Women's rights general conversations

[Kucingsparkles]

This is an experimental thread, all input much appreciated!

There is so much excellent information and so many active discussions on FWR that I wondered if it would be useful to have a thread to sort of "cross-fertilise" between them - airing little thoughts or vignettes that wouldn't themselves merit their own thread, to highlight other posts/threads of particular interest or to point to notable developments on fast-moving threads so that casual observers know where to look.

(For example, "the X thread has meandered onto a fascinating discussion of Y" or "Poster P's amazing analysis on thread Z might have relevance to the scenario in thread W" or even "Random bloke asked me to smile while I was choosing onions, grr"- that sort of thing).

Right, bring on the flames or flowers! <cowers>

oh shoot, I was just thinking how good to see two good posts from MissLawls. Dunno what random rule it broke.

That brief questionnaire at the top of the Scientific American article made me smile. I assume a “tendency for interpersonal victimhood” is polite-speak for making absolutely everything all about you, all the time?

I wonder how such people cope when they find themselves part of a group where everyone is like that.

I think that is one area where this differs from many cults, in that its primary focus is individual egotism, with the group membership underpinning the centrality of that individual identity. That level of focus on oneself is psychologically dangerous imo (though likely to make plenty of money for psychotherapists).

Those who have a perpetual victimhood mindset tend to have an “external locus of control”; they believe that one’s life is entirely under the control of forces outside one’s self, such as fate, luck or the mercy of other people.

This stood out to me. I'm thinking of the habit of helicopter parenting that's been going on for at least 25 years now. Has it resulted in a generation or more of people who, because they were mollycoddled through early life, now have no resilience and or independence of thought?

I wonder how such people cope when they find themselves part of a group where everyone is like that.

They all sign up to a talk board on some corner of the Internet! 😀

I've had a message deleted. No idea why. I stick to the guidelines or thought I did. Wasn't hateful or offensive, or thought not. Worrying.

I think the use of certain words gets your post automatically deleted.

Was it a post drawing a comparison with cults? That tends to be a no-no, although there's no specific rule.

I think the use of certain words gets your post automatically deleted.

I guess so. But I wish I knew which word or phrases caused the deletion. I was responding to the religion analogy. I was certainly not hateful, offensive, or threatening. I'm very careful here, and indeed everywhere online.

Was it a post drawing a comparison with cults? That tends to be a no-no, although there's no specific rule.

Yes that's the only thing I think it can be. Are we not allowed to use that word? In which case, fine, I won't use it anymore. But I've checked the rules and the added ones for this issue and I can't find that this word is off limits. Anyway thanks, I won't use it again.

I wondered that - there was an 'ology' word I thought rather good (as was the whole post) that I can imagine it being a trigger. On another thread yesterday I started when I saw an old GUT-er, unaware of all that has happened in the last decade+ musing on old posters she remembered and listing Thor among others.

Well least we can talk about Thor here to our heart's content!

is individual egotism,

Yes, cloaked by various vulnerabilities.

no resilience

Not necessarily convinced by the helicopter parenting theory but it does feel as if displaying vulnerability/lack of resilience is rewarded.

I am also interested in the overlap with disability rights activism. While much of it is a civil rights issues (physical accessibility etc.) some of it is just nonsense. (“The straw ban is hitting disabled people hard” tweeted a TW of my acquaintance.) There seem to be a lot of gender warriors who identify as disabled. I am not sure that currently fashionable social model of disability is helpful here - I am more disabled by the part of my body that doesn’t work properly, than by the fact that the world wasn’t designed with people like me in mind (to parrot the lingo), and while I want to see more inclusive design I also take responsibility for finding solutions that work for me as do most people with disabilities. There is a whole cohort of people who seem to enjoy wallowing in helplessness.

Can someone explain the Thor thing, please?

I'm not sure there is auto deletion (we shall be able to see if my response remains). It may be that either some words are flagged for checking, or that our 'monitors' (ie people who'd like to shut down MN in general or FWR in particular) are catching occurrences and reporting to MN.
Other words which unexpectedly get deletions are references to Nepalese mountain guides or hilltops.

Some of the deletions may be if a phrase is whined about as being a 'dog whistle' or if it could be said to be violating the 'Sweeping negative generalisations about any group, including trans people and gender-critical feminists, won’t be tolerated.' rule.

On the lifeboat thread if you want tricy.

The young trans person I'm most close to wasn't a victim of helicopter parenting but did go to a highly pressuring school, one that expected not just great academic results but also a kind of social and cultural conformity, and a particular style of presentation among its past pupils. It used to be notorious for anorexia.

I very much understand people wanting out in that situation, and their grabbing what seems to be the most favourable route.

There is a whole cohort of people who seem to enjoy wallowing in helplessness.

Yes I've noticed that. I'm all for the very opposite - stoicism. It's a branch of philosophy but also a good way to try to live in my opinion.

MNHQ have emailed me before to say that the cult word is forbidden in FWR. There is no official list of banned words, as the mods felt being open about the list of banned words would promote the engineering of work-arounds. They prefer to intervene afterwards, and leave modded posters feeling off-balance.

As I have pointed out before, this style of moderation means new posters get disproportionately deleted.

While we're at it, alternative word for summit of a mountain, with four letters? Don't use it.

Thank you! I'll be much more careful in future!

To me it seems like there’s a lot of romanticising of mental health issues (the ‘good’ kind at least) and disability on social media, to the point that it’s become fashionable to have certain diagnoses. It sometimes feels like the hardship olympics. It’s under the umbrella of inclusivity, but I wonder why so much energy is invested in the inclusivity of some people but not others, e.g. trans rights versus women’s rights. Or the amount of campaigning and media coverage that goes into trans children’s mental health while the physical and mental health of the sizeable number of children who have been abused and live in care and have limited life options, very little support and significant morbidity as a result is completely overlooked. Why aren’t people more angry about that?

I didn't see your posts MissLawls but if you email MNHQ ([email protected]) they usually will explain what it was that prompted the deletion.

I agree with you about stoicism and am exasperated at the celebration of vulnerability. It even bleeds into music with plaintive wavery-quavery, cracking with "emotion", high-pitched voices, both male and female, constantly assailing the ears.

I'd forgotten what thread I was on. I'll blame it on sudden hunger.

It's probably correct that helicopter parenting has nothing to do with the current weirdness, it just occurred me that it might be a factor.

BoreOfWhabylon, that's the reason I avoid modern music these days, it's so whiny.

I agree with you about stoicism and am exasperated at the celebration of vulnerability.

Same here. Seeing people celebrate how feeble they are is so frustrating.

See also: rape and sexual abuse. Being a victim of either is so low down on the trauma hierarchy now that some TAs want to exclude women who have experienced it from designated services, and most people seem to be turning a blind eye to this. ‘Inclusivity’ is whatever people who shout the loudest deem important at a given time. I’m sick of the word.