Single Sex Toilet issue creeping into everyday life?

[BoredofthisCrap7]

Just back from holiday in Cornwall.

Using the female toilets (public toilets) was very interesting.

Myself and two teenage daughters faced with fully grown man in the female toilets. These were public toilets, there was a female block, a male block and a disabled toilet. All open.
I was finished first and was outside waiting for my girls, when a strapping muscular 6 footer walked over to the male toilets, walked back out again, walked over to the ladies and checked the sign on the door (so knew it was female), then proceeded to go in anyway.
I followed him in to make sure my girls were okay. As they came out and stood at the sinks to wash their hands, he came out of the stall, over to the sink and stood there quite unperturbed washing his hands.

My daughters were mortified.
It did however give me a very good chance to explain the whole issue to them, including the fact that someone doesn't have to LOOK like a woman or make any changes at ALL to "identify" as a woman, which would (under self ID) give them the right to do this.

This man was in no way "trans" but it made me wonder if some men just feel now, that they can do whatever the hell they want in women's spaces and not have any deterrent or embarrassment about being there.
It was very intimidating - I did give him the evil eye but didn't feel like I could say anything to him, he was enormous.
There was no attendant to speak to.

Are women's spaces under such attack that even "normal" men think they are open to everyone?

On the flip side, I was recently at a concert where an older gentleman accidentally came in to the female toilets while I was at the sink (in fairness they were badly signposted). He was completely mortified, apologised profusely, and left immediately. THAT is how a decent man behaves when they find themselves in a woman's space.

And shop, cinema, theatre, school, office… if I read a review that included ‘unisex loos’ I’d choose elsewhere. I’m paying good money - so I choose somewhere that wants me.

My experience is that neither men nor women like sharing toilets.
I had experience of mixed sex toilets recently in a restaurant. It was abroad but it was a large private works do which had booked the entire restaurant. There were two separate doors about 20 feet apart marked with the usual men and women symbols but they opened into the same space with basins in an open area and half a dozen stalls.
Without exception every time someone left to go to the loo they were warned the loos were mixed sex. People were clearly very uncomfortable about sharing with the opposite sex even with people they 'knew'. It's not just an issue of safety, it's dignity and privacy too.

Yes to this. Every single time.

Interesting replies, thank you to all who have contributed.
For those asking why there would be a queue (or busier) toilets in the men's - it was very near a beach in Cornwall, there were loads of surfers and people doing other kinds of water activities.
Most of them seemed to be men - I presume there were just more men than women in that particular area of the beach.

I think what got me thinking was the two very different reactions of the men I have encountered in women's toilets in the last month. They were of two different generations and reacted very differently.
It makes me sad that younger men seem to feel no compunction about being in what was always a traditional female space, felt no desire to hurry up and get the hell out, didn't stop to think they might be threatening and intimidating, or simply didn't care if he did.

10 years ago, or even 5, I doubt any young man would not have rushed right out of there once he saw a woman and two girls inside.
Now it feels as though that boundary is gone.

Anyway, he KNEW it was the female toilet, he looked at the door before he went inside.
And went in regardless.

Get ready to challenge cos it will happen more and more. If the male loos were unusable the normal thing to do is say , excuse me, apologies, is anyone in there, I'm just going to go in when it's empty bc the mens are broken etc

This is misogyny

A man deliberately goes into the ladies while it's occupied and a woman standing outside. He doesn't apologise or explain - the very least I would expect when he's invaded someone else's space.
But no he's the victim. Maybe he didn't see the Op or her daughters, women can be invisible to men, it's not his fault.

Or maybe he's just an entitled idiot who thinks he's the only one who matters. Or maybe it's worse, could be this was a trial run and it was so easy.

I'm an older woman and I would definitely have said to him " sorry do you realise this is the ladies toilet?" to see what he said. He sounds like a rude prick and I believe that it is up to us to politely challenge these men. I understand that surprise initially takes over but I intend to challenge them every single time and I am 5 feet 2 🤨.

If he had was 5ft tall would you have said something?

A 5ft tall man is still way stronger than the average woman.

Yes, of course men think women’s spaces are fair game now. That’s a large part of the problem and has been from the start.

So youve used a airline or train loo ? Or gone into a small cafe with only one loo

Individual cubicals are not a threat. Go to the one with the shortest queu

"He could have used the empty disabled toilet."
No thanks. I have MS. I need a disabled toilet.

"So youve used a airline or train loo ? Or gone into a small cafe with only one loo "

These are individual cubicles not a toilet block. F. F. S.

Yeah, cubicles are so safe. Oh, wait! They really aren't are they? Unless they are properly built and do not open onto an enclosed space.

Why is it so hard to understand? The kind of man who would use women's loos without so much as a by your leave is not the kind of man you would challenge.

My DH wouldn't do it. Not even dickheadBIL would do it. Do you know any male who would?

Men get off on making women uncomfortable and testing their boundaries. Probably wanking over it later.

So am I 😤

It's not just in the cubicle - it is the whole of the area. Sometimes you just aren't feeling very well in all kinds of ways and want a bit of respite away from the male world. It's not just about physical safety - it is about mental comfort too.

The issue that terrifies me is that I’m followed into a cubicle by a man. This is more likely in mixed sex toilets.

No thank you.

Like 95% of people, I would prefer to use single sex facilities when out in public, especially if they are cubicles.

Individual self contained toilets on planes & trains I can live with, although I avoid using them where possible.

If a restaurant or venue has chosen to have unisex loos, they've chosen to do without my future custom & can expect me to review accordingly.

These toilets, however, were single sex, but some bloke decided to ignore that, at best because he's an entitled arse who doesn't care about making women & girls uncomfortable, at worst for nefarious purposes, & most likely, frankly, because he gets a nasty little buzz out of it.

Still no thank you.

FFS. Catch yerself on! His height is of no relevance. He's male and shouldn't be in the female toilets. At all. Ever!

YANBU.

“Do you realise you’re in the ladies?” To a big man would be dangerous. I’ve seen enough idiots on Twitter threatening violence to anyone who misgendering them. At the least the OP May have have risked an upsetting scene in front of her children.

and of course this is what the men rely on.

Are you intentionally ignorant or actually this stupid?

There is a very obvious difference. One is a room that contains a self contained toilet, sink, hand dryer and sanitary bin with a lock on the door that means you are the only person in the room with those things.

The other is a large room with a row of cubicles that often have large gaps at the top and bottom and a row of sinks that people gather together to use.

In the first example, like on an aeroplane or in your house, no one else is in the room with you.

In the second example a complete stranger could look over the top of the cubicle or push a phone camera under the bottom, will be stood next to you at the sink.

Now thinking objectively and using your common sense, do you see how those 2 situations differ?

This is how women are forced to navigate the world now. We are told that men are predators and we are responsible for ensuring we don't end up in a position of vulnerability but, somehow, simultaneously it is offensive to think of men as predators and we must assume that they are acting in good faith.

How many men have done terrible things when they have been given the benefit of the doubt? The uncertainty created by gender replacing sex is a gift to the worst of men.

So youve used a airline or train loo ? Or gone into a small cafe with only one loo

Individual cubicals are not a threat. Go to the one with the shortest queue.

Next you'll be telling us that we share our house toilets with men. Stop gaslighting, the toilet in question is a normal womens toilet with open top cubicles. You want to share with men on you go but we say no.

I've just recently read that one man can easily overpower two women. And you think OP should have just chatted to him?
For real?
If hes clued up enough to read the signs, he knows what he is doing is wrong. It smacks of the acronym we are not allowed to say, but requires the non consenting of women for the thrill.