Simon Rimmer's inadequate facilities

[boccajunior]

Lulabelle went to TV chef Simon Rimmer's new restaurant and was not happy with the unisex toilets

twitter.com/Lulabel06994981/status/1548085200407576582?t=MhkXwg2YEqjmfQiebhyTfQ&s=19

Just been to @simonrim's lovely new restaurant where I was disappointed to discover gender neutral toilets. Men and women awkwardly shuffling round each other wondering if they were in the wrong place. Yeuch.

Rimmer's been trying to defend them all afternoon but it's not been going well due to the fabulous, intelligent women making him look daft.

The lovely Maya Forstater has given up her afternoon to look into the building regulations and codes and it appears that she's unearthed some problems.

(warning long thread from Maya)

twitter.com/MForstater/status/1548348265791307781?t=zOcwHQP704sbKaRhGJE5Lw&s=19

Hopefully now he'll be forced to create single-sex spaces.

Unisex toilets mean men and women share the same facilities. Men and women are outraged, one anti-fascism campaigner automatically thinks that makes women transphobic, even when trans people weren't mentioned.

I think @antifascist is a bloke, by his own admission. So no, never had to use any sanitary products. But apparently knows all about the frequency of leaking accidents women have - extremely rare. I've been told, and shall write off all my memories of that as hallucinations

Boots x post because I did, but I wouldn't say that my remark was transphobic.

FYI, @antifascist, free education for you: 1 in 3 women develop fibroids. 1 in 3 of these show symptoms. That 1 in 9 women. Main symptom is heavy periods (NHS website). Mine were so disabling that I had to have a hysterectomy.

But yeah, sure, this is not at all a privacy and dignity concern, we're all just transphobic by not wanting the unisex loos, your logic is impeccable as ever

I don't know why anyone thinks the kind of men who enjoy harassing women on the street or in bars are suddenly going to behave themselves when gifted the opportunity to harass women in public toilets. Men don't need the law to make spaces men-only, they just need to make the atmosphere so hostile to women that women stay away.

A 10 year old girl at my primary school was raped by a man who followed her into a public toilet. When I was at a different primary school, a boy followed an 11 year old girl into the toilets and violently sexually assaulted her. A 16 year old girl at my secondary school was raped by a man lurking in the toilets of a theatre. A young woman I know was followed into the toilets in a park by three men who harassed and mugged her. An 11 year old girl was raped by a man in the toilets of a supermarket I used to frequent. A man disguised himself as a woman to record women using the toilets in a shopping centre I used to frequent ( his second such offence). Why make things easier for street harassers, voyeurs, flashers and rapists to offend against women? It's like legalising guns because people are going to commit murders anyway.

So much bad public policy is reliant on women quietly enduring and making do and being told that we are too demanding if we want a tiny bit of respite from the possibility of really grim male behaviour. I'm sick of it.

How often do you wash menstrual blood in restaurants

Erm, periods don't stop just because we're out in public, you know.

If a woman is on her period, in a restaurant (or any other building) then yes she'll likely need to use the toilet to change and clean up.

It's not an extreme example. Only a tiny bit of common sense is needed to realise that handling a blood soaked item, having your hand near something that's bleeding, increases the chances of blood getting on the hands.

It's not "transphobic paranoia" to feel incredibly uncomfortable having to clean up next to a bloke in a mixed sex toilet.

I can’t help thinking the best way to stop the whole unisex toilet trend would be to make sure any blood cleaning etc is done without subtlety or shame. Expose men to the exact things we’re concerned about and they’ll do the complaining for us. And annoyingly business will listen to them. An overflowing sanitary bin, with bloody towels, a smear of blood on the seat and a woman rinsing out her mooncup would send many men into a fit of the vapours and end this bullshit in a heartbeat.

Steve I totally agree. The only way to stop this shit is by making it a men's problem.

Everyone bloody hates unisex loos. I've worked in more than one workplace that had them, and men and women felt alike on this. I'd frankly be suspicious of any man who defended them - decent men don't.

Actually, yes.
The reason being I just don't think they'd give it much thought, and realise what they are agreeing to.
If they actually knew, I think the results would be very different.

Maybe those asked were imagining real unisex loos - where a sink is in with the toilet, not what he designed?

Yes, it's just you.

Women menstruate for about a week every month. About a quarter of the time, for almost all adult women. And, this may be news to you, they don't stay at home in a darkened room to do it. Working, shopping, the gym, restaurants - all have women's loos designed to accommodate this - in case you hadn't noticed.

Not to mention flooding, leaking breasts, morning sickness. Which can happen every day, several times actually - as you obviously don't know.

Most miscarriages happen on the toilet.

But that;'s just me

Privacy, dignity, safety. It's not a game.

Women's toilets aren't a validation tool for men, ffs.

Not wanting to share public toilets with males isn’t transphobic, it’s common sense. Accusing women of being transphobic for wanting safety and dignity is absolutely pathetic. Mens feelings do not those of women. No matter what they wear!

The number of men who are furious at Maya on that thread is very telling.

Woman's toilets are the most common, most accessible way for (some) men to validate their identity whilst making women uncomfortable.

Prisons, refuges, wards, sport - none of these are commonplace.

Loos are. They're the best resource.

The unequivocal removal of access is really getting pushback. That, and the furious dismissal of additional third spaces, speaks volumes.

“if someone needed to wash menstrual blood or anything else I would show compassion - perhaps leave a communal area”

Such touching consideration.

Not just periods; my miscarriage started when I was away and out.

The pain came on in waves and I was grateful to find a public loo I could hide till a wave and blood had passed that was for women and relatively quiet, as there were clearly enough womens loos for there not to be pressure on the one I found.

Could you explain to me exactly what's 'transphobic' about the provision of single sex toilets to protect the safety and dignity of women and girls?

No, antifascist hasn't noticed as antifascist is clearly male.

If they're not male they're clearly a female mens rights activist.

IKR?

'Man takes one look at woman washing blood off hands and walks out' isn't really the, er, compassionate solution that antifascist fondly imagines it is. 😁

In 50 years of using women's toilets I have never, ever seen women washing blood off their hands and clothing or taking off clothes to wash off menstrual blood. If I needed to do anything like that myself I wipe my hands within the cubicle and change my clothes there.

Even if you’ve never seen it with other women, it’s really never happened to you? You’re lucky, I remember about 10 years ago I had to remove my trousers to wash off the totally unexpected blood and get them under the hand dryer. I genuinely don’t know what I’d have done if it was a unisex toilet.

I think the fact that the formidable Maya Forstater is switching her lens to the toilet issue speaks volumes at how important these spaces are to protect.

S Rimmer could have very easily installed single cubicles with their wash facilities as a Unisex option, like so many new restaurants have these days.

Unfortunately council sign offs don't get enough scrutiny, if councils could get fined for breaching the EHRC and hopefully new guidance set by Kemi Badenoch that would help.

Dds friend, at a nightclub, got blood on her skirt

she was able to take her skirt off, run it under the tap and dry it with the hand dryer

couldnt do that in some clubs and restaurants

Most women don't look at other women long enough to notice what they're doing.

But there are countless posts of women flooding, on clothes, etc, and having to deal with menstrual issues. Not to mention all the other reasons women require privacy.

This constant need to justify what almost everyone regards as a universal truth speaks for itself.