KJK v the Police this Friday

[Birdsweepsin]

Kellie is still getting harassed by TRAs it seems. Come and support if you can at Trowbridge Police Station, midday on 24th Feb.

She asked for carrots this afternoon to help pay her legal fees and she is close to 5 and a half already, more than the 3 she needed urgently. What a woman.

AlisonDonut

The interview has nothing to do with tripping anyone up. They are given the reason/offence prior to the interview and her solicitor gets pre-interview disclosures in any case

She can answer the questions how she wants, or go 'no-reply' or have a break to consultant with her solicitor part way through. She can just produce a pre written defence statement at the start and say nothing else. She can even walk out before the interview starts if she wants to.

if she was wearing a BWV the whole time - great. I hope she brings the footage in. might be able to NFA the case quickly.

The interview has nothing to do with tripping anyone up.

Minimising again. It seems denial and minimisation is endemic in the police force.

I mean most people do assume that the purpose is to get the them to incriminate themself, but the poster you're contradicting actually had police confirmation of it!

"We had one officer who gave us all the details of how he would trip them up and how he found it most hilarious and was the best bit of the job."

No wonder the public have such a low opinion of them.

Those were the words...of a police officer. Why not investigate him?

This vociferously aggressive group have already shown that even the most vulnerable - traumatized rape victims being targeted, babies shouted at - are not off limits. If anything, they seem to make a beeline for them. And the police are not interested: too busy pursuing women's rights campaigners.

I wouldn't, personally.

"if she was wearing a BWV the whole time - great. I hope she brings the footage in. might be able to NFA the case quickly."

So all she has to do is provide a continuous video feed of the entire outing, the detectives will spend many hours looking through it and then NFA it.

I'm guessing she doesn't have a personal team of detectives, and that they have to time-slice between multiple open cases. That doesn't sound exactly... quick ... to me.

I have no issue with police interviews “tripping up” interviewees because tripping up quite literally means catching an interviewee lying through their teeth.

To be all shock horror how can the public trust the police because they catch liars lying to them is unfathomable.

The alternative you are demanding is that police believe any cock and bull yarn spun for them and happily lap it up.

As your hero KJK is a modern day saint, and would never lie to the police, there won’t be any tripping up of her. And as her satanic enemy the crying Wolf TRA who made the complaint is obviously a big fat liar, wouldn’t you want the police to trip them up at their interview?

Or are you envisioning that police investigation should work like a talent contest and the best, most entertaining story teller wins?

I have no issue with police interviews “tripping up”

There you go Felix. Even your allies agree.

When people on your side disagree with you that "The interview has nothing to do with tripping anyone up.", you might want to reflect.

Why is “tripping up” bad to you Datun? I still do not understand why you think it’s somehow morally bad for the police to catch someone in their own web of lies?

Why are you so worried KJK might be “tripped up”? That would imply you think she regularly lies to the police and her lies are somehow justified?

In 2 minutes you can find dozens of youtube videos from solicitors, barristers, active and retired police officers telling you in no uncertain words 'the police are not your friends' 'don't talk to the police without legal advice' 'say as little as possible, including nothing'.

here's a basic search to start with if anyone is curious

https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=talk+to+police

Haha!! Take it up with Felix mate, he's the one denying it.

And yet felix cant understand her choice of solicitor apparently and bug is fuming about us all helping her pay for it!

And all that evidence in the Postmasters case was examined by their defence solicitors, CPS and the judges/jury who accepted it.

Well, that's not entirely true, because Toshiba and the Post Office knew from the outset that the accounting software made money seem to disappear. The deliberately chose to withhold that evidence and later, deny that it happened, that they knew and that it had happened.

Private Eye were reporting on it 20 years ago and were ridiculed as conspiracists.

As for the Police tripping people up; they've used the tactic since the dawn of time, to frame vulnerable people. There are many cases, in which they have bullied confessions out of wholly innocent people and anyone who supports that really ought to go and live somewhere which reflects their values.

Iran, Qatar, North Korea etc.

I believe the Post Office had investigatory powers and the ability to bring prosecutions itself, so I'm not sure how much police or CPS involvement there was. (The RSPCA has been criticised for the way it has exerted its own similar powers.)

Oh, you’ve done more than that. You’ve paid for her solicitor 5-6x over what it costs. And you’re quite happy for KJK to pocket the difference.

The provocateur gig is a well known con. Im not surprised that you’ve fallen for it Datun.

You still haven’t answered why you think police “tripping up” people that are lying to them is somehow wrong? And would reduce public confidence in them?

Oh, you’ve done more than that. You’ve paid for her solicitor 5-6x over what it costs. And you’re quite happy for KJK to pocket the difference.

Of course, who wouldn't. And watching TRAs implode over her huge following and her, er, hair is only part of it, honestly.

The provocateur gig is a well known con. Im not surprised that you’ve fallen for it Datun.

See my comment above.

People who have given their own cash to KJK have the right to do so and exert their own agency, @Onnabugeisha. I'm sure you'd like to be able to control how women use their own money, but as yet we don't live under your thumb. You seem aggrieved that KJK is popular and easily raised her target amount.

You still haven’t answered why you think police “tripping up” people that are lying to them is somehow wrong? And would reduce public confidence in them?

You're confusing me with some else.

She needs a shit hot solicitor because she is experienced in the way these interviews operate.

It's you who's complaining about paying for it and Felix who thinks any old jobsworth will do.

Women paying substantial amounts of money for the services they want does appear to get up both your collective noses tho.

I have very happily donated to KJK. I imagine it will all be spent on campaigning or security or legal fees but if she wants to spend any extra she's raised on a luxury spa break or massive bottle of champagne then she thoroughly deserves it for the amazing work she does!

Hear hear, I agree.

Onnabugeisha · Today 09:38

You still haven’t answered why you think police “tripping up” people that are lying to them is somehow wrong?

In case you missed it the first time, it's the dishonest twisting of words and conning people into saying something untrue, or ambiguous, to coerce innocent people into false confessions, or something false, which can be presented to a jury.

Ask someone to describe an event and then do the same a week later and you'll get two slightly different versions. The Police use these differences as a "Gotcha! You're lying!" tactic.

The question I keep wondering is this:

Is stating biological fact (or indeed any scientific fact) a crime?

Because KJK is pretty blunt, but she's truthful.

We have a SNP leadership contender being vilified as 'transphobic' for stating in a respectful and measured way that transwomen are biologically male (of course they are or they wouldn't be 'trans' would they?).

One we get to the point that the police are effectively saying a statement of 2+2=4 is a hate crime (women don't have penises) then I think everyone should probably be afraid of the police. To a certain extent it doesn't matter which 'phobia' it's accused of being.

At that point, we are no longer free to say what we see. We have to say only what we believe a very small group of people want us to say. This is not living in a free country.

People speaking the truth of what they see always risks hurting someone elses feelings, but once you get to the point that hurting feelings is a crime, we're in dangerous territory. Of course, as we've seen, it's FINE to hurt middle aged women's or teenage girls feelings and threaten them with death. That's all FINE, it's only when biological males feel upset it's a problem.

I haven't donated; nor am I KJK's greatest fan. Yes, the provocateur gig is an easily recognizable con. But the motivation of this particular provocateur - whether it's a money-spinner or a strongly held personal and political conviction or a combination of the two - is irrelevant. It's drawing attention to an issue of huge importance to a great many women, and is giving some of those women a platform to speak. It's breaking down a culture in which women have been silenced, persecuted, and deprived of their livelihoods.

I'm not on board with a lot of Carolyn Farrow's views either. But the fact that these two women are being relentlessly persecuted by the police merely for exercising their right to free speech deeply concerns me, as it should any responsible citizen.

If a reasoned examination of what happens when the rights of two groups conflict - and they do conflict, no matter how much TRAs wish it otherwise - can be defined as 'hate speech' and the speakers punished accordingly, then we as a democracy are in a whole lot of trouble.

This isn't North Korea. Nor is that a route any reasonable person would want us to go down. The police need to lay off women who are merely standing up for our rights (or, for that matter, attending vigils for women who have been murdered at the hands of men, namely our 'trusted' police).

oohh. That is something I did not know!

How interesting.

Yes, I think the "hate crime officer" was reported to be a close friend of Jackie Green.

He'll be back, I think he enjoys this too much. I forgot my rule, which is weird because I still can't read his posts. My eyes just slide off them. They're like fog, or the nothing from the Neverending Story.

YY.