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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Twitter removes policy against deadnaming and misgendering transgender people

124 replies

DerekFaker · 18/04/2023 22:24

He's gone and done it, the mad lad 😮

https://apnews.com/article/twitter-elon-musk-transgender-deadnaming-hateful-conduct-ae1b7285bb906e04b26ff9751ec0c2ce?utm_campaign=TrueAnthem&utm_medium=AP&utm_source=Twitter

SAN FRANCISCO (AP) — Twitter has quietly removed a policy against the “targeted misgendering or deadnaming of transgender individuals,” raising concerns that the Elon Musk-owned platform is becoming less safe for marginalized groups.

Twitter enacted the policy against deadnaming, or using a transgender person’s name before they transitioned, as well as purposefully using the wrong gender for someone as a form of harassment, in 2018.

On Monday, Twitter also said it will only put warning labels on some tweets that are “potentially” in violation of its rules against hateful conduct. Previously, the tweets were removed.

It was in this policy update that Twitter appears to have deleted the line against deadnaming from its rules.

“Twitter’s decision to covertly roll back its longtime policy is the latest example of just how unsafe the company is for users and advertisers alike,” said Sarah Kate Ellis, the president and CEO of the advocacy group GLAAD. “This decision to roll back LGBTQ safety pulls Twitter even more out of step with TikTok, Pinterest, and Meta, which all maintain similar policies to protect their transgender users at a time when anti-transgender rhetoric online is leading to real world discrimination and violence.”

Twitter did immediately respond to a message for comment Tuesday.

Twitter removes policy against deadnaming transgender people

Twitter has quietly removed a policy against the “targeted misgendering or deadnaming of transgender individuals.” The move is raising concerns that the Elon Musk-owned platform is becoming less safe for marginalized groups. Twitter enacted the policy...

https://apnews.com/article/twitter-elon-musk-transgender-deadnaming-hateful-conduct-ae1b7285bb906e04b26ff9751ec0c2ce

OP posts:
Transparent2 · 18/04/2023 22:28

‘Wrong gender’? Or right sex?

AnythingToSay · 18/04/2023 22:29

Oh dear, what a shame.

JanesLittleGirl · 18/04/2023 22:36

Oh dear. How sad. Never mind.

TheBiologyStupid · 18/04/2023 22:39

Facts and reality - no wonder that they don't like it.

Agrona · 18/04/2023 22:50

Why am I laughing?

Malvarrosa · 18/04/2023 22:57

Pre-Musk Twitter refused to take down a tweet naming (correctly or not, legally it doesn't matter) four of the accusers in the Alex Salmond sexual assault case who'd been given anonymity. They refused to delete it or lock the account even when Scottish law enforcement, with proof that the tweeter was in Scotland, told them it violated the law. The tweeter himself got jail time, but Twitter was was still all hA hA nO bRo, WhO i$ gUnNa MaKe Me???

So I have trouble believing they've really ever attempted to keep people "safe".

FemaleAndLearning · 18/04/2023 23:00

It changed on the 8 April looks like the activists on shift were not paying attention!

Dougalskeeper · 18/04/2023 23:23

Reality over delusion. Good

CremeEggQueen · 19/04/2023 00:27

"Mad lad"
That give me "boys will be boys", eee what are they like vibes...
Sounds opposite to feminist to me

PorcelinaV · 19/04/2023 00:38

If you are deliberately doing it to harass someone then I don't agree with that, although given that you could get banned off twitter just for saying "men aren't women", I suspect that their bar for "harassment" could be stupidly low.

In general, I don't see why a small number of activists get to decide the acceptable use of language for everyone.

Pixiedust1234 · 19/04/2023 01:12

😮

Does this mean more twits are fleeing to mastodon? Or did that die a death ages ago?

EmotionalSupportHyena · 19/04/2023 01:21

CremeEggQueen · 19/04/2023 00:27

"Mad lad"
That give me "boys will be boys", eee what are they like vibes...
Sounds opposite to feminist to me

‘Mad lad’ or ‘mad lad’ is just an observation, it doesn’t necessarily indicate or approval (nor disapproval) and it doesn’t excuse poor behaviour the way ‘boys will be boys’ does.

https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=The%20absolute%20MADLAD%2

You should probably bookmark urban dictionary because you’ve come up with some proper bonkers interpretations of contemporary slang over the last few days.

HTH.

Urban Dictionary: The absolute MADLAD!

Some sort of person who does something crazy

https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=The%20absolute%20MADLAD%21

BonfireLady · 19/04/2023 06:37

I wonder what this means from a UK legal perspective WRT the protected characteristic of gender reassignment. Does the Maya Forstater case set any precedent in law on this, or does that only apply to employment?

I'm very much in two minds on this. If it means we'll see a rush of people deliberately targeting transgender people with hateful messages using their previous name (e.g. where legally changed) and taunting them with sex-based pronouns, that does not really sound like a good outcome.

It's going to very much depend on the context in which someone does this. Hopefully the moderators (if there are any left?) will use common sense and look at context. Presumably they have to do something similar with comments about religious beliefs.

Florissante · 19/04/2023 07:27

Good.

DerekFaker · 19/04/2023 07:40

CremeEggQueen · 19/04/2023 00:27

"Mad lad"
That give me "boys will be boys", eee what are they like vibes...
Sounds opposite to feminist to me

Don't be bloody daft. It's just a meme. 🙄

OP posts:
DerekFaker · 19/04/2023 07:42

Oh thanks EmotionalSupportHyena I* *didn't see your post.

OP posts:
DerekFaker · 19/04/2023 07:44

PorcelinaV · 19/04/2023 00:38

If you are deliberately doing it to harass someone then I don't agree with that, although given that you could get banned off twitter just for saying "men aren't women", I suspect that their bar for "harassment" could be stupidly low.

In general, I don't see why a small number of activists get to decide the acceptable use of language for everyone.

I agree. It's not like I'm going to go around going "Oi Sarah, you're actually a man called David!" and I hope that's true for most people.

BUT we can talk about rapists, etc as men now which is a good thing.

OP posts:
anyolddinosaur · 19/04/2023 07:47

If you are being unkind for the sake of it that makes you a person to be avoided. If you are pointing out that, say, a sex offender is actually male not female or someone claiming to speak for women is male that's different.

Just because you can do something doesnt mean you should.

Clymene · 19/04/2023 07:54

Good. There are people who spend their days trawling Twitter for wrongthink and mass reporting them. Quite a few of them do the same on MN.

I wonder if Musk has read Barracker's excellent article? Here it is, if you haven't read it

fairplayforwomen.com/pronouns/

Downwithitall · 19/04/2023 07:56

After the hilarious BBC interview (in which he revealed the reporter to be a lying, moronic fool) and now allowing reality to trump fantasy? I'm beginning to really like Elon Musk!

puffyisgood · 19/04/2023 07:56

'deadnaming' I'm not a fan of, it's just needlessly discourteous, a person's name is literally what they call themself.

'misgendering' I feel far less strongly about, it's often very useful if done to emphasise the reality of someone's biological sex (e.g. when discussing a male athlete or prisoner who's trying to get access to female spaces).

Malvarrosa · 19/04/2023 08:07

Agree that the “targeted misgendering or deadnaming of transgender individuals” is/would be unpleasant. But part of the issue here is that Twitter was cracking down on much more than that, and indulging vindictive reporting as well as selective punishment of users from some of its own frontline staff.

For example, back when it was forbidden for anyone to say "Yaniv", Meghan Murphy was perma-banned for answering "that's him" after a big song-and-dance of people trying to communicate with hints while avoiding saying the name. Given that Yaniv was using "Jonathan" for tech consulting purposes long after switching to "Jessica" socially (and presumably legally), it's hard to justify a claim of "deadnaming" and it seems unlikely that it was "targeted" rather than an honest slip trying to negotiate the minefield.

Twitter has a lot of responsibility in having creating a problem by being over the top ridiculous, often in the pursuit of misogyny. It's unforunately not all that surprising if some people act out in frustration after being silenced and essentially gaslit.

JacquelinePot · 19/04/2023 08:07

Out of step with Tik Tok? Oh noes!

As appeals to authority go, that's hilarious.

BernardBlacksMolluscs · 19/04/2023 08:18

Downwithitall · 19/04/2023 07:56

After the hilarious BBC interview (in which he revealed the reporter to be a lying, moronic fool) and now allowing reality to trump fantasy? I'm beginning to really like Elon Musk!

Yup

the BBC’s concerted campaign to paint him as a really bad man has made me rather like him

I still think he’s a massive twerp but now I think he has some redeeming features (like making the woeful James Clayton look like an actual idiot)

RoyalCorgi · 19/04/2023 08:25

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