I'm not a woman - which facilities should I use

[Whatiswrongwithmyknee]

Genuinely interested to hear what supporters of gender ideology would recommend here. I am biologically female but do not identify as a woman. I am officially trans though in reality I don't think I am the sort of person Stonewall meant to refer to in their definition of trans (I am gender critical - which for those who have been misled by some made-up definitions, to me means that sometimes sex, rather than gender, matters. It is not an anti-trans stance).

The question is - which facilities should I use? I should not be in the ladies if that is defined by identity but using the men's does not feel right either. How do gender ideologists suggest I negotiate this?

You have way too much time on your hands, clearly. Just use the women's loos ffs!

You are female so obviously use the female toilets. If men are happy for you to male facilities that is up to them.

I suggest that you don't use male facilities, for reasons of privacy for men and safety for you. Also because it normalises harmful genderist ideology.

I do not ever want people to feel justified in assuming that I align myself with sexist stereotypes just because of the facilities I use

I understand completely, this is what happens when things are done by gender and people are forced into boxes

I agree ziggy, I barely get chance to go the loo, let alone think about which one I need to use.

Get over yourself and use the ladies.

You are a woman, we come in many shapes and sizes, like different things and do not all conform to Stonewall's regressive, stereotypical SHITE.

There aren't any laws which prohibit someone going into the toilet of the "wrong" sex. It's perfectly legal, anyone can use whichever facilities they feel most appropriate. If other people have a problem with that, that's their problem. It's never been illegal for a man to enter the women's toilet or vice-versa, just that by convention people have automatically used the one designated for their sex.

In the past transpeople have used the "wrong" toilet without issue. I think it's becoming more of an issue now because people are more comfortable with changing their gender without "living" their new gender or making an effort to fit in with stereotypical gender norms.

There's also the problem some women have where they get accused of being in the "wrong" toilet, for example there was an England rugby player who was abused and threatened in the women's toilets because other women thought she looked too male to be a woman.

A trans friend looks very much male. He still has a vagina (for many reasons) but I knew him as him, and had no idea he was trans for some time.

How would you feel if you saw him in a womens toilet? He looks, acts and speaks as a male. Without checking his sex organs, you would just see a man.

Since he doesn't pose any threat to men, he can use the men's.

What a silly question. You are a biological woman. You use the ladies 😬🤷🏼‍♀️. Your biological status doesn't care about a self defined status that only exists in your mind and can't be tested or proved or verified in any way. You are a woman, your biological dimorphism marks you out very clearly as a woman. You use the ladies.

Sis question. Do you honestly think that identifying as something means that other people fail to recognise you as what you actually are?

.However I'd feel mis gendered if anyone assumed that because I go to the ladies I identify as a woman. I am not messing here. I genuinely now feel uncomfortable wherever I go.

The problem is most places don’t have the infrastructure space for toilets for every permutation possible. It’s unfortunate but reality. Just use the female toilet for now and maybe in the future they will build buildings/complexes that have 50% space allocated for every toilet permutation, and then squish the other things in around them.

Use the ladies. You're a woman.

How would you feel if you saw him in a womens toilet? He looks, acts and speaks as a male. Without checking his sex organs, you would just see a man.

Guessing he wouldn’t have an issue using the mens then as he seems to identify as male and so would feel comfortable there. Not at all the same as OP who is saying they don’t want to use the female as don’t identify as such and don’t want to use the male as they don’t identify as such. Which leaves them with nowhere they feel comfortable weeing when out and we are meant to somehow solve this.

You're a woman & female, whether or not you identify as such.

Welcome to the Ladies' Loos!

But I suspect you know this already

@babyjellyfish OK< the first trans person I knew. A transwoman (30 years ago now!). I worked with her, shared the work toilets with her. She came on a girls "night out". It was quite a few months before I found out she wasn't just a very tall woman, but was actually a trans woman. She was super feminine and really quite beautiful.

What toilets should she use? Because she was beautiful, was it OK to use the womens?

@ThrowingSomeCrumbs the mens toilets. Because he is a man. He has man parts. He has male dna. You can’t change your sex. Putting on makeup doesn’t alter your dna.

Look….cubicles are private spaces. A Martian of all genders could use one…and unless you stand on the loo and look over the top….you would be none the wiser. I believe all this fear and hate comes from not knowing….assuming trans are a threat in some way. The vast majority of people…regardless of sex or gender are not predatory. We need to stop reacting to an unreal threat.

But how would you KNOW? How do you know who you are sharing a toilet with?

"I genuinely now feel uncomfortable wherever I go."

I don't mean to sound flippant here but if you feel uncomfortable wherever you go, the only solution that I can see is to go wherever you feel less uncomfortable. Because the reality is you have to go somewhere! If you're somewhere where there's a 3rd option, then go there obviously but if not, pick the lesser of two evils so to speak.

The problem with this is that as soon as you allow some people to be exceptions to the rule, there is no longer a rule.

Is it really fair to allow trans people to decide, based on their own judgement, whether they "pass" enough to use toilets for the opposite sex without causing any distress to the people those spaces are actually for?

I don't see why the fact that some people have gone to extreme lengths to change their appearance should be the rest of society's problem.

@Solonge Exactly! Focus on the real threat - predatory / abusive men. Don't divert to focussing on gender identity. Focus on predatory men full stop

OP nobody in the toilets really cares how you dress, or how you think or what you do or what name you call yourself or what pronouns. Honestly, nobody gives a ffff.

Read my previous post. I think you should probably use the female toilet unless you look scary to women. And you KNOW exactly what that means 😉

Well said.

I find the raving transpobia on this site so offensive (and I'm at least sympathetic to those with differing viewpoints to my own!).

There are no female boundaries that are respected now.

None. Zilch. Zero.

How far will this go and how many woman hurt in the process.

Collateral damage - acceptable as long as men get validation?

"A trans friend looks very much male. He still has a vagina (for many reasons) but I knew him as him, and had no idea he was trans for some time.

How would you feel if you saw him in a womens toilet? He looks, acts and speaks as a male. Without checking his sex organs, you would just see a man."

No one gives a shit about masculine presenting women in women's toilets. Or they didn't until LARPing men started invading women's spaces and making women nervous about who might be trying to sneak in.

Males are a threat to females, I think statistics show this. The majority of attacks are committed by males. A woman's toilet should be a safe space for women. Not for men.