I am embracing virtue signalling pronouns in emails

[MsFogi]

I have realised I have made too many assumptions about gender over the years. I had always assumed that Paul (name changed of course) in my company was a man simply on the basis of his appearance (well over 6 foot, well built, big beard, low voice that only someone with an Adam's apple and whose balls have dropped could have). Imagine my relief to find that I have not been misgendering him for over a decade because he has helpfully added his pronouns to his email auto signature - they are he/him/his. There is no company diktat to add pronouns on emails so clearly this is important to Paul or maybe he has been misgendered recently.

So, I thought I would ensure that Paul was not offended on a Teams meeting this afternoon and kicked off the meeting by asking everyone to note that Paul's pronouns are he/him/his and that given that he has stated these that everyone please be sensitive to ensuring that they use them. No one said anything so I think they all took it on board, no one misgendered Paul and I like to think that his move to include his pronouns at work has been embraced in my meeting. Maybe as a result others that attended the meeting will add theirs to their auto signatures too.

If Paul needed to add his long established pronouns, or working hours, in his email, then he clearly wants attention drawn to them. There's likely to have been a misunderstanding somewhere along the line, with people asking him to complete work on a non working day, or mistakenly reading 'Paula' for 'Paul'.

How was it received, OP, given some scepticism here? I'd like to know the longer term impact. Perhaps everyone will add pronouns, to support Paul so he doesn't feel singled out in his need to publish pronouns.

Also snorting and loving “outwoke the woke”

Paul added his virtue signalling pronouns to his email in order to draw attention to them and his virtue signalling, why do it otherwise? Op merely ensured that everyone knew that Paul was being a good virtue signalling person and Paul can now polish his halo, pat himself on the back knowing that his colleagues are aware of his virtue signalling goodness.

Back to the team meeting, I think a good team leader would get ahead of this. Other team members would obviously notice Paul's new additions and questions/piss taking/even hostility could have been forthcoming. This was all neatly spiked by the OP, even if she was subtly mocking him.

Please can everyone try harder to remember that this is the feminism board, and that therefore our main objective in posting here is to learn more about how we can support the needs and feelings of people like Paul? I can’t quite work out whether the OP is bravely and kindly doing this, or is an evil TERF witch, but it is very, very obvious and sadly highlighted by this thread where women are mocking a brave for trying, that all of us, as women, need to try harder and do better.

Why does it make things easier?

But
terfisaslur.com/

Is downright chilling.
There is a massive difference between childish nastiness, which I dont agree this is, and death threats, yet I'm forever seeing women being told off for pointing out the death threats or sarcasm or irony or double standards. Why are we held to account for every one else issues. We are not your mummy. We are adults, Paul is an adult, I also dont agree is nasty, more irony, which the Brits are good at.

You think that SHE made him look silly by telling people that he was a he, even though it could not be any more obvious? You don't think HE made himself look silly by doing that?
Your response makes no sense. They both did the exact same thing, but he's a brave and compassionate ally and she's a unprofessional cowbag?

You don't see any issue with your analysis at all?

OP you are an absolute legend my friend, I woke up with a smile on my face thinking about this thread this morning.

@mnhq is there any chance we could move this thread to mumsnet classics?

Doing @mnhq does not send them a message. If you want to nominate a thread for classics you need to report it. I think they then discuss it... I'd take a guess some staff would enjoy this thread, others might view it as NITS.

I dont understand how you knew it was a woman. What pronouns can be used to signify a woman?

If those pushing for the universal use of pronoun declarations think that the majority are going to take it seriously then they will be disappointed. No matter how hard the thought police tell us how wonderful they are it's not going to happen.

Classics? Seriously. 🙄

Thanks @IcakethereforeIam i hope you managed to get a reasonable amount of sleep!

when people say ‘sensible discussion’, what do they mean? Where would this discussion take place? How would the result of such ‘discussion’ be implemented?

I don’t think you understand that this is about much more than putting a few harmless letters at the end of an email signature. And compelling others to do things they don’t want to do ‘because of my mental health’ is nothing short of emotional blackmail.

I am amazed at the number of suggestions on this thread that I was being a bully/taking the piss etc. and that Paul/someone in the meeting should complain. So Paul (a bloke) is allowed to embrace pronouns yet I (a middle aged woman) am not and if I do a bloke can complain about me doing so?

I'm not sure what the complaint is - "the lady running the meeting (I am not his boss btw) ensured that everyone respected my pronouns that I have recently added to my email autosig"?, "I added pronouns and the lady made me look silly because she took me seriously". If, by some miracle Paul/someone in the meeting finds a way to put together a coherent complaint about the way I chaired my (very serious) meeting I will be donning my rainbow lanyard and trotting off to see how HR works through the mind-contortions that would be needed to somehow say that, on the one hand, everyone is entitled to choose their pronouns and we must use them correctly but on the other hand middle aged women must not mention the pronouns unless we have been given permission to do so (maybe we'll need a company policy to state whether pronouns should be respected but not mentioned in meetings or respects and mentioned in meetings).

And to the point about working Monday-Thursday in an email footer - I absolutely would be bringing this up in my team meetings, often people working different days/hours get expected to be available 5 days a week whilst being paid for 3/4 and I am ferocious about ensuring any member of my team doing a different pattern has this understood and protected (in the same way that I don't ever schedule meetings outside of core business hours to ensure people aren't excluded because they can't attend due to family commitments).

I get that the implications of including pronouns in your email signature may vary depending on your work place. I haven’t told anyone else here that they should do it.

In my situation there is little downside to doing it - my workplace is about 65% women, and I genuinely have never felt that being a woman caused me any disadvantage. We have a small number of trans and non-binary colleagues. I’d say about 25-40% of colleagues include pronouns in their email signatures. There’s no drama, no argument, it doesn’t interfere with us doing our jobs. Those who don’t do it aren’t criticised or pressured.

Some people have also now started including an explainer of how to pronounce their name in their email signature, which can be very helpful.

Seriously considering changing my email signature to:

Kind regards,
Feisty
Gender Identity: don't have one
Religious Belief: don't have one
Disability: don't have one
Glad we cleared that up. Can we get some work done now please?

But I have a feeling work might view that as a provocative act?!?!

Well I do have a religion. And people have made unkind comments about it over the years. Perhaps everyone could state their beliefs in their email signatures so as to be aware of others’ beliefs and not offend?

Indeed. This would save confusion around religious holidays especially. We’d all know who to not say certain phrases too. Much more useful than pronouns.

It would also prevent people inadvertently offending with blasphemous phrases such as ‘oh god’, inappropriately offering pork/bacon/non halal food, saying ‘happy Christmas’ to Jehovah’s witnesses, offering food during fasting etc.
now I think about it this would have ten times the benefits that pronouns do.

Reminds me of new graduate trainees proudly putting "First Name Surname BA (Hons)" in their email signatures until they realise it makes them look like a bellend.

So Paul (a bloke) is allowed to embrace pronouns yet I (a middle aged woman) am not and if I do a bloke can complain about me doing so?

You've hit the nail on the head by identifying the manipulation, op.

We are supposed to use them. Indeed, we are expected to pretend to take them seriously.
If we show people that we are actually taking them seriously, without being impressed, indeed even contemptuous, then the manipulation and compulsion element disappears.

No one who has the slightest knowledge of this ideology can be unaware of how intimidation and threats are integral to it.
The bonkers overreaction to misgendering is an example.

You starting to look like you aren't being compelled, despite it being something that you probably don't agree with, isn't playing the game, is it.

I imagine your reaction to Paul was meant to be admiring of his bravery or progressiveness, or maybe it was expected that you would be slightly uncomfortable. Who knows? Perhaps Paul was looking forward to an opportunity to educate you about allyship.

I don't imagine, for a single minute, that you were meant to take it seriously enough to accommodate it 100%, whilst remaining singularity unimpressed.

And that's what are the naysayers on this thread are upset about. You are actively taking it seriously, but you're not being compelled, or forced to agree with the ideology.

You're doing it on your own terms. And therefore robbing it of it being on someone else's.

Not allowed.

However, mental health statistics for those who are trans are shocking

Shocking in that they are usually entirely invented.

If Paul had added his pronouns as serious 'allyship' for potential trans colleagues, rather than lazy virtue signalling, then the OP gave him the perfect introduction for him to explain this.