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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

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Trans woman threatened with physical violence by 'TERF'

90 replies

wontbesilencedbyyou · 27/03/2023 22:05

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11868077/SF-woman-threatens-punch-transgender-TikTok-star-expletive-filled-tirade-caught-video.html#reader-comments

Sharing this here as I feel it's important to see both sides on a forum like this, where there are many articles shared about scenes getting nasty at protests, and I haven't seen anything about it yet. Lilly was accosted whilst literally just eating a salad and live streaming.

My opinion: It's sad, and makes me fearful for the future.

San Francisco transgender woman is verbally assaulted while eating

Lilly Contino was enjoying her food at the Union Square, San Francisco restaurant when the elderly woman sitting at a nearby table spit transphobic comments at her.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11868077/SF-woman-threatens-punch-transgender-TikTok-star-expletive-filled-tirade-caught-video.html#reader-comments

OP posts:
Tontostitis · 27/03/2023 22:14

Smells like bs to me

twitterexile · 27/03/2023 22:15

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FrippEnos · 27/03/2023 22:17

I find it interesting how all of these start in the middle.
What went on before? after all it was being live streamed so why the cut?

BonfireLady · 27/03/2023 22:21

Agreed it's definitely important to see both sides. If it did happen like that (hopefully good journalism, not the kind we've just seen in NZ..) then it is indeed very sad.
If the trans woman in question was simply eating in a restaurant, this is unacceptable.

The point at which it gets difficult is where a trans woman goes in to a ladies' toilets. But it's not clear that this happened here, and even if it had a verbal attack full of hateful insults isn't the way forward.

SNWannabe · 27/03/2023 22:23

Yeah I would also like to know why an able bodied and rather strong person would feel threatened by a rambling 70 year old who is clearly a bit confused (TERF explanation). Why didn't "Lilly" just ignore or politely decline to continue the conversation if they felt so threatened...
Women being sexually harassed and threatened by drunk men dont goad them and get into discussions, they avoid, move, apologise...walk away etc. Not film for TikTok and share for the likes...

FFS

twitterexile · 27/03/2023 22:24

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wontbesilencedbyyou · 27/03/2023 22:34

Found this which may be useful for those looking for context:

Ms Contino explained to KPIX that the harassment first began when the woman started telling jokes and then offered to show her a surgery scar on her stomach.
When she politely turned her down, the woman replied: “I’ll show you if I want to, son.”
“And, of course, as a trans person, I’m more sensitive to gender language,” Ms Contino said.
She said that she became more shocked as the incident went on, saying that nothing like that had ever happened to her before.

I don't fully understand those of you who are responding questioning or downplaying the incident. Surely we can all look at this and say it's unacceptable and inexcusable? Or else I fear we're blinded by hatred.

Anti-trans encounter in San Francisco caught on camera

A San Francisco trans woman was verbally assaulted at a Union Square restaurant and video of the incident which was streamed live over TikTok has gone viral.

https://www.cbsnews.com/sanfrancisco/news/hostile-anti-trans-encounter-san-francisco-caught-camera/

OP posts:
BlueHeelers · 27/03/2023 22:51

Interesting use of the word “assaulted.”

Particularly after seeing the footage from New Zealand ….

FrippEnos · 27/03/2023 22:52

I'm responding with a question because I know what went on in the let women speak tour, where as this one is ambiguous to say the least.

EndlessTea · 27/03/2023 23:06

Isn’t this the one who was incredulous about being called “sir” by a gas station attendant? Viral.

Draigosaurus · 27/03/2023 23:08

Do restaurants in the US often allow dogs to sit at the table on the upholstered seating? Or is the dog in a dog basket on the bench? (I didn’t watch the video.)

wontbesilencedbyyou · 27/03/2023 23:16

EndlessTea · 27/03/2023 23:06

Isn’t this the one who was incredulous about being called “sir” by a gas station attendant? Viral.

@EndlessTea No that was someone else

OP posts:
RoseslnTheHospital · 27/03/2023 23:19

Don't be sad for the future. This is one incident in the US. The woman was clearly wrong to become sweary and hostile, not much would justify that unless there had been some serious provocation prior to the start of that video clip.

She left the restaurant of her own accord having ended the interaction without escalating any threats or resorting to actual violence. The manager came over and apologised to the customer for the situation.

EpicChaos · 28/03/2023 00:15

Sorry, compassion central closed, until further notice!

Maduixa · 28/03/2023 00:32

FWIW, Lilly has my sympathies. I hate strangers talking to me while I'm trying to eat and I'd be really squeamish about someone I didn't know showing me a scar! I used to live in SF and have had a lot of bonkers conversations, so I guess I wouldn't have found this one that suprising. You eventually develop a kind of LOL attitude, but yeah - for people who move to the Bay Area from elsewhere, there are times when the local culture of engagement can get annoying and intrusive.

For those unfamiliar with the location - Cheesecake Factory is a big US-wide midscale chain. This one is a large space on the top floor of Macy's department store, inside of the Westfield Center, a huge mall right in central San Francisco (Powell & Market). I don't want to cast any aspersions on this restaurant or any of the staff because they do their best and aren't spectacularly well compensated, but such venues can be uneven - really efficient and attentive service at busy times but scantily staffed and consequently a little slow otherwise. I would not be at all surprised if someone walked in with no intention of eating there, either through the mall past a momentarily unpersoned host desk or from the public access viewing balcony on the 8th floor. And this is an area where there are loads upon loads of street people, some with fairly serious MH or substance issues.

There should have been help available from waitstaff backed up by mall security, but they wouldn't intervene unless asked and given the circumstances it might have been very awkward and intimidating to ask, worrying that the person might become aggressive. Or there might be no one in sight to ask. I am surprised about livestreaming inside a sit-down restaurant - SF'ns are generally pretty aggro about that kind of stuff. And unfortunately, livestreaming has been used as weapon in the USA recently, so a lot of people would react negatively if they suspected that someone was filming them without consent (which is illegal in SF).

Do restaurants in the US often allow dogs to sit at the table on the upholstered seating? Some do, and advertize it so people know - but according to their website this location doesn't allow dogs. But SF has an exception everywhere for service animals including emotional support dogs. In that case the dogs are usually very well-behaved. Of course a customer can ask to be moved if seated near one.

I don't immediately see that a crime was committed here at all, let alone one comparable to the assaults in Auckland on Saturday. But if one was, I hope Lilly got prompt help from the SF police - I found them incredibly and immediately supportive when I was a victim of a violent crime - and is recovering well after a month. I hope the victims of targeted anti-woman violence in Auckland on Saturday recover, too - but I have a fuck ton less confidence that they'll get instutional help in doing so given that the perps in those cases are all over social media gloating about bashing women, and seem to have strong ties to NZ media and even the Prime Minister.

Thanks for posting this. Violence is not the way forward.

IcakethereforeIam · 28/03/2023 00:47

That dog is adorable!

TheBiologyStupid · 28/03/2023 02:04

No kind of abuse in such a situation is warranted. The "self-identifying [...] TERF" might be mistakenly mixing up TERF and transphobe - she wouldn't be the first to do so...!

Maduixa · 28/03/2023 02:20

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CryptoFascistMadameCholet · 28/03/2023 02:22

Going up to strangers who are minding their own business and insulting them is never OK, regardless of how they dress.

But if women were on the news every time a judgey stranger insulted us we’d have channels and channels of the stuff 24/7!

We’d have so much of it we’d be able to organise it by genre (my personal worst genre would be the one that starts with a man chatting you up and ends in him screaming abuse in your face when you reject his advances).

Anyway, enough from me re: verbal abuse from strangers…

Here’s a case of actual, physical assault of a transwoman from today’s paper.

I’m glad the perp got a decent custodial sentence, intimate partner violence is an horrific experience.

Trans woman threatened with physical violence by 'TERF'
CryptoFascistMadameCholet · 28/03/2023 02:24

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Huh?

@TheBiologyStupid is a regular FWR poster. How come you don’t recognise her?

Maybe you are new here?

Top tip: you need to accurately capitalise a username in the advanced search function to see their post history.

Maduixa · 28/03/2023 02:34

CryptoFascistMadameCholet · 28/03/2023 02:24

Huh?

@TheBiologyStupid is a regular FWR poster. How come you don’t recognise her?

Maybe you are new here?

Top tip: you need to accurately capitalise a username in the advanced search function to see their post history.

You're right, sorry and thanks. And sorry also to @TheBiologyStupid. Not new here, and thought I knew how the site worked, but obviously I didn't.

CryptoFascistMadameCholet · 28/03/2023 02:44

Maduixa · 28/03/2023 02:34

You're right, sorry and thanks. And sorry also to @TheBiologyStupid. Not new here, and thought I knew how the site worked, but obviously I didn't.

TBF the search function is annoyingly picky.

It doesn’t like it if you accidentally put a space after the username either.

Katypyee · 28/03/2023 03:40

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CryptoFascistMadameCholet · 28/03/2023 03:47

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Here’s a more detailed article from The Yorkshire Post:

https://www.yorkshireeveningpost.co.uk/news/crime/woman-given-nine-year-prison-sentence-at-bradford-crown-court-after-subjecting-partner-to-truly-awful-abuse-4081786

BlueHeelers · 28/03/2023 06:54

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