Maya’s response to Radical Notion’s GC divisions

[HiccupHorrendousHaddock]

I thought this was a very interesting answer to the recent issue of RN.

Shout out to the vipers and their Mumsnet Feminism within!

mforstater.medium.com/on-gender-critical-disputes-db2e456ad9cd

A golden age of gender roles? Oh, dear.

have we not spent years demonstrating that feminism has the right to be a movement only for women and women's rights?

It was revalatory to me, to realise that it was permissible to focus on women's rights without having to dance around making sure I also paid obeisance to every other marginalised group first.

I have this board to thank for that.

I just stumbled across Stephen Whittle’s Reddit account.

Is it her account? I didn't take her for being barely literate.

God she is so manipulative. Bollocks does she have the same aims as Julie Bindel.

She says she can switch at will for crossdressers to see them in their alternative persona. She doesn’t realise that this is just not normal.

Normal people with normal minds and brains find it disconcerting if someone keeps changing costumes and ‘acting’ in character with it. It is part of a different social contract that we are truthful and authentic about who we are. We want to be able to trust people, connect with people, not be an audience to their phony performance.

Normal women are freaked out by men getting off on crossdressing. She is so oblivious she can’t see the signs. Naive dimbo. Does she not actually know men at all? It’s a bit ridiculous if this is the case, since she’s pretending to be one.

Another manipulative thing. She talks about how her daughter felt depressed because people found out that SW is her parent and gave her shit for it. She then starts dissing KJK - who has taken the worst kind of doxing involving her home and kids. Urgh.

The other thing that really wound me up about that preening RN thing was focus on all the groups you have to show you care about. "Culture of caring for others"?

In particular it only mentioned one class IIRC - the working class. But women of all classes are, as journalist tweet points out, "is only as safe as her male partner allows her to be". Anyone who's ever worked in DA knows this. There are truly awful cases from all of society. The case that resulted in domestic homicide reviews was not what most would regard a working class family but middle class.

And no one in DA worth their salt would set out to expressly exclude a class of women because they perceive they're rich. Rich how? If you're being controlled, then how exactly? For good reason we have refuges and services for particular groups, yes. And we do and should support the efforts of those groups but setting out to ignore whole swathes of women got on my nerves.

The tweet I saw:

twitter.com/janemartinson/status/1623086388131385349?s=46&t=AEzVFyIPDcyTuwql4FvYZw

This pretty much covers it for me too.

If those screenshots are Whittle, I think even less now her now and I didn't know that was possible. Very manipulative, as others have said. The outright lie that she has ever done anything to benefit women was enough to send my blood pressure through the roof!

I suppose this is what she's been pouring in the ears of MPs for decades... I'm shocked that such nonsense seems to have been incredibly successful

If it were as acceptable for men to wear ‘women’s clothes’ as vice versa, there would be no point in the fetish.

However, I don’t know how you get from A to B. Male to female ‘cross dressing’ is so inextricably tied up with women’s place in society and concepts of submission. A woman wearing a man’s shirt is just wearing clothes.

There is an obvious difference between a man wearing a dress because he is making a fashion statement, and a man wearing a dress because he is signifying femininity. However, very, very few men do the first.

It would be a step forward to be able to acknowledge that both things exist, but are not the same.

This is like the surrendered wives of starmer

once upon a time there was a beautiful woman. Some people with different political views were mean to her and threatened her integrity by wanting to work with her to achieve some stuff. But she held fast to her opinions and didn’t listen or ever change her mind about anything, just like a good person should. One day she was in a forest glade selflessly stuffing envelopes when a handsome leftist prince rode past on his charger and fell in love with her purity

they moved to a collective together where she became public property of all the men there and lived happily ever after

the end

Whittle certainly mastered mansplaining.

So, socialist feminists have been the ones writing the UNWomen tweets and others saying feminists work to make the lives of all minorities better??? Not the liberal feminists?

So from reading that, Whittle is now proving to be another ‘they are not always trans when they say they are’ trans person?

So some people are what they say they are and some are not, and no one can really know what is going on between someone else's ears?

Yep, that's what women have been saying for some years now and being called all kinds of names for it. And this is not the first time we have seen some of the old guard, those who prefer to call themselves transsexuals despite all the abuse they get for it from the TQ+ lobby, see what it coming and try to re draw the line between themselves and other TQ people in a way that would exclude those people but still permit transsexuals access to women's single sex spaces.

Sadly that horse has not only bolted, it's died of old age. The time when that was possible is long, long gone. There is no way to separate the sincere from the insincere, and it's ridiculous to claim that anyone behaving in an inconvenient way = not sincere. Some of the absolutely sincere will also be those like Bryson and Scott. So it will have to be that everyone must be assumed to be what they say they are, if someone identifies as trans they are trans, there is no gatekeeping of this possible or logical.

and that means that there is a difference between a trans person and those of the biological sex the trans person identifies as being, and being trans cannot include access to women in single sex spaces .

End of.

I definitely lean more towards the KJK/Helen/Mary side of the GC movement. KJK and Helen have done much more to shed sunlight on this mess than academics. And I think old men in horrible wigs and tight little dresses are hilarious and I will definitely point it out on social media.

😃

Is the Prince of the Stuffed Envelopes Stephen Whittle?

Here's a suggestion for all of us who subscribed and then unsubscribed to The Radical Notion. Let's send the money we would have spent on subscriptions to Sex Matters instead. This year's sub to RN would have been £22, so I'm about to send £22 to Sex Matters.

sex-matters.org/take-action/donate/

More like wittering

I also feel alarmed that SW believes she has some kind of hold over Julie Bindel and was talking to her recently about the accusations of KJK associating with the ‘Proud Boys’.

I mean, KJK gets to hear JBs views because she’s spouting insinuations over twitter, but Whittle has some hot line and can get those manipulative hooks directly into JB and can work at her until she is ‘contrite’. WTF?

I agree. Might round it up a bit as well

More fool JB if she is giving Whittle any time or attention

person who wants to spend their life pretending to be something they’re not and to force others to pretend they can’t see what sex they are is manipulative and duplicitous. What a shocker

I find it so disturbing that these transactivists have so little understanding about normal drives. Whittle witters:

“some abject pathetic bloke who tried and failed to pick up that interesting woman in a bar only to be mocked at later by mates who tell him she is trans.”

People are allowed to care about the sex of the person they are interested in and to feel disturbed, freaked out, angry, conned, foolish, if they discover that person had concealed their sex and is in fact the opposite sex.

It’s totally normal to feel that way. It’s not just their mates taking the piss that would bother them, it’s the deception in and of itself.

These TAs seem like they are away with the fairies with this. As though, if it wasn’t for their mates taking the piss, most men would happily shack up with transsexual man and what? Adopt? Buy/traffic a child through surrogacy? It’s so naive and oblivious to normal drives.

I've never trusted Bindel (I know I've banged this drum many times before) but I don't think she can do any harm now. The nonsense from RN and the Real Feminists only makes ordinary women and men more swayed to the side of campaigns like Sex Matters and Let Women Speak.

(Phone keeps trying to autocorrect Sex Matters to Sex Matresses...)

Careful what your targeted ads are going to start throwing up for you 😂