KJK opposing fertility treatment for gay couples

[SapphosRock]

KJK seems to have an ongoing beef with same sex couples having fertility treatment. Why? How is this benefiting women's rights?

Is is definitely not benefiting lesbian rights.

It also appears to be attracting all the homophobes on Twitter.

That tweet isn't either homophobic or anti-lesbian. She's just stating the obvious fact that two people of the same sex can't get either pregnant.

Do you really consider that homophobic?

Can't believe that there is a poster insinuating that infertility is the reason two people of the same sex can't conceive with each other. And, indeed it is homophobic to not agree. That cannot be earnest.

The tweet isn't anti lesbian, it is stating a fact.

The only one comparing the tweet to the things you list is you.

How do we put this.

To make a baby, you need a man and a woman.

Sometimes there are problems and they need ‘fertility treatment’.

Sometimes there are problems and they choose abortion, euphemistically referred to as ‘reproductive rights’.

For people who are not infertile, or not having heterosexual sex, then ‘fertility treatments’ and ‘reproductive rights’ are not relevant to them.

However, these terms have been appropriated to suggest that the NHS should make expensive services available, when they are not needed, or to frame the buying and selling of babies and the exploitation of women as ‘reproductive rights’ and ‘fertility treatment’.

No, the LGBT isn’t all one thing - you don’t need to tell US that.

However a straight woman can be sex repulsed or romantically disinterested in men too, and her options for getting pregnant are the same as lesbian women, and for bisexual women without male partners.

Known donor, anon donor, platonic male coparent or childfree.

KJK is only being homophobic if she has applies different standards to the straight single woman than to the lesbian or bisexual woman, she she doesn’t, none of us do.

Not having an opposite sex partner to make babies the standard evolutionary way with is not infertility - it is bloody inconvenient, but it is not infertility.

If this is truly a ‘gay rights’ issue in your mind please, do tell us your ideas for solving ‘social infertility’ for male homosexual couples that is equal to those you propose for female homosexual couples? If you don’t care about male homosexuals having equal opportunities to become parents then it’s not really a gay rights issue at all, is it?

“We are not the same. Lesbians having children is not the same as men using surrogates”

^I do agree that donor conception and use of a surrogate are very different to each other. However asserting the people have a right to be supported to have children even though they don’t have the biological means between them necessitates use of someone else’s body and/or body parts. That part makes me feel uneasy. That of course can apply to people regardless of their sexuality but will always apply to couples of the same sex.

It’s just more of the same old IDPOL nonsense that pretends men can be women.

Sapphos are you really so determined to smear KJK that you continue to make such a fool of yourself over something a primary school child understands?

You are really looking silly and desperate now TBH.

What focus on gay and lesbian people. She said she’s against all donor conception and IVF. No mention of gay and lesbian people.

Look, I agree with KJK’s take on many things. But this tweet has brought out all the homophobes and I do not believe for one second that KJK wouldn’t have known that would happen. She knows what crowd tweets like this are playing to. As I said, criticise surrogacy, criticise the use of donor gametes, critique the idea of ‘fertility equality’ but be specific on the issues.

It isn't infertility. It's reproductive incompatibility.

This. Of course two women or two men cannot have children. It's biologically not possible. Same for other mammals!

As I said, criticise surrogacy, criticise the use of donor gametes, critique the idea of ‘fertility equality’

What people know and love about KJK is her simple, straightforward, no-nonsense communication. She does criticise all of the above in her own way. What she said was totally in keeping with it.

This.

She is courting homophobes and alienating lesbian women.

Though I suppose gay people having children is considered woke and lefty.

Though I suppose gay people having children is considered woke and lefty.

Considered by who? KJK? A specific poster? Everyone posting here??

Right wing gay parents also exist.

Gay and lesbian couples who do surrogacy or IVF or IUI are not infertile, so no, it's not a fertility issue...it's a 'I don't have an opposite sexed partner to make a baby with' issue.

There's a lot of differing opinions on the use of IVF and surrogacy for any person regardless of sexual orientation.

As a feminist, my positions regarding gay and lesbians as parents are pretty common - LGB couples have every right to be parents and I don't see why they can't be as good or as bad of parents as any straight person.

Now, when you get into surrogacy, I don't think gay or straight couples should engage in it, particularly commercialized surrogacy as it so clearly exploits women and commodifies our bodies. Not all straight couples who use surrogacy are infertile - some just don't want to be inconvenienced by a pregnancy (see celebrities).

Egg selling puts health risks on women and exploits young women's naïveté about motherhood and long-term consequences, and I'm opposed to it, especially after my 15-yr old was sent ads about 'donating her eggs for a trip to Paris'.

I personally know lesbian couples and single women who have used donated sperm. I think there should be better regulations on that industry to prevent abuses, but no man is at a health risk by selling his sperm, so it's quite different from egg selling.

Brandy Carlise is a good example of a lesbian woman who had children w/ her wife and used a good friend's sperm, who is active in their children's lives. This seems like the best solution IMO and what I'd want if I were a lesbian...co-parenting is something that can benefit children because all children have a right to know who their parents are, and, if possible and safe, have a relationship with them. One thing to note about Carlisle's wife - she wanted to carry Brandy's embryo, but she had a very awful pregnancy as a result, which is a risk when a woman carries a baby not genetically her own. To me, this is an example of an industry that failed to counsel these women about the risks. They both acknowledge they'd have carried their own babies if they'd known.

Look at your silly thread title Sappho.

“opposing fertility treatment for gay couples”

Clearly you hadn’t really thought about the fact that lesbian/gay couples don’t need ‘fertility treatment’, they just need a member of the opposite sex to make a baby with.

It's a shame because I'd actually started to like KJK

Really🤔so why the urge to find fault in a NOT homophobic perfectly factual tweet?

Thank god for the majority of sane comments.
Fact is not homophobic, fact is not feeling, fact is not opinion. Fact is fact, and as a society we need to respect fact without people screaming 'OFFENSE!'

Two fertile women, who cannot conceive because neither produce sperm, is not a fertility issue. It is a reproduction issue.

Gosh, of all the posts addressing you directly @SapphosRock - including the ones asking you to reply to KJK to ask her why she posted that- you chose to respond to the one that was also making a veiled accusation of homophobia.

You're as transparent as cling film.

Lesbian couple here who had a round of IVF on the NHS ✋

We didn't get it because we're gay though. My wife had some pre IVF tests done and found out she had a blocked Fallopian tube which ended up being removed. This made us eligible for a round on the NHS because she had fertility issues.

We use a donor, from the Scandinavian sperm bank and have 3 children. They know all about the donor and can contact him when they're older. They can also contact siblings. We have a full family medical record check. They have more information on their donor family than I know about my biological family 😂

Being a lesbian couple does not make you infertile. But you can be an infertile lesbian.

I think this says very much more about you than about KJK Sapphos. What a shit show.

I'm trying to process the op's understanding of human reproduction. So, the op thinks that two people of the same sex cannot reproduce with each other due to 'infertility'. What about two fertile people of the same sex? They are not infertile. Does the op believe they could reproduce with each other, I wonder? Infertility isn't an impediment.

Also
Ovum+ ovum resulting in no baby is homophobic.
Sperm + sperm resulting in no baby is homophobic.

That's fucking disgusting. You wouldn't tell a straight woman to close her eyes and think of England while someone who isn't her husband impregnates her. Wtf

Although, while we were going through our first round of IVF an actual doctor asked us why we don't just go get knocked up by a random on a night out 🙄 so nothing surprises me.

This is desperate, Sapphos. Cannot believe how much space KJK takes up in your head. There's no space left for your own common sense or discernment.

You do know how babies are made, don't you? Are you seriously saying that all gay and lesbian couples are infertile? You must see that this is nonsense.