Penny Mordant as PM - nooooooo...

[Sidaway]

Genuinely scared now that she might win - looks like she's second behind Rishi Sunak in nominations, and the most popular with Tory membership.

If gender self-ID is passed in law, it's going to be so difficult to repeal. (I don't trust her not to try, despite what she said on Twitter recently).

So also scared now that if she wins, the UK will go the same way re. gender policy as the US, Canada etc. and the UK as a beacon of reason in the world on this issue will be snuffed out forever. (Sounds hyperbolic but think it's near the mark).

How can we campaign to stop this? I've already emailed an appeal to the nearest Tory MP to me about this, but otherwise feel powerless.

Janice Turner in the Times on PM. Haven't got a share token but I could read it.
www.thetimes.co.uk/article/d3a5625e-02de-11ed-aa15-45d37b45dc0d?shareToken=769c56da779c583f1cc844c81bfa601e

Ultimately this isn't really to the point, because it's not like there are going to be officers of the law out there rapping the knuckles of men calling themselves women.

What's at stake are things like calling yourself a woman on an application to be a Guide leader, or in a hospital ward, or a rugby team, or on a birth certificate. Or who is included when the law talks about women.

You're absolutely right, Mangy - sorry if my flippant response came over badly.

I completely agree.

Tory MPs have repeatedly reported women to the police. Women are having to fight through the courts for their right to single sex spaces and free speech. Vulnerable, scared, uneasy and pissed off women and girls are compelled to give way to male bodied folk.

All under 12 years of Conservative government. The popularity of Penny TWAW Mordaunt is simply symbolic of how disposable women's rights are to the Conservative party.[sad[

I remain convinced that Sarah Vine is one of us.

www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-11011477/SARAH-VINE-Penny-Mordaunt-wont-stand-rights-women-never-vote.html

To many straight people, gay people were wanting to invade their space by wanting marriage

What nonsense. I’ll do you the kindness of assuming this isn’t complete word salad, and that you are confusing metaphorical spaces with literal, physical spaces.

The problem is that material physical spaces for women are being colonised by men, with negative consequences for our real material safety.

Could you please explain what physical spaces straight people had to sacrifice in order to permit gay marriage, and how straight people’s safety was endangered when it happened?

Why can’t someone just make a video cut of all the lies Mordaunt has told and how she contradicts herself? Wouldn’t seeing it all juxtaposed be enough to sink anyone?

I know being a shameless liar didn’t sink Johnson, but

a) I think it’s much harder for a woman to carry that off

and

b) I don’t think she is exactly a shameless liar. It’s more of a cowardly lie than anything that might be interpreted as charmingly roguish or however Johnson was seen.

anyway this seems so obvious I’m sure I’m missing some extremely good reason no one has done it already. Even if people don’t care about this issue, the lies are utterly cringeworthy.

The share token worked for me.

Sometimes, Penny, you have to choose between the chopper or the limo: you can’t ride in both. Indeed!

Could you please explain what physical spaces straight people had to sacrifice in order to permit gay marriage, and how straight people’s safety was endangered when it happened?

Absolutely this! After being "the nasty party", as Theresa May put it, the Conservatives belatedly saw the light on same-sex marriage. Seeing how well that went down with the British public foolishly thought that reforming the GRA would be more of the same, at almost zero cost to the public purse. But it wasn't, women's rights came under attack, and here we are...

Oops! That should be "Seeing how well that went down with the British public, the Tories foolishly thought that...".

Unfortunately she has been dishonest about her previous stance and actually outright lying about it.

I don't think she's confusing anything, she's simply saying that, in her view, some people felt that way, and that's why they opposed SSM.

Some who think that gender is a similar kind of thing see them as the same too, and that accounts for their approach.

You don't have to think any of them were correct to describe their thinking.

It does point to the larger problem though around authoritarian thought control and social discourse. Shutting down women with concerns about gender ideology is often justified on the grounds that of course it is ok to shut down bigots who have non-acceptable views about SSM, or race related topics, or whatever, and this is no different. In so far as that works it's because people accept the premise that there is no need to listen or consider what people have to say about those things if they fall outside the mainstream progressive viewpoint.

That assumption has created a huge weakness among many progressives and liberals. They don't know how to argue from principles, they don't really know the viewpoints of those they disagree with, only straw man versions, they don't know how their own views appear to others. And they can easily be disarmed if someone accuses them of wrong-think.

Good articles by Janice Turner and especially Sarah Vine - she covers a lot of areas that are impacted there, including prisons.

Gaslighter of the highest order.

I'm glad Janice Turner and Sarah Vine are writing about this.

I hope a Telegraph journalist picks up on it too.

Hadley Freeman also retweeted this letter from a former diplomat re PM's lying about Turkey and the EU

twitter.com/BestForBritain/status/1547203617425440769

It's on Sky News
news.sky.com/story/conservative-leadership-race-penny-mordaunt-suffers-first-setback-of-campaign-as-mps-attack-her-stance-on-trans-issues-12651613

I think there are quite a few journalists and columnists & bloggers on the threads, from the left, the right and centre. And I don’t just mean looking for stories - I mean as themselves, discussing their thoughts and ideas around women, society and politics.

Articles do then appear; and I don’t mind that. MN often gets a name-check, which can attract a few activist and campaign wankers onto the boards, but also highlights MN’s cultural importance as a political discussion space for women.

don't think she's confusing anything, she's simply saying that, in her view, some people felt that way, and that's why they opposed SSM.

she (?) is not describing a “feeling” but a belief: that spaces were being invaded. If she believes that other people had that belief, she should be able to explain which spaces they believed that about and she should be able to explain the comparison she chose to draw between those “spaces” and the real, material women’s spaces that are invaded by men under trans ideology.

Otherwise the post is incoherent rambling of the randomly-swap-words-around type so common among transactivists, and yes, it demonstrates extreme confusion and theory of mind failure.

David Frost just put the knife in Mordaunt on TalkTV: not across the detail, not tough, not always accountable or even present, and he has grave concerns about her as PM and would refuse to serve under her if she invited him.

Who is he backing?

@MarshaBradyo

He’s not an MP so he doesn’t get a vote. He says he’s openly backing nobody, but he’ll want one of the more right-wing candidates on the ballot (Braverman/Truss/Badenoch) and going for Mordaunt like this helps to make that happen.

Or it might help him. It depends whether he’s viewed as a sage making an important intervention or a has-been talking about things that have moved past him.

And he had to ask BJ to move her on from her post because she was that bad.

So the misogynists steering the Green Party here may be living anywhere in the world? That’s insane. Does any other party allow that?