Drag Queens, are they outright offensive?

[Sophds]

Now I’ve never been the biggest feminist, I know that’s probably not the best way to characterise myself on a feminism board but I don’t want to quickly be dismissed as wrapped up in groupthink.

Read about todays protest at the tate modern against drag queen story hour and I’ve not read enough in to the story hour thing to have a strong informed opinion about that specifically it got me thinking aren’t drag queens just a misogynist version of black face?

I’ve never really thought too much about it and have never really had an issue with drag queens but now I just feel like something doesn’t sit right with me about men dressing up with hugely caricatured female features and caricatured stereotypical female behaviours that often cross over in to overt sexualisation.

I just feel like the entire idea of drag is to caricature and degrade women? Does anybody else feel like this?

As one of the Baronesses said (can’t remember which one) - it’s lovely for adults to read to children but why does it have to be a man pretending to be a woman?

When you put it in those terms it makes you realise that whoever made that decision to put a drag queen in the middle of an event meant for children, not only is it perverse, but it is utterly demeaning to women. And the worse thing, it’s deliberately so.

Yes, utterly offensive.

I’d stop short of calling it perverse in and of itself because I think in that respect you’re then essentially saying women by default are sexual. Which is half the problem.

I’d agree about it being degrading to women though.

In a private drag club/event for adults who enjoy that then fine but not anywhere near children. I don't want to see drag on mainstream TV either.

The BBC have a lot to answer for

No I’m using the word ‘perverse’ in a dictionary definition way that you might find in law. Meaning that it is contrary to what is acceptable. Nothing to do with sexual perversion.

If you haven't looked into it, you probably aren't aware that aside from the debate about the misogyny of drag, a lot of very dodgy men have used DQSH to get access to children, and are behaving in inappropriate ways at these events. So that is another reason there are protests.

grahamlinehan.substack.com/p/drag-queen-story-hour-who-is-it-for

Drag queens are grotesque parodies of “sexy” women though aren’t they? I’m not sure waxed and oiled bare chested men in tight leather shorts would be acceptable either and we wouldn’t have the furry people sporting their stuff either. It’s the sexualised nature of their presentation that I’d take issue with.

Completely offensive

It’s like black face but ripping the piss out of women. Hate them.

🤮

Absolutely agree with you OP.

A man who defies gender norms and incorporates traditionally female clothing like dresses into his wardrobe and chooses to use traditionally female styling in his everyday life is not offensive.

a man who puts on an over-the-top sexualized caricature of traditionally female clothing and styling and possibly adds body prosthetics to emphasize the effect is offensive. When he adds jokes about females to the look or acts in an unnatural, overly stereotypical manner the offense is further confirmed.

Yes, this

Agree with this. Wholeheartedly

Google “rainbow dildo butt monkey” - gives a stark example of what sort of trans-umbrella presentations some councils/libraries/parents/etc feel is acceptable in relation to children.

🤬😡🤯🤮

Yes.

Imagine that it was a man pretending to be black performing over the top racial stereotypes.

Or a man pretending to be Jewish and performing over the top stereotypes.

There is no difference between that and a man pretending to be a woman and performing misogynistic stereotypes.

Yes

As the mother of two daughters and I class myself as a feminist, I have absolutely no problem with drag queens.

They exist for entertainment purposes. You either like their take on comedy or you don’t. It’s all tongue in cheek. Is it any more “offensive” than a pantomime dame?

I think your response should be based on individual drag queens. Some may cross a line. But on the whole I find them hilarious (and probably look way better in heels than I ever could).

Is it any more “offensive” than a pantomime dame

pantomime dames are offensive too

But on the whole I find them hilarious (and probably look way better in heels than I ever could).

oh look, a ‘feminist’ who thinks men are better at being women than women.

Yes, drag = ‘woman face’ which is absolutely the same as ‘black face’. It’s offensive, degrading and deliberately so.

Don’t even get me started on drag queen story hour, taxpayer money is being used to fund someone using children as props in their fantasy while brainwashing little ones with sexist stereotypes ☹️

I don’t think traditional drag queens are offensive because it isn’t done to mock but in homage.

However, on an earlier thread about drag Queen story hour in particular I was informed that this includes a “drag Queen” that dresses in a rainbow monkey suit with a very large penis and bare buttocks. Rainbow penis monkey also apparently enjoys mocking anyone in Muslim dress on the high street of his village.

So rainbow penis monkey is why I think drag Queen story hour is firmly a very bad idea that has had disastrous results. There appears to be no sense or safeguarding. It’s also a mockery of Asian culture in which there is a mythological heroic Monkey King that Bhudda meets and he features in many children’s’ stories (sans rainbow fur, penis and bare buttocks)

To the person who said it’s supposed to be tongue in cheek entertainment - that was also true of blackface, doesn’t make it ok.

And on the question of is it more offensive than a pantomime dame - they’re offensive too. Like this image…

Dressing up in most costumes to entertain / make money is not offensive in my opinion but something about drag queens does offend me and I can’t quite explain why. Maybe it’s the position of power men have had over us and making women into something to joke about makes me uncomfortable ? Or It’s enforcing a stereotype that women act/ look a certain way? Not sure. I really don’t get the popularity of them though.

This is how I felt initially but my views have evolved recently.

I’m typically very liberal in regards to my attitudes towards sexuality and related subjects but this doesn’t sit right with me.