First non-binary priest in C of E

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uk.news.yahoo.com/church-england-first-non-binary-161400908.html

They describe themselves as non-binary and genderqueer but also say that the phrase “from maleness to femaleness” in Genesis provoked an epiphany.

Just the clothing issue? ignore. Man being a woman bit if we can just the clothes it is 2023? After all and it was fine in the 80s why are we going backwards

They aren't just wearing women's clothes though. Or just wearing make up. There's a man I see at a local shop who wears make up. I couldn't care less. It's the wearing stilettos and mini skirts, striped eyes and a fatuous smile. It's the appropriation of women's stuff. Like a woman going to the office in skimpy lederhosen, stockings, and claiming to be a man.

Ignoring the general inappropriate ness of some of their outfits sone of the time, did the time off day and occasion I get what you mean , I'm trying not Get everyone riled up? The clothes the make up the heels, have all been men's clothes at some point in history, the wigs

These things have always gone back and fourth. The outrageous caricature thing that' is annoying us at the moment is definitely flaming tensions. But those that Just go round in clothes appropriate for the weather shall we say. It shouldn't still be ssh issue now, but it is. Is that the women's fault? or the unaccepting men of men who present differently?

I'm not bothered about men looking great in non conforming clothes.
I'm not happy about men looking silly in non conforming clothes and demanding to be taken seriously.

I'm in agreement there. If it wouldn't be seen as appropriate for a woman to wear in work or to be taken seriously then why the he'll is it OK for a man who feels like a woman. It's a double standard.

I think that's my irritation. If the first female vicar had stood there with a fatuous smile and bad eye makeup, demanding to be taken seriously, she'd have been pilloried.

Sorry I'm feeling grumpy tonight. Maybe I'd be nicer on a different day.

I think it's partly because we've had to fight so hard to be taken seriously at work and these men just waltz in a make a mockery of our graft to Get recognized for just bring female and able to do our job..

It's insulting

That’s not fair Boiled- how can we not derail a thread thread when you put that beautiful man in the middle of it.

he was my first love when I was about 9.

I still want to dress like him from time to time.

Sorry. It's meant to make women if a certain age go from rage to ahhhhhhhhhhhh. He's just soooooooo beeeaaauuuuuutiful.

Well it was successful for a while, to be fair.

Ah ha!

😁

My tablet is glitching and f or a brief moment only gave angry 😠 type faces

Morton Harket? Will that sweeten the temper of your laptop?

I mean tablet.

Mags might

Aha my first get on a bus to a different city with older sister concert. Happy memories

Ah, you're all making me feel old - the 80's were indeed excellent, but if you go back a bit to the 70's, you've got Lou Reed's Walk on the Wild Side on the radio, David Bowie in a dress, and all the glam rockers in glitter, make up and platform boots.

Despite my childhood I do have amazing memories of the freedoms we had in that era that in many ways do not exist now. And with the world in your hand 24 7 the pressures to find yourself and your place in a world where you are no longer just competing with your contemporaries in your town but the while world.

I don't think we can comprehend the psychological effect of that, but then nor can the current young generation as it's all they know.

Whereas we talked to friends then went home and maybe talked things just with parents to make sense of stuff these kids just go on line for confirmination and end up in the grip of an algorithm that may have originally given them a wrong answer to a badly worded question and they trust what they are seeing i's true and correct a there is little critical thinking required when you never have to think about how to get anything. You just press an app and it happens.

It's frightening

Well I wouldn't go as far as to say clothes are just clothes (as they are designed to fit around male or female bodies), but this isn't about the clothing.

Men like this wear women's clothing to give a feminine appearance (I heard a story on a podcast about a man who would be excited by a plain t-shirt that was exactly the same as a men's one but just said "women's" on it), even then I'm not fussed over it.

Rather previously men would have been embarrassed about these stories coming out in public, a threat to their masculinity (even though they like escaping it in private), I even saw a men being physically sick on RuPaul's Drag Race because he was dressed up.

Now there is exhibitionism around it, I think a delusion gained from people on social media saying "how great" he looks. What would've once been detrimental to someone's social standing, is now used as a way to climb up that ladder.

The fact that men are wearing women's clothes certainly doesn't help the whole aesthetic as I'm sure the fact that i buy from the menswear dept doesnt help me in my looks like a sack of potatoes aesthetic.

I personally find the side to this that we struggle to talk about in here due to rules and monitors etc the side that is by far a small minority but that small minority seem to have a disproportionate amount of power within the movement, and there is no getting away from the fact that a certain percentage of men derive sexual pleasure from wearing these clothes and then the rabbit hole that takes you down on line, and there isn't enough eye bleach in the world for me.

It's this group that I feel are causing the issues.we know we are props in their sexual fetish played in real time. And they are being allowed to abuse us involuntarily as we didn't consent to take part in the sexual fetish.

The rest of them...live your best life as long as you stay out of single sex spaces and go in the one you are born in in. Because i can't tell the difference between you and the guy who is using me to get his kicks. I'm sad it's got to such a bitter place.

The Church has and always will attract eccentric souls. But as pp says, I really struggle with the exhibitionism of something that would've been done in someone's personal time.

Is non binary being used here instead of transvestite? There's a lot of pontification from Bingo to justify why he should be calling himself non binary and wearing glittery eyeshadow at work.

I see another picture of Bingo posted himself on social media in a skimpy top with braids, it's all 'look at me'.

I have just seen the photos of Bingo and was struck by the fact that I have never seen an actual female priest/vicar looking over made-up like that. On the contrary, the priests I am thinking of have done everything to neutralise any overt show of ‘vanity’, like puritans would have. I wonder if his wife looks like her husband or she is restrained and modest like most female vicars and vicars’ wives?

That look Bingo has is ridiculously not non-binary. It is stereotypical done up woman ( gone wrong). Bingo seems to have mixed up social cues.

I could completely understand if Bingo came to a realisation that spiritually, or humanistically speaking, in our deepest selves, we are none of us male or female - which people know already basically.

But this all looks very physical and literal.

But this all looks very physical and literal.

Bingo has previously written about their autism, so maybe that’s not so surprising.

Going back a bit (OK, quite a lot):

From birth, and the identification of sex-class membership that happens at that moment, most female people are raised to be passive, submissive, weak and nurturing, while most male people are raised to be active, dominant, strong and aggressive.

Others have covered clothes and their slogans comprehensively, which is one of the more blatant manifestations, but there are a lot of more subtle ones going on when you start looking out for them.

Boys and men being praised for 'leadership' and 'directness' while the same behaviour in girls and women is described as 'bossy' and 'aggressive'.

Schools seating disruptive boys next to girls for their 'calming influence'. Adults making small talk with children tend to compliment a girl on a pretty dress/hair/shoes, but with boys are more likely to ask questions about activities or interests.

The language that people are expected to use - if you look at work emails the ones from men tend to simply state what they want and add a single thanks at the end, while those from women are peppered with please and sorry and just checking and would you mind? I edit a lot of manuals and technical info written by women and even those are full of 'please' when there should be a direct instruction. But if women write emails or comment on documents like men they are perceived as abrasive and (in the case of at least one of my friends, who is a lovely person and always polite and professional) sent on courses to improve their attitude and communication skills.