Is anyone else finding being gender critical has affected their mental health?

[BluebellBlueballs]

Maybe I need to take a step back but that feels like capitulation.
I just feel I am being persecuted for my beliefs.
Two people in my life one a sibling one a friend, both men, have washed their hands of me completely after finding out I joined women's gender critical networks.

Told I'm in a hate group etc.

I used to be quite open about being GC because I didn't think I was doing anything wrong. I guess I thought of it as like joining extinction rebellion or something, OK some people don't want it forced down their throats but no need to lie or hide my activities. But it's not like that at all.

I've had a sort of mh crisis over being cut off by people close to me, and others not so close to me, for having what I see as a difference of an opinion over TWAW. But I'm being made to feel like I've joined the ku klux klan.

Sometimes I wonder if its worth it any more but that's how this movement seems to operate, by shaming the heretics into silence.

Can anyone relate?

Here’s a little positive ray, then. I’m chatting with (well, more on the periphery of!) a group of maybe 20 people from the continent, & The Issue comes up. There are mainly unanimous expressions concern. Some stories are exchanged, & I tentatively mention Mumsnet FWR. Cue instant smiles & chuckles of appreciative recognition. None of them were British or native English speakers, to the best of my knowledge. Even just talking - respectful, empathetic posting - can make a difference.

Have you been very militant in sharing your views? My best friend has views politically very different to mine. We just don't discuss it. Neither of us is going to change our mind. I think he is a dick for having those views, he believes I am.

We just don't talk about them. What's more important your views or your relationships?

We've discussed them in the past and he never gave me any inkling he felt strongly one way or the other. Something must have changed as he sure does now.

Of course if he'd given me any indication he was on team trans i would have backed off. But he didn't.

If it really is that much one or the other, all or nothing... then perhaps the relationship's not worth having?

I liken it to bereavement. Sorry if people out there have lost and this seems trite. But there are some parallels.

It's probably more like the breakdown of a relationship, a divorce or separation. The loss of a dear friendship. This movement is tearing families and relationships apart.

My son is not dead but I never see him or hear from him and I don't know if I ever will. I do feel like I have been through the stages of grief and have settled on acceptance now.

I feel I am in the early stages of grief and just feel overwhelming sorrow most of the time. I am having professional help and I bloody need it.

I am sorry to hear you are going through this too. I can only imagine the pain of estrangement from a child

PS My post above suggests a very reductive view. I think Iäve just been influenced by the distressing PCOS thread, which is a very different context to this one! I'm not militant myself: indeed, I'd say I'm very cautious. My relationships are very important to me. But what a pity that more people can't simply agree to disagree. I value open-minded discussion in my friends: people's views but, even more, their readiness to engage in open-minded discussion are a key part OF our relationships.

All the time I thought that what we were doing. Until one day he bombshells me with a text cutting off the friendship. Its unfathomable.

And my post was in response to @Maddy70, not @BluebellBlueballs particular circumstances. I'd rather fight for a relationship than give it up due to something like this. But I also think something like this, which can expose such deep faultlines, & how we & friends etc. engage with the challenges presented by this, can help us to understand that relationship more deeply, & act accordingly.

Sorry you are having a tough time, and sorry to everyone else who has also suffered. It is a bit crap when friends think less of us. I hope these issues are resolved for you.
In answer to the original question, I did find this harder to start with, but a few years on, my mental health has definitely improved. I think the clarity with which I now see the world, compared to the distorted left wing, almost religious world view I was attached to has been amazingly healthful. I now value truth above everything and I'm far more aware of how little I know about the world. Also knowing without a doubt that I am right about the GC position is very galvanising.

@BluebellBlueballs I need to stop cross-posting! To be clear, my last wasn't in any way a reference to your specific circumstances, but rather a reflection on myself in more general terms. I've been multitasking & nipping between threads a little, & often post to explore my own thoughts! In this context, that places my last few posts out of context, & is so maybe not helpful for you - apologies.

Reading your last, your attitude, which is reflected in that of many other FWR posters, is exactly one of the reasons I find myself reassured we're not "the baddies": we do listen & empathise. It sounds as though you've done what you can, & he's (they have) taken a hardline approach. That he's acted decisively enough on this to cut you off, to your understandable distress, while you're here painfully processing this & re-assessing your own actions says a huge amount about you. And that's what I mean by my more considered post re: what this can teach us (ugh, forgive the phrasing!)

I hope you can take away from what's happened that, counter-intuitively, these dramatic statements of cutting off & defriending can sometimes show an ironic intolerance that belies claims to the moral high-ground. The sheer strength of such a gesture unsettles us & makes us question ourselves, & that's upsetting & deeply wrong in one way - it can act as a kind of emotional blackmail - but, looked at from another perspective, it teaches us (ugh, again - educates us?! 😉) about who we are in how we respond to it. And then who they are in how they respond to that response. And by reflecting in that way, we can then take steps to rebuild the relationship, or walk away with a better understanding of why we felt we had to do so.

Waffly platitudes over & out. (But hope they help a little).

(I speak from some experience - no dramatic fallings-out as yet, long may that continue, but complex undercurrents & difficult conversations I've had to think very hard about how to navigate. It's arguably been good for me, but not easy).

Scrolling through Twitter is hard because there's so much hate for anyone GC, and this is in spite of the fact I follow so many people who are GC.

Thankfully, my circle of friends for the most part, are all GC. Even so, we tend to talk in whispers when in public, or mostly via text messages and emails. Work has been tricky though, particularly a few jobs ago where I came into a lot of contact with Edward Lord. I learnt to keep a low profile and my mouth shut which I think has helped me. Another thing that also helped is to not to engage with anyone, particularly men I didn't know for certain to be GC - it's usually men who are the most rabid. I just don't need the hassle.

Thankfully, you all keep me sane.

I read about the human tendency toward tribalism the other day and how many no longer feel that they belong to geographic (such as all who live in a particular village) or kinship tribes but rather to online thought tribes. This can affect how we judge others, what determines who 'outsiders' are etc.

One negative effect of cyber-tribes has been how the complicated nature of most people is seen as flattened into just a few facets when everything revolves around one set of values or one ideology. Those facets, then, become central in deciding on who is to be ejected from the tribe etc. The political party someone belongs to, say, or if the person is 'queer' or other similar demographic signals.

I saw this before the trans rights vs. women's rights debate in other types of political debates, and also saw purity spirals develop and how the canceling of individuals happens online and then bleeds into real life.

For a traditional tribe to ostracise one of its members usually requires quite a bit more than what seems to be happening now, because very few of us are without some flaws or without any good sides.

For instance, when I was a child I knew a woman who was rather unpleasant in some ways. She could be quite nasty about other people (gossipy, very bossy, not always quite honest, yelled at us children) and caused a lot of hurt feelings (among adults, not just children).

But when someone in the village was ailing, it was this woman who went in with meals, who cleaned the house, who called the doctors and so on, and when someone got into money trouble it was she who gave them help.

We might be losing our ability to see such complicated people without judging them hastily (or without the reverse, of putting someone on a pedestal for their stated virtues).

This might have nothing to do with the topic of this thread...

@nepeta Fascinating, & seems potentially painfully relevant...

Thanks. Yes, they do help. I feel like he's cast me in the role of 'the bad person' and cut me off without taking time to discuss, think things through or make any nuanced or considered judgement.

Not making any excuses for his behaviour but in many ways he is also a victim of this cultural war, the kool aid sure got him. Yet, he is still responsible for his poor treatment of me.

It does feel like us gender crits are getting the shitty end of the stick. Cast as modern day witches by the holier than thou woke totalitarians.

I wish I could go to sleep and wake up in 2008 or something.

@BluebellBlueballs BluebellBlueballs

Which womens groups have you joined please

And your measured response right there shows that you're thinking carefully & empathetically in a way he doesn't seem to be (I'm trying to be careful to be hypothetical in all responses now!)

My next steps following my more challenging convos have been to reflect on how to proceed from then on: what to bring up, when & how. I'm technically prepared to give my view & then promise relative silence henceforth (as someone else suggested upthread). But when I have done that, it's put some pressure on me that I feel was rather unjust - we all hear things we don't like to some degree, & should be tolerant of that, especially when they're important to someone we care about.

As such, I feel degree is the key word here. Ideally, there shouldn't be an expectation of all-or-nothing, speak or be silent, in a relationship, as this demands a disproportionately absolute concession on the part of the one for whom speaking about this is deeply, viscerally important. On the other side, though, I'm learning (ongoing process!) to pick my times, limit time spent, & choose my arguments very carefully. I'm definitely not there yet! I think I may not have got to the "all or nothing" promise I made to someone a while ago (since then, they've actually become more open to brief convos, thankfully) had I been more tactical in my expressions of concern about this to them beforehand.

Yeah, me and my sister fell out over it. Tbh she is odd, we fell out because once I didn't think Richard Dawkins was the be all and all of truth. She was already a twitter addict to be fair, I think a lot of those wedded to gender bollocks are fairly idealistic, me and daughter disagreed on blokes pretending to be little girls. She thinks it's an innocent expression of God knows what, I think they are fully perverted gross men.

Maybe I'm overly cynical, I think not though.

I'd rather not say as it's outing.

But there are willy free zones put it that way

*they are

Well the Dawkins thing is v strange as he's now a heretic for refusing to not use the words male and female in his work. His work as a BIOLOGIST. He was stripped of an award, but he's too famous/ old/ rich to care about being cancelled. What does your sister think of him now?

It does do a number on your mental health. Having no go areas with close family and friends is fucking horrible. to everyone who is dealing with this.

I'm GC but don't let it consume me. I try and move through life fighting the good fight. I try and be an ally for those that need it. I have a severe mental illness and am disabled so have to deal with huge discrimination on a daily basis. I find some people on here very dogmatic about being GC and have to bring it up all the time in every context. They don't realise that this can bring the cause down. For those of us fighting many causes we know that the battle is short but the war long. Take a step back, pick your battles, if you come across someone who has fallen for it hook line and sinker don't try more than once. Move on to the undecided, the person that is sort of going along with it but is interested when you offer another viewpoint. That battle is easier.