Experiences of a Trans Person

[invalide]

I think it might be healthy to document here the experiences of someone from the other side, and for you to pay it some mind.

I'm an early-twenties STEM student working in renewable energies, and outside of my course I'm a photographer and musician. I've travelled a fair amount and adore my home country of Scotland. Living in Glasgow, I have found a queer community of beautiful people who create a joy to everyday life I treasure.

At the beginning of this month there was a 'Let Women Speak' rally held here that some of you here attended; I have seldom felt more unwelcome and stripped of dignity than while in your crowd, carrying out my photojournalistic duties (images 1&2). While capturing Kellie-Jay Keen pathologising my friends as subhuman perverts and members of the crowd flaunting their homophobia and their use of dogwhistles (subliminal far-right messaging) I was being brazenly looked up and down, receiving steely gazes and pursed lips and hushed whispers behind my back. While photographing the first speaker after Keen, who began her piece portraying autistic people as children devoid of agency, I was approached by one of you who made it clear I looked too queer for their liking and was squaring up for assault. I made my way out at this point (captured at 8:42 here and 9:09 here).
The atmosphere your movement brought to George Square was one I've only before experienced while documenting far-right rallies in Eastern Europe, where I have been hounded through the streets and beaten up for the same reason. I assure you, your ideology would feel very much at home there.

At the other side of the square things couldn't have been more different, you were bathed in colour and music and hugs and laughter, the place is full of friends dancing and dressed resplendent in whatever camp pretty things they felt like (images 2&3).

Ours was a crowd of locals; I strained to hear a Glasgow accent in yours.

Ours is a city that at short notice manages to fill the top of Buchanan Street (image 5) in solidarity with the queer community - the last time I saw it like this was during COP26. It's one that fills George Square in a candlelit vigil for Brianna Ghey.

Your movement has meant I'm called a pervert and a groomer while going about my average daily life. Our morally vacuous, increasingly fascist political class (thinking also of Magnus Hirschfeld and of Martin Niemöller's famous poem) is picking up what you've started and they're running with it. You may not call yourself a homophobe, a white nationalist or an antisemite, but you're sitting awfully comfortably considering that those that do find your movement incredibly attractive.

"This is why I do more than just sit at a keyboard on a site like this. I get involved in consultations. I fight to find a middle ground so that everyone is supported and safe. I don't just completely dismiss sections of people."

I think your prejudices about people who post on this board has come through with this post. Thank you for posting it.

You seem to think that you are unique here. I can assure you, that you are not unique in the slightest. Many of us are doing just what you are doing.

"But screaming that they're all just perverts and it's all just a sexual kink doesn't help us move toward everyone being kept safe."

and

"All I did was say that not all trans people are perverts. But go at it."

And how bizarre. There is that sleight of hand again.

Please, start posting the evidence that posters on this thread have done this.

I think many posters on this thread have been very clear. The proportions for a male with a trans identity to commit sex crimes and violence against women and children is at least the very same as the whole of the general male population.

This. That's the entire point. Many of us get involved in consultations, we're not just "sitting at a keyboard" . But I'm going to point this fact out, every time. Biological males, regardless of gender identity, are a much higher risk to women and girls, statistically, than women are. It's also a matter of privacy and dignity. And fairness, quite often.

I didn't say I did, I asked how you tell as you seem to know how we can work this out before they harass, assault, rape or murder us. So if you could share that it would be great.

Yes, what's this reasonable solution we're all too busy screaming to see, @JusteanBiscuits?

And while we're finding this 'middle ground' and 'not dismissing entire groups of people', how are we going to provide access and facilities for the entire group of female people who cannot use mixed sex spaces? At all?

The 'middle ground' invariably means 'making women accept men in their spaces'.

No. The GRA was the middle ground. Men broke it. How they identified at the time may no difference of any kind. Women are not male servicing units, obliged to suck up disadvantage, danger, assault and exclusion to provide male people with what they happen to want this decade.

Excellent post.

Quite,I've no clue why he's hanging around this place when he could be frolicking in green fields filled with the aroma of golden,glittery farts.

I do absolutely love this assumption from relatively new posters who have arrived to 'sort it all out' in their superior wisdom, that the women in FWR have never had any experience or spent years reading about this, and got to the point of 'no' because of that journey and study and endless discussions and negotiations. We have looked at and tried all the 'middle ground' and it doesn't work. You'll find out why as you continue to study.

Most of us have stood on this path of naivety and not fully understanding all the issues and beliefs involved before we reached the hag who says no to men cheese and coffee stop.

So, DO you acknowledge that at least the same proportion of male people with a trans identity are likely to commit sex crimes and violent crimes as the rest of the male population?

What different safeguards do you think we are asking compared to you?

"I stay polite. I don't name call. I don't shout."

And you supported an OP who does this. I did not see you support women who were out there discussing their experiences. I suspect that you find issue with women speaking their thoughts about this at rallies, that you find women speaking to be 'shouting' and 'screaming' maybe? Is this assumption right?

"Like I say, the more people scream that the BIG danger is trans women, the more men can just carry on in the shadows and avoid being discussed."

And tell us, when the men in the shadows are finally dealt with, will we be allowed to discuss all the other male people who have at least the same propensity to commit sex crime and violence ?

Or can some of us disagree with you and deal with ALL males now? Without you using distortions and hyperbole to uphold what seems like your own pretty deep prejudices about women who disagree with you ?

I don't think the 'you are calling us all pervents' means much. It's a red herring from what actually is going on. We know that there is a statistical issue with sex offenders and presenting as trans. This can't be ignored - if it is, it harms the interests of 'genuine trans people'.

There needs to be nuance and gatekeeping on this to protect the interests of trans people and to protect women. It is the unavoidable elephant in the room in which trans people and women should be on the same side. And it begs questions if the response is to try and throw women under the bus and to try and bury these type of statistics.

If you are stood saying these statistics aren't important, the only thing that matters is my identity and to hell with women or the interests of other trans people, you are enabling sex offenders to offend. I don't think that's a good look. Especially from a group willing to sling mud at guilt by association by accusing women of being far right (despite the extensive evidence to the contrary on their political leanings).

But more that this, on this thread it's being used actively as an excuse. It's a reason to act in an unacceptable, antisocial way. All whilst hiding behind an identity and victim complex to absolve responsibility for that. It's not my fault, women are making me do it. Women who made him create a MN account, log in, take photos, post a series of messages and threats. Obviously against the OPs will and beyond their control.

Is the OP a sexual deviant or prevent?
I can see no evidence for that.

Is the OP acting in a misogynistic way?
Yes. I highlighted that. There are numerous examples. We've seen identikit examples on a regular basis too.

Is the OP acting in a way to give women cause for concern?
OP is threatening. OP is trying to document the faces of women to intimidate and silence. The OP is accusing women of being far right (whilst saying it's unacceptable to tar by association) which may pose a threat to their employment / reputation etc

Is the OP a threat to women?
The OP is acting in a way which appears consistent with male pattern violence. Whether this makes him a threat to women is still open to debate. (Given the pattern of behaviour being identifiable as male, I will use pronouns accordingly) However since his intention is to threaten and intimate and he makes this very clear, women are responding to this. This response is fair given his behaviour. They are acting to protect themselves in a non-aggressive manner. They are 'on their own patch' on MN. They are not harassing the OP. They are not staging an online invasion. They are defending themselves and simply saying no. They are stating that they are uncomfortable with males who act in a intimidating way and have form for threatening them in their own spaces. They are saying they want their own spaces away from males who do this for their own mental health and well being.

Is this a fair response by women?
I leave this for the reader to assess.

I hope this thread is allowed to stand.

Yes, there are football teams that impose the rule of Under 18s not being able to change with the adults. When Lauren James played for Man United a couple of years back, she had to change in a different room to the rest of the team because she was 17 and because of safeguarding. And the odds of her being harmed by her teammates were hugely less than the odds as soon as a male enters a female space. She apparently coped with it though!

Taken from today's excellent article by Sex Matters: sex-matters.org/posts/updates/searching-for-a-simple-answer/

the right to “live in a chosen gender” (with or without a certificate) is not a right to distort reality, subject other people to humiliating treatment or compel others to act as if they believe the person has actually changed sex,

As the article concludes, trans rights are human rights and other people's rights are human rights too.

To state that is not hateful or justifying of violence to a typically balanced mind. But this is what women are saying that is leading to a political group calling to behead them. In public. As if this is a normal thing to think about anyone who has displeased you, as opposed to indicative of fairly major issues. And 'middle ground' would have to equally respect the rights in the quote above to the wishes of a male person who wishes to use female spaces.

You have a big problem there. And your problem will be that male people do not want to permit this.

I don't know if the OP will come back, but, if he does, concerning the event in Glasgow I'd like to ask him:

Why does he think the Police were there? What would have happened if they hadn't been? Who does he think will have got hurt?

Two quick things

I think the number of deleted posts responding to me is quite telling

not really, there is a completely different system on FWR for posts both for how a post is worded and how they are reported. Its not necessarily because posts are attacking you, though obviously there may be the odd one….

All I did was say that not all trans people are perverts

yeah no one has said this

if you persist in saying that posters on FWR think that then thats an outright lie, you can be as polite as you like 🤷🏻

Love the new name Rufus

Thank you Eresh 😀

couldn’t resist

I was being brazenly looked up and down, receiving steely gazes and pursed lips and hushed whispers behind my back.

Every woman gets that from men all the time from puberty onwards. If your transition is MtF you'd better get used to it.

I think OP's posts are quite scary really.
You can see how the TRA mob are psyching themselves up to 'fight fascism' and of course, that means any violence they commit is justified. They dehumanise women as TERFs and then it's OK if they get hurt as they were on the bad side anyway.
Unfortunately, I think it's only a matter of time until someone on the GC side at protests is seriously hurt. I hope I'm wrong but the TRAs seem to be spiralling more out of control as criticism of trans ideology becomes mainstream.

Yes. I am boggling at the people who instead of calling out this violence-justifying rhetoric for what it is, an attempt to intimidate women, thought it more important to scold women for our wrongthink about gender identity. They are a big part of the problem.

It seems the OP and their supporters need to work harder to reframe their trauma.

I'm really glad this thread hasn't been nuked. It's sunlight to the tactics used by trans rights activists. Can someone archive it just in case it is pulled?

It was pulled yesterday for a short while and some of the posts were deleted.
Guessing MN are keeping a close watch

"Brazenly" is a word that to my mind is only used about women. It implies a lack of modesty, of decorum. I think it makes it pretty clear what the OP thinks and expects of women.

Similarly the eyes are "steely" rather than cold, and the lips "pursed" rather than tight. But it's very familar behavior.

OP… you really didn’t think your post through. You seem to be riding high on misogynistically manufactured victimhood.

Yep.

My son met a fellow male university student who said he was a woman. I’m not sure why it came up exactly but my son told his new acquaintance, ‘My mum’s a terf’ (something my son is kinda proud of, seeing as his mates are all ‘trans rights in the streets, utter terf in the sheets’ and are too cowed to speak honestly about it).

This young male student’s response was ‘Don’t let me anywhere near her or I’ll punch her straight in the face’. To which my boy pointed out that threatening to punch your mate’s middle aged mum in the face because she doesn’t believe that women can have penises was a) a bit unhinged and b) a bit unwise because ‘Mum’s pretty hench & knows a lot of Hells Angels’ 🤣

“I was being brazenly looked up and down, receiving steely gazes and pursed lips and hushed whispers behind my back.”

Just a reminder to all those reading along.

This was a young male who fit the profile of the demographic of the people threatening the women gathering, leaving the policed group and moving amongst the women taking photos of them.

One who we now see as believing threats and violence against women is just ‘retaliation’.

And there are posters supporting this young male person’s view. And saying how sorry they are that this young male person moving amongst the women taking their photo was treated this way- ”brazenly looked up and down, receiving steely gazes and pursed lips and hushed whispers behind my back”.

While seeming to ignore or dismiss the violence shown against the women at the rally. A rally where women share their experiences.

And we have had numerous posters who ignore the violence against women because they disagree with those women before on these threads. One, a feminist declared they were a ‘real feminist’, one that was doing so much more than the posters on MN FWR dismissed violence against women at these rallies over numerous threads. Because of their own political aims.

If you needed any further evidence that some people have been given a pass by others to act in the way the OP has, this is the thread to show it.