Tavistock clinic to close as not safe for children

[GettingMarriedAgain]

Breaking news in the Times and Telegraph:

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/e1ed2bea-0e63-11ed-93cf-b011fa7fe86b?shareToken=4fa557c3083dee141defde72e0e53d54

This. CAMHS is already woefully underfunded. This is only going to work if that’s rectified.

Amazing news.
I’m so glad that regional centre will be opened instead to give children all over the country the help they need.

Wish they would close the whole of the Tavi down.

If I drank, this would be a champagne day.

Hope any new clinics are prohibited from association with hate groups like Stonewall & Mermaids.

Otherwise the same abuses will happen all over again.

If an adult presented at hospital claiming they identify as a paraplegic and demanding doctors remove their healthy limbs they would immediately be referred to psychiatry

So true @savehannah

I feel that this is a really significant event around the medical treatment of trans identifying children, which really has been the most dystopian aspect of the whole thing.

But I wonder whether the social transition assumptions and recommendations will continue? ( Change of name, pronouns etc) These are now so embedded in schools and health care professionals responses and recommendations I think it's going to take a while for the wider narrative and 'support' to change.

I don't think anyone would deny a child some relief, after every other avenue has been explored.

Fair point but would you give a child temporary relief that makes things worse in the long run? Doctor are usually brutal about not giving temporary relief that does damage later on, especially not to children, and especially not physically healthy children. Why should this be so different?

It also seems that going through puberty ends a lot of children's dysphoria, and there's no way to predict which children that will fail for. Postponing puberty prolongs the agony and it actually seems to direct children towards taking even more severe measures.

no irreversible treatments on developing bodies.

What medical treatment on developing bodies wont have irreversible effects? You can't turn back time.

What a huge relief!

Not RTFT but if this means not shoving distressed kids down a medical pathway with no proper expertise, oversight or long term follow up then this is long overdue.

This is quite possible.

Many health trusts are completely captured. They may feel that if services are dispersed their influence will be less visible. I hope Cass lays out clear treatment guidelines and supervision. Doesn't Dr Adrian Harrop work part time in some sort of gender provision in Manchester.

Camhs is underfunded and has very poor outcomes for those who do meet the thresholds.

We're deluded in thinking that we have effective mental health services for the mental health crisis we're seeing in young people and that the issue is just quantity not effectiveness.

The recent anti depression revelations should be a wake up call on this idea that mental health services are the answer to the mental health crisis.

Something is going very wrong in the experiences of young people leading to this mental health crisis and we should be addressing that instead of pretending we have professionals with the answers and all we need is loads more of them.

I

I think it's going to take a while for the wider narrative and 'support' to change.

Agree it will take time to recognise the damage done by "social transition" and to change all the recommendations, but now I feel very hopeful that they will change.

Spin from trans actual

twitter linlk

🥰😍😱😛😇🤯🫢🥳🥳🥳🥳🤩🥰

Rejoicing that the “affirmative approach “ is being shown up for what it is. Huge thanks to all of us who have made our voices heard , especially Keira, Mrs A , Sonia Appleby, David Bell, and the crowdfunders of course.
I am worried that while Higher Education centres and training institutes for many of the professions have been fully captured, how will new entrants be trained, and will there be retraining for those already in the Mental health services?
professional bodies will need to make huge statements about how they no longer subscribe to these harmful ideologies, before any of them will be trusted.

My immediate gut reaction was "oh no, now there will be ten times more gender identity services to be captured by extremists like Adrian Harrop et al".

The Tavistock was captured. Who's to say this won't simply turn into an opportunity for more clinics to become a home for gender extremists to push their ideology across the country?

Yes, and my worry is that puberty blockers don't do what they say they will do.

There's some evidence to show that they don't just block a child physically, but mentally too. Arresting a child's mental development forever can't be considered much of a treatment. Nor can the physical results be considered beneficial, if the child's mental capacity to judge is impaired.

I think there is an attitude that there might well be some children whose dysphoria cannot be resolved through talking therapies. But how you identify them, is another matter.

in summary, there will be some children for whom talking therapy doesn't work. But I agree, there needs to be a lot more research into the medical treatments available to decide whether or not they are a viable last ditch alternative.

Great news- particularly the apparent emphasis on mental health going forward. We need to understand what is going on here, why is this suddenly such a big thing? How many who went to school in the 70s,80s and 90s know people who were desperate to switch genders? I know one vaguely and that is surrounded by a multitude of mental health issues which seem to be finding an outlet. It’s not just the mental health aspects it’s society at large which needs to be addressed here, particularly the stereo typing of gender which increasing seems to be becoming more not less prevalent.

Lol

Gender Ideology and those lobby groups pushing it need to removed entirely from the NHS, it is damaging health outcomes, patient safety and dignity, especially for women.

There's not been any meaningful revelations about antidepressants that should be having any influence on whether they're prescribed. It's an academic discussion about mechanism of action. Questions of efficacy are separate. Personally I don't think SSRIs are particularly effective, and they're prescribed mainly because they're pretty safe, the placebo effect is real and important, and you never know, they might help a bit on top of that. But that's nothing to do with the research into MOA.

Aspects of your argument help the people who want to cut, cut and cut mental health services for children, young people and adults. There will always be some people who need specialist mental health care no matter how much we improve society because mental illness exists, is real, and can't always be avoided. We need to tackle poverty, abuse, racism, unhelpful societal trends, and other things that can trigger or exacerbate mental health problems and mental illness, but we also need well-funded mental health services for those who are mentally ill.

If these new regional hubs will help young people questioning their gender by tackling issues around ASD, child abuse, OCD, and so on as well as their gender issues, that's great, but what about those children who have all the same issues but haven't said the magic g-word — are they going to be left to struggle along while the special ones get swept off to a luxury holistic service?

This is very true.

The psychology profession, particularly children's services, has been utterly captured by this ideology.

It was not limited to the tavistock.

As I said they're going to need close scrutiny, clear principles, strong leadership and careful choosing of staff to ensure this doesn't just go to a version of the tavi still gender affirming but with stricter guidelines around prescribing.

Excellent news but I am concerned about CAMHS. Already unfit for purpose and their only objective at the moment is to get children off their books as quickly as possible (before either seeing or treating them).

it’s society at large which needs to be addressed here, particularly the stereo typing of gender which increasing seems to be becoming more not less prevalent

Exactly this. Why should someone who wants to wear a dress feel that it's "womanly" and therefore they must be a woman? It should be a nonsense (but sadly isn't). We accept girls climbing trees and women wearing trousers but we need to go a lot further. I imagine 90% of these cases would disappear if we let do what they like and not be hidebound by what people think a man or a woman should be like.

Interesting that Kemi Badenoch has tweeted her support for the decision. Seems that even the Equalities Minister was cowed and unable to express her real opinion!

yeeeeessssssssssssss

love it when sanity prevails