The wokebro hypocrisy over Jeremy Clarkson

[RoyalCorgi]

There's a thread on Clarkson's comments about Meghan Markle in Feminism Chat, but not here.

I don't particularly want to discuss the comments themselves (I'm sure we all agree they're horrific) but I feel myself once more being pushed to the brink by the hypocrisy of wokebros and handmaidens all lining up to condemn Clarkson as a misogynist, having allied themselves with a movement that routinely makes the most vile threats of sexual aggression against women - and having belittled women's concerns about these threats as silly or irrational.

Talcum X has made a whole video about how terrible Clarkson is. This is a man who routinely blocks feminists on social media so he can't hear what they're saying about male violence. The rest of the time he's calling us bigots.

Zoe Williams (her again) wrote an article about Clarkson in the Guardian, but she's another one who refuses to see the misogynistic bile that pours out of trans activists towards women.

They're all congratulating themselves on how progressive and feminist they are. I don't think I can stand it much longer. I don't know if it's deliberate gaslighting or they're all just incredibly stupid.

What Clarkson said was shocking. I don’t care that the violent words were a cultural reference. It wasn’t funny. Shit like that shouldn’t be published and it should be called out wherever and by whoever possible. I’m really struggling to understand why anyone would prefer some individuals not to do that for the sake of consistency.

Even if it’s hypocrisy, it means enough voices have spoken for them to choose that response, which doesn’t mean that you need to feel any friendlier towards them and their wider views, but does mean that opinion on that particular issue is hopefully moving in the right direction.

Remember when Charlie Brooker coined 'pious newborn, Owen Jones'? That was a good one. LOJ is a clickbait columnist, not the King of Thailand.

Maybe it is rude and childish, but I'd rather people had the freedom to be insulting to those in public life than return to the days of blasphemy and sedition laws and some people and ideas being held above criticism (see above, re: the King of Thailand). I imagine most people wouldn't want insulting Jeremy Clarkson to become verboten.

There's a difference between "pious Newborn" and "Talcum X" -homophobia.

Maybe @RoyalCorgi is too high on their own supply to tell the difference. but I'd hope others would know better.

Agree
It's not just Corgi though, have seen it used a few times on here
Can't quite put my finger on why but it doesn't sit comfortably with me either, maybe the play on Malcolm X's name? Seems a bit trivialising and appropriating somehow

So the thread is going to be derailed with the accusation that the longstanding nickname of Jones, Talcum X, is homophobic? Nice try. We all know it’s related to the fact his ideas and policies are light and fluffy compared to a real activist. Are you getting confused? Isn’t that accusation meant to be it’s racist, not homophobic? Keep up. Some consistency would be good…

Even if it’s hypocrisy, it means enough voices have spoken for them to choose that response, which doesn’t mean that you need to feel any friendlier towards them and their wider views, but does mean that opinion on that particular issue is hopefully moving in the right direction.

There will never be progress against VAWG if it’s only addressed when coming from those with the “wrong” political beliefs. Perpetual ignoring of VAWG perpetrated by those with the “correct” political beliefs is the entire bedrock of trans ideology.

Wasn't there an incident recently where a prominent American transactivist was testifying in some kind of hearing into online abuse and trolling, and one of the panellists brought up the TRA's own posts, which were abusive and trolling and actually calling for public harassment of prominent Republicans?

If the longstanding nickname of Owen Jones on Mumsnet is "talcum x" then his longstanding nickname is homophobic.

If pointing this out is derailing the thread then I suggest you ask yourselves why you are tolerating threads which attack journalists you dislike for criticising misogyny and how did homophobia become the norm on this little corner of Mumsnet.

I suggest you ask yourselves why you are tolerating threads which attack journalists you dislike for criticising misogyny

If you think that's what this thread is doing, you haven't understood the thread.

It’s a longstanding nickname generally, not unique to Mumsnet. It was first used on Twitter.

Jones is regularly criticised here for his hateful views on women and his regular ignoring of VAWG perpetrated by people he shares views with. Do you think Jones should also address this violence as vigorously as he addressed Clarkson’s comments? For example, should he address the violence of trans activists who threw shit at women in Belgium a few days ago?

Longstanding misogyny is still misogyny.

Longstanding homophobia is still homophobia.

You wouldn't justify Misogyny by saying "people on Twitter do it.
It's not a valid excuse with homophobia either.

so you're not going to address the fact that actual men have recently thrown actual shit at women

right oh

oh and welcome to mumsnet

hope your socks are comfy!

So the thread is going to be derailed with the accusation that the longstanding nickname of Jones, Talcum X, is homophobic? Nice try

Exactly. Just ignore the attempts to derail. They are desperate to stop women discussing the erasure of their rights. They are desperate to control and suppress those discussions, which includes trying to control what language women use.

Has it been explained why it’s homophobic

i know its been called racist before…

Those of you who use Talcum X as a nickname for a gay man- it's homophobic.

If you already knew it you should have known better- if you didn't- you do now.

I think you'll find it's because women are saying it.

That's your opinion. My opinion is that it is an amusing nickname that reflects his lily-livered hypocrisy, and has fuck all to do with him being gay. I like Squealer even better as a nickname for him, if that helps? Sorry if that's porcist.

Oh, I’m absolutely not saying that what he said was ok because it was a joke. It was gross and tasteless and all round ugly — and therefore not very funny and not a good joke. I had started to think slightly better of Clarkson after watching Clarkson’s Farm — it actually does a very good job of showing how punishing, stressful, and financially unrewarding farming can be — but this has sunk him in my opinion again. The reason I was at pains to stress the humorous intent is that a lot of people on Twitter (and here in that stupid thread about how he should be arrested for inciting violence) have reacted as though he was saying he earnestly hates Meghan Markle more than a murderer of children and genuinely hopes she will one day be paraded naked in the streets fir public shaming and shit throwing. The people saying that must, surely, know this is not true. They must, surely, realise that it is a grim misfire of a joke rather than some deranged political manifesto. Yet they pretend that they think he means it and should therefore be prosecuted. Now that, to me, is just dangerous. When people knowingly and deliberately misinterpret comic hyperbole as actual political statement and demand not only apologies for poor taste but actual legal action we surely have a problem as a society. Especially when genuinely violent speech is ignored by the same people because the targets of that speech are less acceptable.

It's also homophobic- but you've made it plain that you're not concerned about that.

I'm not altogether surprised, to be honest.

Those of you who use Talcum X as a nickname for a gay man- it's homophobic

why?

ive never used it to refer to OJ and if its a homophobic slur id like to be able to refer to it if i ever hear it, i could ask my young adults but id put good money on them not knowing why

ds1 partner didn’t even know what being a friend to Dorothy meant

Let me guess: if if hadn't been for this terrible solecism on my part, you would have been prepared to listen respectfully to my views but, as it is, you find yourself unable to do so? What a surprise.

When you haven't got an argument, go for an ad hominem attack. When you haven't got grounds for an ad hominem attack, dispute language. There is always a reason why women must not allowed to say what they want to say.

All you are doing is exposing your own inability to contest any of the actual arguments being made against Squealer and his cohorts.

Ive asked ds1 and partner

ds1 is shit at reading messages though

And I’ve googled…

Back to the actual point of the thread. Yes, there is massive hypocrisy about Clarkson. He is clearly a misogynist, but at least he isn't campaigning to remove women's rights to single sex spaces. Unlike Talcum X.

Some people are comfortable with homophobia- you appear to be one.

There's a lot of it about in this little corner of mumsnet.