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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

What is a woman: Daily Wire documentary on for limited time for free

463 replies

AnotherDayAnotherView · 02/06/2023 10:39

https://twitter.com/stevenmarkryan/status/1664437068838363141

Available for 24 hours

https://twitter.com/stevenmarkryan/status/1664437068838363141

OP posts:
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15
NicolaSturgeonsSOGIbottom · 04/06/2023 14:45

TraumatisedGooner · 04/06/2023 12:47

Of course you're not going to agree with everything anyone says. But you and the gender critical movement should be conscious of whose support you are garnering. Matt Walsh is not a single issue bigot. Signal boosting this man and his alt right network is not only going to affect trans people. "First they came for the trans people, and I didn't care because I don't like trans people". It's obvious what comes next and/or simultaneously: homophobia, misogyny, and a reversion to 'traditional' Christian values. Do not believe that the gender critical movement is going to be able to apply the brakes at the right time. The right time to distance yourselves from Walsh is right now.

You sound like a petulant child 😂

NicolaSturgeonsSOGIbottom · 04/06/2023 14:47

maltravers · 04/06/2023 13:29

Maybe following Traumatised Gooner’s logic, it is instead time for the Left and LGB generally, to dissociate itself from the TRA movement.

I vote for this option!

OvaHere · 04/06/2023 14:56

TraumatisedGooner · 04/06/2023 13:10

"What is a woman" is not a yes or no question.

Ultimately if I needed to find a source to argue on my behalf that the Earth is round, I wouldn't struggle to find someone that is (1) an actual subject matter expert and (2) not an awful person.

I'm not disagreeing with Matt Walsh because he's an awful person. I'm saying that the gender critical movement should avoid signal boosting Matt Walsh because you're advancing all of his causes not just one of them.

Sir Robert Winston knows that a woman is an adult human female.

He is an actual subject matter expert and to the best of my knowledge not an awful person.

As for all this 'what the GC movement should do'. How about the TRA movement dial back from pushing such extreme lunacy and lies so far beyond what could be considered a reasonable civil rights standpoint it's driving everyone else to breaking point.

Do that and the Matt Walsh's of the world instantly have a much smaller reach. So you first.

Tanith · 04/06/2023 14:57

maltravers · 04/06/2023 13:29

Maybe following Traumatised Gooner’s logic, it is instead time for the Left and LGB generally, to dissociate itself from the TRA movement.

Many have done so already.

It was the Left wing who first raised the alarm in this country. Members of the Labour party, the Green party and the Liberal Democrats were doing their best to highlight the problems being caused by aggressive TRAs.
The LGB Alliance has set up to dissociate itself from the gender-affirmation promoted by Stonewall.
As recently as this year, the Communist party has again clearly stated themselves to be GC.
This is not a Left vs Right issue and trying to stop Matt Walsh's film because he is right-wing plays into the hands of people who want to polarise the debate and will cause other groups to be caught up in the backlash.

AnotherDayAnotherView · 04/06/2023 15:01

ScrollingLeaves · 04/06/2023 09:28

Shouldn’t this film be on AIBU somehow, perhaps under a thread relating to aspects of modern American society, ( so it doesn’t stay hidden in ‘gender’)?

Please feel free to put it in AIBU

OP posts:
Tanith · 04/06/2023 15:05

Anyway - back to the film:

Scott Newgent's contribution was heartbreaking. Every teenaged girl who thinks she can change sex should watch it.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 04/06/2023 15:06

Please feel free to put it in AIBU

She did

AnotherDayAnotherView · 04/06/2023 15:13

Ereshkigalangcleg · 04/06/2023 15:06

Please feel free to put it in AIBU

She did

Sorry I did not realise - hopefully as more and more people watch this excellent documentary the more the average everyday individual will see the harm done by this destructive gender ideology

OP posts:
Ereshkigalangcleg · 04/06/2023 15:15

To think this is a form of contagious social madness spreading from the USA? http://www.mumsnet.com/Talk/amiibeingunreasonable/4820186-to-think-this-is-a-form-of-contagious-social-madness-spreading-from-the-usa

Theladyinluna · 04/06/2023 15:20

I think it shows how entrenched gender ideology in the US and Canada is, to the extent that it is socially unacceptable to question it at all to a far greater extent than is true here

Yes, this came across so strongly. It wasn't just that they could not answer the question, and did not seem able to realise they could not answer it, despite that question being the core their entire area of professional expertise hangs off, it was also that they could not emotionally handle even being asked the question, becoming angry or threatening to stop conversing. These are grown adults, professionals specialising in this field and they appear unable to understand that it is a fault in them if they are unable to answer questions and challenges about their own area of expertise.

Its simply extraordinary.

HereForTheFreeLunch · 04/06/2023 15:27

Theladyinluna

These are grown adults, professionals specialising in this field and they appear unable to understand that it is a fault in them if they are unable to answer questions and challenges about their own area of expertise.

Need a like button. The mind boggles how they can't even handle simple questions without going "I'm not talking to you" , forget handling robust questioning.

Theladyinluna · 04/06/2023 15:29

MrsOvertonsWindow · 04/06/2023 12:00

And he's incandescent about the men cheating women out of places / sponsorship etc in women's sport.Such a shame that caring about safeguarding children, the erosion of women's sport and women's rights is not being challenged by those purporting to be "on the left" 🙄Still, when people show you who they really are and all that.....

Well, I think that is true of Jordan Peterson showing one who he really is too. I like Jordan Peterson. I don't agree with everything he says but, unlike gender theorists and ideologues, he is prepared to discuss his views and he is able to make a reasoned and considered defence of his views which holds together even if you don't agree with it. I also think he is a compassionate man who cares deeply about other people and their suffering and wants to do what he can to help people.

GailBlancheViola · 04/06/2023 15:37

Yes, this came across so strongly. It wasn't just that they could not answer the question, and did not seem able to realise they could not answer it, despite that question being the core their entire area of professional expertise hangs off,

This, an expert who cannot answer to their expertise, can you imagine that in any other area of medicine or indeed any other field? And people trust them. Unbelievable.

Theladyinluna · 04/06/2023 15:37

TraumatisedGooner · 04/06/2023 12:32

I think it's quite clear from my post that I'm not saying the gender critical movement does nothing, I am saying that the movemnet does nothing to distance themselves from the likes of Matt Walsh.

Maybe we don't feel the need to do this as we believe that one agrees or disagrees with ideas and arguments. Unlike you who seems to think that one has to agree or disagree with people.

frazzledasarock · 04/06/2023 15:38

The university professor. Getting angry and threatening to stop the interview because MW uses the word ‘truth’ !!

Theladyinluna · 04/06/2023 15:40

TraumatisedGooner · 04/06/2023 12:47

Of course you're not going to agree with everything anyone says. But you and the gender critical movement should be conscious of whose support you are garnering. Matt Walsh is not a single issue bigot. Signal boosting this man and his alt right network is not only going to affect trans people. "First they came for the trans people, and I didn't care because I don't like trans people". It's obvious what comes next and/or simultaneously: homophobia, misogyny, and a reversion to 'traditional' Christian values. Do not believe that the gender critical movement is going to be able to apply the brakes at the right time. The right time to distance yourselves from Walsh is right now.

I think if you watch the documentary, or read anything on this part of MN, or read any book by GC people, you will see quite clearly that we are all motivated by caring very deeply by people who now identify as trans and how this movement risks damaging so many of their lives.

Theladyinluna · 04/06/2023 15:44

maltravers · 04/06/2023 13:29

Maybe following Traumatised Gooner’s logic, it is instead time for the Left and LGB generally, to dissociate itself from the TRA movement.

Well, quite.

Emotionalsupportviper · 04/06/2023 15:44

TraumatisedGooner · 04/06/2023 13:10

"What is a woman" is not a yes or no question.

Ultimately if I needed to find a source to argue on my behalf that the Earth is round, I wouldn't struggle to find someone that is (1) an actual subject matter expert and (2) not an awful person.

I'm not disagreeing with Matt Walsh because he's an awful person. I'm saying that the gender critical movement should avoid signal boosting Matt Walsh because you're advancing all of his causes not just one of them.

Sadly, I agree.

I know there is a tendency to think "My enemy's enemy is my friend", but (to use another popular saying "When you sup with the devil, you need long spoon".

There is a danger of allying with someone else who will regress the progress women have mad, though in an entirely different way.

Aplantismanycolours · 04/06/2023 15:46

The following is a blatant copy and paste of my own post from the other thread on this film but thought it's probably more relevant to this thread:

From what I've seen, the documentary in of itself has it's uses at highlighting the madness of gender ideology, especially in bite-size chunks which can easily be shared on twitter but Matt Walsh himself is, in many ways, a contributor to some of the root causes.

The ever brilliant Helen Joyce summaries the issues with Matt Walsh and the film beautifully:

"Matt Walsh is a very conservative Catholic, he's somebody who is anti-abortion and says feminism is the worse thing that's ever happened to Western civilization etc.

And I don't think he understands, in fact, I'm certain he doesn't understand, that makes him part of the whole problem because the problem, and it's visible all through the film, is that both conservatives like Matt Walsh and the gender ideologues that he's mocking, completely fairly, both believe that gender stereotypes and gender roles are inherent to what it is to be a woman.

One side uses them to define what a woman is, Matt Walsh thinks they're inseparable. He understands that a man is a male person and a woman is a female person but he thinks a whole load of things follow from that about who's in charge, who makes the sandwiches, whose voices gets heard and all of this sort of thing.

Well, if you give your average teenage girl the choice between cutting off her breasts, taking testosterone and having a shot at being seen as the half of humanity that's regarded as truly human or accepting she is Matt Walsh's wife in the kitchen making sandwiches and asking him to open the jar which is very near the end of the film - she'll cut her tits off and take testosterone. So he's part of the problem.

There needs to be a genuinely liberatory message to kids which is "Yes, sex is real, yes sex differences are real. Don't let that hold you back."

And this is particularly important for a group which, of course, Matt Walsh doesn't give a shit about, namely gay kids because there is a strong connection between being very gender non-conforming in early youth and growing up to be gay. Every homophobe knows that, if you've got some little boy who wants to wear his sisters tutu and play with her barbie dolls, there's a much stronger chance that boy is going to grow up gay than a boy who isn't doing that. Not set in stone but it's a stronger chance.

Matt Walsh wants that boy buzz cut and out there shooting. The gender ideologues want his dick chopped off and turned into a girl. I want him to grow up to be a happy gay man who marries whoever the fuck he likes.

Full interview:

nothingcomestonothing · 04/06/2023 15:54

Is Matt Walsh my friend? No, we disagree on an awful lot.

Does his film show people who don't know much about this issue some simple examples of how gender ideologues are damaging children despite having nothing real to base their actions on, not even the most basic definitions? Yep. Sunlight on the smoke and mirrors.

Theladyinluna · 04/06/2023 15:58

There is a danger of allying with someone else who will regress the progress women have mad, though in an entirely different way

I just cannot get my head around the idea that agreeing with someone on one issue is allying with them as a person. I completely reject that.

HereForTheFreeLunch · 04/06/2023 15:59

I want him to grow up to be a happy gay man who marries whoever the fuck he likes.

Agree. And the ones I am really mad at are those in the Left. KS and there like who have thrown us under the bus. The Matt Walshes are familiar but the betrayal by the left is the ones that really hurts. And then they dare to talk down at us and tell us not to talk to those people.

maltravers · 04/06/2023 16:05

I look at the US where everyone who is a Democrat seemingly has to think “A” and everyone who is a Republic must think “B”. It’s unhealthy, divisive and no, I don’t want it in the UK. We should be able to agree and disagree by issue, on a case by case basis. I don’t expect my opinions to be served up to me in a block because of who I vote for - I can and will make my own mind up thanks.

Theladyinluna · 04/06/2023 16:13

HereForTheFreeLunch · 04/06/2023 15:59

I want him to grow up to be a happy gay man who marries whoever the fuck he likes.

Agree. And the ones I am really mad at are those in the Left. KS and there like who have thrown us under the bus. The Matt Walshes are familiar but the betrayal by the left is the ones that really hurts. And then they dare to talk down at us and tell us not to talk to those people.

Yes. this. We all knew and know what to expect from Matt Walsh. I never expected such deep-rooted misogyny and disregard for women existed in the left.

Any yes, Helen Joyce is bang on about Matt Walsh. I know pp was saying the bit about his son at the start and his wife opening the jar was a joke but I really don't think it was. I have seen some of his other videos and he very clearly has entrenched sexist views about the roles of men and women.

TraumatisedGooner · 04/06/2023 16:44

Datun · 04/06/2023 14:06

Matt Walsh has just said the exponential viewing of his film is a direct result of engineers at Twitter trying to stop people watching it.

He just said it!!

How can you still not get this phenomenon?

It's unbelievable.

I don't think someone criticising Matt Walsh in a thread about Matt Walsh is likely to create a Streisand effect.