Starmer: “Gender recognition will not be one of the priorities of the incoming government.”

[Rainbowshit]

www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/politics/keir-starmer-says-snp-lurched-29479637?utm_source=app

He also appeared to aim a dig at MSPs who passed the legislation: “What’s happened in Scotland is a reminder that if you want change, you have to carry the public with you.”
He also said: “Gender recognition will not be one of the priorities of the incoming government.”

Interesting. Are they finally beginning to read the room...?

Nail. Head.

About the only thing that Starmer could say at this point that would make me vote Labour would be that he will look at repealing the GRA

KS is going to have to spell the whole thing out, in mile high letters, before I'd believe a thing he said on this issue. In fact, make them neon, mile high letters.

He's a bloody liar.

In other words, exactly what Senua said.

I think maybe reactions depend on whether or not you're interested in giving Labour an incentive to do better. If you're not then that's fair enough and no more than they deserve.

But although I can't imagine ever lifting a finger for the party again, I still have a vote that I'd like to use. So, if this represents a tentative step toward a negotiation, then my response is, 'No, that's not good enough but come back with a better offer and I'll listen.'

Spot on.
I want to vote labour but won't until they openly roll back Starmer's inane declarations and Nandy's bloody dangerous preferences.
I don't need sackcloth and ashes but they've got themselves into this mess by listening to activists and abandoning women and children's rights. Time for the party to grow up, face the consequences and address the issue like grown ups.

Not good enough for me I'm afraid. They'd have to commit to not doing it before I would vote for them.

I wonder whether they are going to lose support on both sides by trying to sit on the fence, like they did with Brexit? What with that and calling anyone who disagrees with them a bigot, it seems they haven't learned anything at all from the last 10 years or so.

yes, they are bloody liars.

I want specific, definite actions spelled out in short words with a timetable.

'We will ensure that women are entitled to enjoy all the protections and rights afforded to them in the EA, that all spaces labelled as for women are single sex, and that 'woman' means a born woman and excludes a transwoman and any male bodied person.
We will ensure no males are placed in women's prisons, nor in single sex wards, nor allowed to take the place of a woman on a single sex shortlist or quota.
We will ensure all schools have toilets that are separated by sex. We will ensure all schools sex ed materials are govt approved and grounded in biological fact, and not beholden to any particular ideology.
We will protect the words 'woman', 'girl' and 'mother', and not use dehumanising language to refer to women and girls.
We will ensure males are not permitted to enter the women's category in sport.
We will ensure children with gender confusion are given good, quality support and counselling, and the highest quality evidence based healthcare.
We will ensure lesbians are respected and protected and able to enjoy the protections afforded to them in the EA, without interference from males.'

Maybe even:

'We commit to electing a female leader within the next 5 years.'

Now I'm getting carried away. I can't honestly see that ever happening.

That's interesting, thanks!

For me isues such as bills, NHS and so on are fairly temporal - in that these issues are always present to one degree or another in society; and no-one government is ever able to 'solve' the issues to everyone' satisfaction. Prices rise and fall, and services improve and decline - nothing is ever permanent in effect.

Whilst for me, the impact of gender ideology is fundamental and deeply radical in its impact; and the effect of having it imposed upon an unwilling population is deeply undemocratic and authoritarian in nature. I see how the dark and insidious nature of this ideology threatens people's ability to speak the truth; to speak their mind freely in their place of work and so on. There is so much that is dystopian about this movement.

For me once gender ideology is given even more legal backing it will severely erode, even further, the very integrity of women and girls, but children more generally - and would be a deeply regressive move on so many fronts; and a very chilling one as it seem to me to be the very apotheosis of authoritarian identity politics.

I also don't think the NHS should be funding surgery on the healthy bodies of young people for the purposes of identty affirmation - so there are more practical, economic reasons too

I agree with your last point absolutely, but no with all the others. Thanks for debating with me politely though!

What a great post @NotHavingIt.

Spells out the problems so clearly.

I also don't think the Labour party is going to be able to solve the issues that so many are concerned about - because a lot of the forces at play are global in nature, and institutions are struggling all over Europe to a greater or lesser extent with prices, fuel supply, ageing population, illegal migration and so on. I think at best they can tinker around the edges.

But self Id would be very diffuclut to repeal and would open the floodgates to the erosion of women's protections and women's dignity as a distinct group of human being; and queer theory, on which it is all based, has the aim of transgressing sexual boundaries, including those of children in a way which i find insidious and disturbing.

Now wouldn't that be amazing to watch.

Absolutely this👆

For me Kier Starmmer needs to state clearly that he believes that he will not adopt any new gender identity bill. I believe that the legislation has already gone too far in the UK but accept what is in place - any further I feel present a danger to young people in particular

Nothavingit I am right with you. I love sooty, I believe that women’s rights and the protection of children are fundamental to a decent society. For me, that’s more important. For example, sorting out the NHS is largely immaterial (in my opinion) if it then fails to ensure it offers safe spaces and safe care for women. It’s not enough to provide good healthcare if that comes with a significant risk of rape and abuse (and the risk will increase many times over if every dangerous man is permitted to self-I’d and access vulnerable women). I don’t want schools to be better funded if the price is telling our children they can change sex and that will make everything better - then putting them on puberty blockers and surgically amending their healthy bodies. I could go on…. IMO, this affects absolutely everything.

In 2018 WPUK published the five demands copied below. I didn't think there was anything hateful or unreasonable about any of them but by the 2019 GE their meetings had been aggressively disrupted by Labour Party activists and senior Labour party members had signed a declaration branding them a transphobic hate group and demanding that anyone who agreed with them was expelled from the party. Labour have made their contempt for women crystal clear and, for me, they cannot come back from this short of making repeal of the GRA a manifesto pledge.

1. Respectful and evidence-based discussion about the impact of the proposed changes to the Gender Recognition Act to be allowed to take place and for women’s voices to be heard.
2. The principle of women-only spaces to be upheld – and where necessary extended.
3. A review of how the exemptions in the Equality Act (which allow for single sex services, or requirements that only a woman can apply for a job such as in a domestic violence refuge) are being applied in practice.
4. Government to consult with women’s organisations on how self-declaration would impact on women-only services and spaces.
5. Government to consult on how self-declaration will impact upon data gathering – such as crime, employment, pay and health statistics – and monitoring of sex-based discrimination such as the gender pay gap.

Bravo Nothavingit, for articulating this so well!

Rees-Mogg is likely to hold his seat whatever she does.

I don't trust Starmer, nor do i trust the vast majority of the PLP, tbh.
I just can't in good conscience vote for, or recommend Labour.
From what i've read, the pledges he made during the leadership contest have all been ditched, yet people voted for him on the strength of those pledges. It doesn't really mark him out as being a man of his word, imo and that's not the type of person i want leading my country.
His idea of a shadow cabinet is also a dead loss afaic and as for Rayner, just no, no, no!
If an independent puts themselves forward in my area on a gc ticket, then i'd possibly vote for them but if not, my vote will go unused.

This.

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11874067/GUY-ADAMS-asks-know-whats-childs-school-library.html

It's over, they didn't manage to change the laws as Debtons suggested.

ilovesooty
So you're prepared to enable the reelection of Rees - Mogg?

I hold Labour accountable for that, they have alienated voters by adopting neoliberal identity politics.

I hope it's over and that is a very good article with lots of concrete examples of the books involved.
I fear we are going to have to keep pushing back for a very long time. The seemingly malevolent forces at work did not get so far so quickly for no reason. It will be hard to roll back and many other EU countries have already passed self-id = the predator's charter.

Parents, Aunts, Uncle's and Grandparents are going to go nuts reading that article. It goes into all the details. I haven't seen anything like that before.

It reminds me of Jimmy Saville at first people were saying the girls were saying it for money, they never apologised to me for beong nasty to me calling me an idiot for believing them etc then eventually they accepted it.

The Guardian lot will not accept it as they have no clue what's going on and like it that way.

The floating voters Labour want will be going nuts reading that. Labour has the Guardian readers on the bag he wants to mail readers to vote for him to win.

Yes it's not the gender recognition as a priority I worry about. It's allowing the ideology to creep into our children's education without any clear policies or rules.

My 3 kids are still babies so I have time to sort in my head how I will deal with all this (although I imagine they'll be something else equallly terrifying by then) but my teenage niece has decided she is a boy (off and on when she feels like it) it's so hard because I genuinely feel she's being brainwashed by tik tok and lack of normal teenage social interactions and experimentation (as far as I know she's never done any normal rebel stuff like kissing boys and girls, smoking weed, drinking etc) since lockdown.

Instead of 'we support you, live a little first, see how you feel' the response is to keep her out of school most days and ask her every day what she prefers her pronouns to be that day...