KJK's film out at 8pm tonight

[lochmaree]

This is about the rights of a child to know who their two biological parents are. That's it.

Kara Dansky’s eloquent response to Jeni Harvey’s Twitter comments regarding KJK’s film:

karadansky.substack.com/p/on-how-unremarkable-jeni-harvey-thinks

Here’s an excerpt:

“This post is, instead, in support of the countless American women who spent their own time, energy, and money to speak out about the harms of “gender identity,” all across the country throughout the summer and fall of 2022, and who worked very hard to make the film happen.”

The only person, after childhood, who needs the birth certificate is the person whose birth it records. The information should be as accurate as possible.

You're right it's the child's.

To have a lie on the birth certificate had been devastating for people I know who have discovered the truth later in their life.

It's not just a piece is paper representing who brought you up as mum and dad, mum and mum or dad and dad. It's your lineage. It's where you got your eye colour, your height, your sticking out ears, your rare genetic blood disease, your badly functioning kidneys from.

It's the piece of paper that stops you inadvertently marrying your half brother.

And it doesn't give a stuff about the sexual preferences of the people who brought the Child up and wether they are currently treated fairly in law and in society today. It's not about them

A child knowing their biological history is important but there is no need for this to be stated on their birth certificate.

A birth certificate is a legal document that states who has parental rights for that child.

And no it is not fucking entitled for lesbian couples to want equal parental rights for a child they are raising together. If you don't think lesbians deserve this then you're a fucking homophobe.

Once you are an adult a birth certificate is purely an identity document, no one cares who your biological parents are.

Fuck me. I cannot believe you can’t see it.

You birth certificate shows where you were born, the date you were born, all your names, and your parents. It is a record of who you are.

It is not a document for your parents.

It is for you. To use, for the rest of your life, whenever required.

To be honest I find that casual disregard for another person’s identity, rooted in their sense of belonging and ancestry, a bit, erm…… how shall I put it… low empathy/high narcissism.

I find your casual disregard for the rights of lesbian parents to be homophobic so we will have to agree to disagree.

Receipts

Where else should it be stated apart from the certificate of birth?

Nobody is saying that lesbians don't have rights FFS this is about the child.

What don't you get. None of us are being homophobic we are centering the person who the birth certificate belongs to, the Child, at the top of who gets the most say in what's recorded about their true biological being.

That doesn't lessen anything for the two mother's or two father's..

This is about the Child not the feelings of rights of the people who bring up the Child.

Not homophobic.

I think this is the creep isn’t it?

In another thread Sappho, you suggested that lesbians have more rights than other couples, ie:

1. The ‘right’ to a man’s sperm, to be provided by the state, in order to become mothers.
2. The ‘right’ for healthy, fertile lesbians, to access state-provided, expensive fertility treatments.

It’s grabby fucking entitlement.

And grabby entitlement looks an awful lot like the genderists.

Im, just imaging the shock of my sister(and her wife when she goes home and tells her) when I tell her us lot on here are now homophobic and the reason why. Mainly because obviously I'm not, and two because my sister agreed with me on this. Birth certificate is for the Child. Not something to validate the adults bringing the Child up.

I get it, you oppose gay rights.

Totally understandable how T piggy backed on LGB with these attitudes.

You seem to have mushroomed ‘gay rights’ to mean something a bit different from what I always understood.

Please explain what you think lesbians and gays have a right to, beyond freedom from discrimination. Please don’t just make sweeping statements like ‘equal this and equal that’ if you are looking to upend biology, trample children’s rights and have massive dystopian state intervention to ‘equalise’.

Then I can say whether I oppose what you think those rights are.

Birth registration is the right of a child to have a recognised legal identity and the rights that follow on from this such as a nationality, education, and legal protection.

Seriously how do you get that from the threads on this board?

I for one do not oppose gay rights. But you need to be realistic that sometimes what might be best for you is not going to best for a child. Lying on a birth certificate is one of those things.

I would really appreciate Sappho and Amanda laying out what they think lesbian and gay rights are.

What they seem to be implying is for LGB to have an ‘equal’ right to everything heterosexuals have naturally, and for the state to be obliged to provide this and where it is physically impossible, for the state to fudge language and law so it appears to be equal on paper, even if this involves lying and trampling children’s rights.

Seems really TRA. Men wanting an ‘equal’ right to everything women have.

I think it is radical.

And it’s really similar. Any ‘hang on a minute, run that past me again?’ called ‘transphobia’ or ‘opposing trans rights’.

Could we spin this birth cert discussion onto a new thread of its own? It’s an interesting debate but I would like to hear what people thought about KJK’s film and this thread has deviated from that topic.

@EndlessTea

Yes LGB people should have absolutely equal rights to straight people. Most people who accept this (the majority of people) consider themselves to be LGBT allies which is why it gets confusing.

TRAs come along and claim that male people should be able to claim women's rights. Of course this is fucking outrageous.

TRAs get support from the LGB community as TRAs remind gay men and lesbian women about the people who oppose gay marriage, fertility equality, lesbian couples both being on a child's birth certificate etc etc. This is all very recent history.

This is why TRAs have managed to capture so many orgs.

Lesbians can't be the natural parents of a child Sappho, that's biology not homophobia.