Meet the Other Phone. Child-safe in minutes.

Meet the Other Phone.
Child-safe in minutes.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Help me work out how to alert my friends to what's happening. Also is my panic irrational?

127 replies

FriendofJoanne · 11/01/2023 13:29

I've posted the Sex Matters petition and all my family and some of my closest friends have signed, but others have said nothing. When we get together we are usually in a group catching up on our lives in general, and I try to talk but haven't managed to so far.

I've shared the petition on our Whatsapp group but only had one contact me separately. I've written a letter but not shared it as there's so much to say. I want to share my worries succinctly - about women's rights being eroded, children being taught that gender is more important than sex, children and vulnerable adults being medicated and given surgery instead of therapy to help them with trauma.

This is affecting my mental health now, I feel sick, depressed and anxious about the world we live in because of this. I care about global warming and the financial inequality of the world too, but this issue has taken over my life. For you others in this who post regularly how do you manage your anxiety? Do you feel anxious? How do you keep going?

I try to put time boundaries around how long I spend reading, but I do tend to listen to podcasts while doing other things.

My husband suggested I step away for a bit, I do need to, but I feel strongly that once I've shared my concerns it will relieve my anxiety and I'll be able to stop obsessing about it.

So please help me very succinctly explain why this issue is so important. Thank you :) Or just some headlines to catch peoples attention to read more. I think a lot of people still don't think its relevant to their lives.

OP posts:
SamphiretheTervosaurReturneth · 11/01/2023 13:42

This is affecting my mental health now, I feel sick, depressed and anxious about the world we live in because of this. I care about global warming and the financial inequality of the world too, but this issue has taken over my life. For you others in this who post regularly how do you manage your anxiety? Do you feel anxious? How do you keep going?

I agree with your DH. Take a step back. You need to find a balance that you can live with. It's no good burning yourself out for something that is outwith your control.

You seem to have done what you can within your friendship group. You don't really need to educate people who have shown no interest.

Look after yourself first and foremost. None of us, your friends, your family would want to see your MH decline because of this, or any other, issue.

FriendofJoanne · 11/01/2023 13:51

Thank you, it does help to hear that. It's just that feeling of not having a voice, not being able to say what I feel I need to say. I'll feel better once I've done it and sent individually to people as I think things get missed on group chat.

OP posts:
Nothingandnowhere · 11/01/2023 13:52

I wouldn't worry about your friends - I would focus your energy on writing to organisations and individuals who are in positions to apply the brakes locally.

RoyalCorgi · 11/01/2023 13:59

OP, I feel very much the same way. I think a lot of us. It would probably be more fair to say I feel a burning anger about it than anxiety, though of course I'm anxious too.

I also find it hard to talk to friends about it. In fact, I have avoided doing so. In some cases that's because I suspect they have swallowed the gender ideology line, and in others it's because I don't know how to start the conversation. A lot of this stuff is so mad - men pretending to be lesbians and joining lesbian dating apps; violent male rapists being put in women's prisons - that it sounds as if you're some paranoid loony who's made it up.

MrsOvertonsWindow · 11/01/2023 14:04

Being able to step back is really important.Currently society is being gaslit on a global scale that facts are no longer facts & that science and biology can be replaced with a fantastical and frankly dangerous to children ideology. Challenging it is hard because of the industrial scale of intimidation and bullying being used to keep women silent.

As has been suggested, maybe write to your MP about one aspect of this that you can see needs challenging if a parent, it might be the shitshow that's happening in some schools or the power some in the NHS have to eradicate accurate sex based language?

Do that and then step away for a while and focus on other things?. Flowers

Beamur · 11/01/2023 14:05

FriendofJoanne · 11/01/2023 13:51

Thank you, it does help to hear that. It's just that feeling of not having a voice, not being able to say what I feel I need to say. I'll feel better once I've done it and sent individually to people as I think things get missed on group chat.

This is being driven by anxiety, once you send the letter, you'll briefly feel better, but if your friends don't all react the way you want them to, you'll start looking for other ways to make sure you are heard. It's not healthy behaviour from a MH pov.
It's a deeply troubling and worrying topic and if you're fairly new to actually seeing it, you can feel a bit like shouting 'can nobody else see this!'
Activism can be a good thing, but I would agree that maybe you're not quite in the right place at the moment.
Step back a bit and look after yourself.

ArabellaScott · 11/01/2023 14:12

I agree that the frustration can be hard to deal with, when one feels that the people who are responsible for things like child safeguarding and upholding the law just aren't listening or doing the job they're trained to do.

But, OP, it's really important to look after your own mental health first and foremost.

Sometimes taking action can be a good source of mastery of feelings. And connecting with other women can be really helpful. There will be feminist groups in your local area, or you could look into volunteering with Women's Aid or similar.

I'd also suggest the usual things - daylight, exercise, healthy and balanced diet.

See your GP if you're feeling overwhelmed, or maybe consider speaking to a therapist or counsellor? Flowers

foremostwilly · 11/01/2023 14:26

If you become a fixated single-issue obsessive you are likely to end up with fewer friends, whether they agree with your views or not.

ArabellaScott · 11/01/2023 14:32

It's interesting to note that any post that suggests that women may lose friends or social standing will always be pounced upon as an opportunity to try and frighten women into silence.

And the fact that you're as likely to gain new friends as lose others is for some reason ignored. Yes, there are people who may decide that they can't be friends with someone whose views don't accord with their own.

Really, though, one would hope women are mature enough to base beliefs on rational, critical thought, rather than playground peer pressure.

nilsmousehammer · 11/01/2023 15:09

ArabellaScott · 11/01/2023 14:32

It's interesting to note that any post that suggests that women may lose friends or social standing will always be pounced upon as an opportunity to try and frighten women into silence.

And the fact that you're as likely to gain new friends as lose others is for some reason ignored. Yes, there are people who may decide that they can't be friends with someone whose views don't accord with their own.

Really, though, one would hope women are mature enough to base beliefs on rational, critical thought, rather than playground peer pressure.

Quite.

And this is hardly as 'single issue' issue for women. It is part of every single political aspect of being a woman, it is about the basic equality of women compared to men.

But yes, this minimising, dismissing, 'wandering womb' type response is a good part of the massive impact this is having on women and on their mental health. Mine has taken a real hammering and it gets worse the more I encounter the behaviour of those desperate for women to just hand over their rights and go away.

IcakethereforeIam · 11/01/2023 15:14

Well done OP, keep a weather eye out but take a step back.

Anactor · 11/01/2023 15:36

Something I find very helpful in stepping away is a ‘news holiday’. Take a one week break from news sites, Twitter, topical podcasts, anything.

You may not be able to manage the entire week the first time. You’ll probably also become aware how difficult it is to avoid ‘news’- I keep having to tell my launch page on Edge that I don’t want headlines, then there’s all these news alerts, etc.

Most times I’ve done this, I felt much better after the week was up and much more aware that modern news is selling anxiety. Often about stuff we really can’t do much about.

Another helpful tactic is the Worry Decision Tree - which you can find online. It’s very helpful to be able to look at something that worries you, work out what actions you can take - and that now you’ve done those actions, it’s time to focus on something else. Or, that you can’t do anything now, so you need to pop it in the diary (and then focus on something else).

Remember: put your own oxygen mask on before helping anyone else with theirs. You’ve signed the petition, you’ve got your family and some friends to sign it, you’ve done way more than most people. Make sure your Oxygen mask is on right before doing anything else.

JoodyBlue · 11/01/2023 15:38

I have felt the same way @FriendofJoanne and it can become all consuming. For me I have something on me that reminds me that I won't drop the ball on this - a little enamel pin from Sex Matters or Standing for Women. I check in with FWR knowing that if anything important happens it will be discussed here. I write emails, sign petitions, and sometimes attend events. I'm clear in my mind about where I stand on the issues. And I give myself regular breaks. If friends haven't responded now, there is something stopping them. But they will know you are there. I find that parents going through issues with their teens seem to be sign posted to me by other parents who have seen FB posts. They never respond online, but anything you have done will not be in vain. Do what you can when you can, but look after yourself. It can exhausting and no-one needs to be in this fight all the time. Flowers

JoodyBlue · 11/01/2023 15:40

@Anactor great advice

Delphinium20 · 11/01/2023 15:41

It's a deeply troubling and worrying topic and if you're fairly new to actually seeing it, you can feel a bit like shouting 'can nobody else see this!'

Once you see it, you can't unsee it and you feel like Cassandra warning Troy of impending doom while everyone ignores you.

My oldest DD peaked this summer and she's now quite obsessed with telling friends. I appreciate her enthusiasm (and whew, what a relief I feel that she finally gets it), but I warn her to take it step by step. Open up gently to people who might get it, be prepared to lose friends (she lost one) and don't overexert energy on those deep in delusion (like our family member).

She's going into a field where she can pick a topic to focus on and I encourage her to pick one where she can move the needle in a meaningful way by doing good work. Okay if she chooses to tackle gender ideology but a larger focus on women's rights will hopefully give her a longer runway and give her some other things to distract herself.

Good luck, OP. You're not alone.

ScrollingLeaves · 11/01/2023 15:42

I share your feelings OP though I don’t know the answer. You only have to look on the petitions map for the petition about the Equality act to see most of the country has no idea what is at stake. There was a video interview the other day with Helen Joyce on Triggerometery. Have you seen that or shown your friends that?

Recently on a thread I started in ‘Education’ asking for people’s experiences of RSE teaching in their children’s schools, a poster shared that their school used RSE resources from Jigsaw and that she was GC, and she thought they were fine - they were not fine at all. They included slides based on sex stereotypes and intended to teach ‘cis’ boy called Billy, ‘cis’ girl called Bella, and a he/she called B. Those words were not used but the message is clear enough. That that was not by any means the only thing wrong with Jigsaw.

Apros why the Equality act needs to make clear that the characteristic sex means biological sex, there is this current thread outlining the experience of a parent trying valiantly to put right a misleading use of ‘gender’ instead of sex on a poster at her child’s primary school:

Page 30 | Please help! Gender not sex on a school 'protected characteristics' poster, just spoken to the Head! | Mumsnet

www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4713725-please-help-gender-not-sex-on-a-school-protected-characteristics-poster-just-spoken-to-the-head?page=30
www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4713725-please-help-gender-not-sex-on-a-school-protected-characteristics-poster-just-spoken-to-the-head?page=30&reply=122993924

ScrollingLeaves · 11/01/2023 15:45

Anactor · Today 15:36
Such good advice.

StaunchMomma · 11/01/2023 16:26

At the end of the day, you can voice your concerns among friends & family but you CANNOT have expectations about what they do with that information.

It's not up to you to determine what causes other people champion and it's not relistic to assume that their non-interest means they must be ignorant to the topic.

Most people hate it when people push their thoughts and ideals on others. If YOU really want to fight this thing, YOU should donate or join/volunteer for that cause, not just nag your nearest & dearest about it. It may be consuming your thoughts but that's just not the case for everyone else.

If you really do feel the need to impart some specific knowledge then maybe keep it very short and sweet? A few links to websites etc is more than enough and allows people the option to just not bother if their views oppose yours or they just don't care/are too busy etc.

It does sound like you're becoming a bit obsessive about the topic and you sound potentially a bit depressed. A visit to the GP may be in order, I think.

Apologies, as I don't think that's what you want to hear, but this does seem more than a tad OTT, OP.

StaunchMomma · 11/01/2023 16:38

Just so I'm clear, OP - You should NOT be silent and you are well within your rights to share your worries, but you do need to play it cleverly and you do need to look out for yourself as our worries can consume us.

A break, a check up, a plan of action and then you might be able to go at this more positively.

Beamur · 11/01/2023 16:50

StaunchMomma · 11/01/2023 16:38

Just so I'm clear, OP - You should NOT be silent and you are well within your rights to share your worries, but you do need to play it cleverly and you do need to look out for yourself as our worries can consume us.

A break, a check up, a plan of action and then you might be able to go at this more positively.

This is good advice. Don't be silenced but keep perspective.
There are communities of women -- especially here on MN that will listen and share those concerns. You aren't alone and there are lots of smart women out there working to protect women's rights.

KatMcBundleFace · 11/01/2023 17:13

I think it does affect mental health. I'm happier now I'm out on Facebook and not just anonymous on Twitter.

I go gently, gently with friends. Almost always on an individual level. Chip, chip away. If I do a big post on Facebook, I hide it from some of my Woker friends. Debate is fine. Name calling is not.

Don't panic, we can only do what we can do and we have moved the debate a huge way. We all can only do what we can do, and we have to protect our own well-being.

Find a group of gender critical women if you can, go to meetings and stuff. So therapeutic. Sanity is with us.

JoodyBlue · 11/01/2023 20:01

Also sometimes a good old belly laugh at the absurdity of it all. There is a post on the boards tonight about Dreamies cat treats - proud to support the LGBTQ+ community. Cat treats!! I 100% support the LGB community and support all individuals to be themselves. But I wouldn't buy cat treats on that basis. Flip me!

nepeta · 11/01/2023 20:10

This is the advice I received from a friend who is a therapist:

  • do what you safely can do (depends on our personal circumstances) so that you don't feel powerless (donating, strengthening the messages of others, writing, protesting etc.)
  • find like-minded people online and elsewhere so that you don't feel alone (for emotional support and also to organise)
  • avoid being swamped (take breaks, schedule pleasurable activities, time in nature, exercise, and meditation or similar)
CryInToYourCornflakesNicola · 11/01/2023 21:54

foremostwilly · 11/01/2023 14:26

If you become a fixated single-issue obsessive you are likely to end up with fewer friends, whether they agree with your views or not.

And?

Maybe, just maybe we dont want friends like that. But no that would never occur.

Nothingandnowhere · 11/01/2023 22:32

Yeah far I'm happier having shed TRA acquaintances and my friendships with those who 'get it' are much enhanced by our bond over seeing what the normies don't.