KJK opposing fertility treatment for gay couples

[SapphosRock]

KJK seems to have an ongoing beef with same sex couples having fertility treatment. Why? How is this benefiting women's rights?

Is is definitely not benefiting lesbian rights.

It also appears to be attracting all the homophobes on Twitter.

I want to support the woman....

Yet more dishonesty from you Sapphos. You don't have to like her so there is no need to lie about it. Your repeated attempts to smear KJK are very transparent.

Oh stop with the conspiracy theories.

Pointing out a Tweet has anti lesbian undertones does not equate to reporting the Tweeter to the police for homophobia.

If I remember rightly, the original police call said she had been homophobic. So this fits right into the TRA playbook of manipulating evidence to make it look like 'homophobia' in order to be referenced in some way.

It really is a vile manipulation and harassment that I'd suggest might need to be investigated in itself.

I don't think anyone actually said that did they? But it's an interesting suggestion.

I know someone will shout 'Having a child is not a right!' But I don't hear them shouting that to the straight women on the IVF board.

Probably because most of the people who think this have better ways to spend their time than going on the IVF board to harangue people who have a different opinion to them knowing that to do so would just needlessly upset a lot of people.

Regardless of the rights or wrongs, or any other issue surrounding fertility, same sex couples, or surrogacy I'm not at all sure that this new campaign strand is at all helpful when it come sto the primary objective of pushing back on gender ideology. It will, inevitably, fuel homophobic accusation and will also play into religious right associations.

Maybe Posie's biggest audienece, and biggest impact, going forward may well be in the U.S - where she has already made a bit of a name for herself. And it is in the U.S where the tide needs most to be turned.

Yes, it is deceitful and spiteful. It is so stupid though, nobody with a functioning braincell, would fail to see it for what it is.

No, i hope its not that but its a suggestion

wee bit like the suggestion that posters on here are homophobic for agreeing with that tweet and that the entire board thinks that lesbians should lie back and think of england

I know you haven’t actually said that

but what im reading between the lines of your unposted thoughts is…..

Yes,I'm almost certain that the caller mentioned something like 'a homophobic slur'.

You are completely misrepresenting what she actually wrote in her tweet.

And again it is not anti anything it is just a statement of fact.

The fact you have gotten it so twisted and are reading into it things that it just does not say or imply is on you.

I don't know what triggered the KJK tweet but she commented a couple of days previously about surrogacy.

And then following on from the infertility tweet, she tweeted again to say that we should be centring the baby's welfare in all of this.

I think it's hard to argue against any of that.

The thing is, no one wants to be homophobic. No one wants anyone else to struggle with fertility. But no one can be guaranteed a child, just as no one can be guaranteed good health.

We've allowed stuff in the name of 'be kind' that is not at all kind to babies.

You just can't have two opposite things at the same time.
If you want a baby, you need a bloke involved somewhere. If you don't want a bloke involved, you can't have a baby.

I want to support the woman but when she Tweets that lesbians trying to procreate is not a fertility issue she is claiming lesbians should not have access to state funded fertility treatment.

Except she isn't claiming that. She is stating a simple fact (based on what the word "fertility" actually means), and you are inferring that she believes lesbians should not have access to state funded fertility treatment. Your inference may be correct, but it may be wrong.

It must be very hard to go through life choosing to believe the worst possible twist you can put on other people's words. It must be exhausting.

OP, If you genuinely believe it's a fertility issue, maybe post on the infertility boards and see what kind of response you get.

Actually, don't do that. The idea that same-sex couples have a fertility issue is hugely offensive.

Quite!

it’s one thing to discuss these matters in theory and another to shout them in an
individuals face.

I have some pretty big issues with grammar schools in their current iteration (middle class kids tutored within an inch of their lives or sent to private prep with the sole aim of state grammar entry, property hot spots in catchments etc) but I don’t stand outside the nearest grammar at 4pm shouting the appalling discrepancy in free school meal recipient percentages between the grammar and the nearest high school at parents through a loudhailer 🤷‍♀️

She has made it crystal clear in the follow up Tweet. Donor conceived children do not have the biological connections of children conceived by straight couples.

Of course KJK is entitled to her opinion but this is anti lesbian.

So the OP views 'fertility issues' as wanting to have a child but not being able to conceive.
So it applies equally to:
Lesbian couples
Gay male couples
Single straight women
Single straight men
Celibate heterosexual couples.

If they want a child they would all need the same sort of intervention a heterosexual couple would need if their reproductive biology was not working.

It's describing infertility as wanting something you cannot have, but the reasons are different.

For this to be logically and fairly applied we'd need to offer the same level of treatment to anyone who wanted a baby but who couldn't have one for any reason.

E.g. single heterosexual women would get fertility treatment on the NHS because they didn't have a partner.
Would you support that OP?

Probably because most of the people who think this have better ways to spend their time than going on the IVF board to harangue people who have a different opinion to them knowing that to do so would just needlessly upset a lot of people.

And yet it's perfectly acceptable for KJK to pass judgment on lesbians who conceive using donor conception?

That is going to needlessly upset a lot of lesbians.

This is common to all donor conceived children regardless of the sexual orientation
of the parents!

We do get told this. My DH is infertile. You have no idea how many of his friend's offered to provide us with sperm. A few offered "to do it in the usual way", others offered to go via an IVF clinic, others offered to proceed for a turkey baster at home.

Clearly OP, you have absolutely zero experience in this arena.

Gay people are not suffering from infertility. They are suffering from lack of sperm or lack of egg and womb. There are non-medical options available for both, including the old turkey baster which doesn't require any medical at all or surrogacy via the same route.

There is also no treatment for infertile men BTW. Azoospermia cannot be treated, fixed, cured. Go look it up.

But it's not needless if one's viewpoint is that it's not in children's best interests.

If someone really believes that then they should prioritise advocating for children above the feelings of adults.

You disagree and find it offensive, but that doesn't mean it's homophobic or shouldn't be said or has no basis.

I'm done with 'this upsets me' as a rationale for closing debate.

A lot of KJK’s views on this stuff have been formed by listening to lesbians such as Dr Sheila Jeffreys and Dr Julia Long

Straight single women also have babies via donor conception.

These opinions are not a heterosexual women/homosexual women divide and it’s completely disingenuous of you to suggest it is.

Indeed, the op is the only person inventing stating that. That is not in the tweet by KJK, only in the op's post.

You added the bit about state funded treatment all by yourself...