel, a bit like Musk. So where were all the bloody politicians of all parties whose job it is to scrutinise legislation not misrepresent it like Starmer and Stonewall wilfully did?
Who ordered the Cass Review was it really Sajid Javid? Another key moment and there are many. No debate' must never again be allowed and all schools should teach Animal Farm and 1984 as core texts for the health of our democracy. Young people need to be educated that they are wrong about 'free speech having consequences'. We don't live in a dictator ship yet....

Yes Elon shaking up twitter is huge. Terrible how influential that platform was.

Bring on the debate ✊️

Who ordered the Cass Review was it really Sajid Javid?

Yes, that’s correct.

And also thanks need to go to the Women of Scotland who wouldn't wheesht! That was a close call and could have been a different ending without those brave campaigners 👏👏

They aren't doing this to convince informed GC women or DM readers though. If they cared about either of those groups (1) they wouldn't have gone where they did in the first place.

Their target is the people who are just now starting to think "um, hang on, what?" about the TRA-led agenda that Labour (and many others) sleep walked into because it looked progressive-y from the outside. Those people haven't been following in detail but are starting to hear things that worry them.

Starmer wants to catch them with his "reasonable man" schtick now, and if he succeeds with that why will they bother finding out what GC women or the DM might know to the contrary even if they do have receipts?

(1) two groups who are, I hope it goes without saying, not the same - GC women have a wide range of political alligences although the F in TERF does mean we tend to skew left

Try us.

<flips open archive; cracks knuckles>

yeah, and those of us who were on Streetings 'expell the Terfs' spreadsheet and list in the secret group. My data was actually leaked by LP at that point, but tbh they cared more about that than how they were treating women who raised the concerns

😄

Their target is the people who are just now starting to think "um, hang on, what?" about the TRA-led agenda that Labour (and many others) sleep walked into because it looked progressive-y from the outside. Those people haven't been following in detail but are starting to hear things that worry them.
^^
Starmer wants to catch them with his "reasonable man" schtick now, and if he succeeds with that why will they bother finding out what GC women or the DM might know to the contrary even if they do have receipts?

That’s a fair point. Luckily you’ve given Arabella and Nettle a heads up.

Has anyone ever put together a letter or petition addressed to Jimmy Mulville at Hattrick productions to say 'we want to see the Ted Musical and it will be a sell out smash hit'? I'd sign it!

I also think the Beth Rigby / Stonewall interview was another small step, but journalists like a good story/and she did a textbook interview, which was widely shared. I bet there’s a lot of journalists who’d like a piece of that.

LoobiJee · Today 19:24
Who ordered the Cass Review was it really Sajid Javid?

Yes, that’s correct.

Not Matt Hancock? I thought I read that, and remembered it because of being surprised.

I know what you mean, it's the same in meetings when I say something and it gets brushed off then my male colleague says the same thing 5 mins later and the boss congratulates him as if it's a brand new amazing idea.

Infuriating! So many women have been speaking up about this issue for so long but only now that men have started speaking that the issues have been acknowledged. Still, I suppose it's good that slowly more awareness of the insidiousness of all of this gender ideology is creeping into public consciousness.