LibDems and the LBGAlliance

[ChristinaXYZ]

twitter.com/mikedixn/status/1545468040711651329

Unbelievable: the LGBAlliance tweet that they're going to be at all the party conferences "we’ll be running a stand and a fringe event at the Lib Dems' annual bash in Brighton in September" and whoops the LibDems CEO tweets there has been an administrative error and there is no stand after all for the LGBA, "This is not correct. To confirm: you do not have a stand or a fringe at Lib Dem Conference. I have checked with the team and there has been an administrative error. Sorry for any confusion or inconvenience." A very half-heart apology there.

The LibDems have obviously been fielding complaints from teenagers again.

Why would anyone who is gay, or any woman, attend the LibDem conference with the intolerant attitudes they have?

Yes and it still happens today:

"The best evidence available on the extent of conversion therapy in the UK comes from the National LGBT Survey from 2017.
It shows that:

"5% of respondents said they had been offered conversion in an attempt to “cure” them of being lesbian, gay, bisexual, and transgender (LGBT) in their lifetime

"a further 2% said they had undergone conversion therapy

"4% of transgender respondents said they had undergone conversion therapy, and 8% reported having been offered it"

www.gov.uk/government/publications/the-prevalence-of-conversion-therapy-in-the-uk/the-prevalence-of-conversion-therapy-in-the-uk

, @Hearach15 , it's almost as if you are arguing that one woman's opinion is the same as all women's opinions. I presume you aren't.
In the same way I don't say that Peter Tatchell, a paedophile apologist, represents all of Stonewall. But I will do if that's how you want to argue it.

"The most common methods we identified involved a combination of
spiritual methods – for example, prayer ‘healing’ or exorcisms, and pastoral counselling
psychological methods – for example, talking therapies
The boundaries between religious and psychological approaches are often unclear with many combining the 2 in a way that could be described as pseudo-scientific."

www.gov.uk/government/publications/conversion-therapy-an-evidence-assessment-and-qualitative-study/conversion-therapy-an-evidence-assessment-and-qualitative-study

Again, what therapy where they actually offered?

Recently.

And what therapy is included in the current bill?

Surely if you are against it you know what it is?

"The most common methods we identified involved a combination of
spiritual methods – for example, prayer ‘healing’ or exorcisms, and pastoral counselling
psychological methods – for example, talking therapies

Oh so it is some sort of religious thing. So though churches, not the actual NHS.

Not actual therapy.

The very article you link to agrees that this was outlawed in the 1970s, so why do you think it needs including in a UK bill now? Just for virtue signalling reasons?

ECT is almost never used nowadays, and it was never specific to gender identity but was used for a variety of mental health conditions. It does remain a last rung (though controversial) treatment for severe depression. It’s always been more used in the US than here, and largely in depressed female patients — you can read about it in Sylvia’a Plath’s autobiographical novel The Bell Jar, for example.

Including trans in the conversion therapy bill would outlaw decent therapy for LGBT and any gender questioning children or adults. Psychological and medical therapy which is only one-sided is bad therapy. This is not only poor from a therapeutic point of view, but would encourage even poorer care for trans people, and would have the effect of encouraging more people to transition who really aren’t trans, and increasing the number of detransitioners. Or maybe you’re the kind of activist who doesn’t believe detransitioners?

Enshrining bad therapy and bad care in a conversion bill just because some poorly informed kids online like the sound of it, doesn’t do any favours for trans people, and you’re a dolt to think it does.

And read the bloody articles you link to, FFS. Bored of the teen rubbish now.

"The most common methods we identified involved a combination of
spiritual methods – for example, prayer ‘healing’ or exorcisms, and pastoral counselling
psychological methods – for example, talking therapies
The boundaries between religious and psychological approaches are often unclear with many combining the 2 in a way that could be described as pseudo-scientific."

No we are talking about quack medicine like exorcisms. That is what trans people have asked the Government to ban.

Maybe we should take lessons from Iran where it's "be trans or be executed " if you are gay.

That was to @Hearach15 who doesn't seem to know what they mean when they talk about conversion therapy

"Including trans in the conversion therapy bill would outlaw decent therapy for LGBT and any gender questioning children or adults. Psychological and medical therapy which is only one-sided is bad therapy. This is not only poor from a therapeutic point of view, but would encourage even poorer care for trans people, and would have the effect of encouraging more people to transition who really aren’t trans."

No it wouldn't and that is why the British Psychological Society:

www.bps.org.uk/news-and-policy/decision-exclude-transgender-people-conversion-therapy-ban-deeply-worrying-says-bps

And the Royal College of Psychiatrists (among other important groups) have urged the Government to think again:

www.rcpsych.ac.uk/news-and-features/latest-news/detail/2022/04/01/government-should-reconsider-its-plans-to-not-ban-conversion-therapy-for-transgender-people

Are you saying these people are wrong?

I'm convinced they're plants too.

LGBA: A minority of gay people view same-sex marriage as something they would not choose.

Hearach: The LGBA is bad and wrong. Stonewall have always been in favour of gay marriage and when they weren't it was because a minority of gay people viewed same-sex marriage as something they would not choose.

No we are talking about quack medicine like exorcisms. That is what trans people have asked the Government to ban

Can you link us to the statement that lists what it is that trans people want banning specifically.

So like this:

Banned - a, b and c
Acceptable - x, y and z

that sort of thing, for the current bill and not practices that were already outlawed 40 years ago.

Because as far as I can see, exorcisms wouldn't even be on the NHS's radar.

All sorts of otherwise sensible organisations are captured by Stonewall - fighting for their brownie points. They'll say all sorts of unscientific stuff to get up the Stonewall hit parade.

The stuff they are looking to ban are not NHS practices; the Government describes them as follows:

"Evidence suggests that modern forms of conversion therapy are commonly based on a belief that same-sex sexual orientations and transgender identities are developmental disorders, addictions or spiritual problems.

"The most common methods we identified involved a combination of
spiritual methods – for example, prayer ‘healing’ or exorcisms, and pastoral counselling
psychological methods – for example, talking therapies

"The boundaries between religious and psychological approaches are often unclear with many combining the 2 in a way that could be described as pseudo-scientific."

You can read the full report here:

www.gov.uk/government/publications/conversion-therapy-an-evidence-assessment-and-qualitative-study/conversion-therapy-an-evidence-assessment-and-qualitative-study

i would also like a link to this. I think @Hearach15 is not up with the current trans ideology where even questioning someone saying they think they are trans is conversion therapy. Maybe @Hearach15 needs to meet up with some if the many many trans people they know and her the facts right before commenting.

"Evidence suggests that modern forms of conversion therapy are commonly based on a belief that same-sex sexual orientations and transgender identities are developmental disorders, addictions or spiritual problems.

"The most common methods we identified involved a combination of
spiritual methods – for example, prayer ‘healing’ or exorcisms, and pastoral counselling
psychological methods – for example, talking therapies

"The boundaries between religious and psychological approaches are often unclear with many combining the 2 in a way that could be described as pseudo-scientific."

You can read the full report here:

www.gov.uk/government/publications/conversion-therapy-an-evidence-assessment-and-qualitative-study/conversion-therapy-an-evidence-assessment-and-qualitative-study

So hearach's assertion is that trans people want to ban
"pastoral counselling psychological methods – for example, talking therapies" ?
Or only when in combination with prayer?

Hearach, instead of copy and pasting - can you actually answer the question specifically? Alisondonut even set out a format for you to be able to give the information required. Can you not do that?

Yes they want the quack science as listed above banned.

I'm pretty sure that Alba is also gender critical and supports sex based rights. Although that doesn't help those of us who live outside Scotland.

Hearach - please can you write yourself what it is specifically that trans people want banned.

Do you actually mean 'counselling services'? That seems unlikely but that seems to be what you're linking to. It says 'methods' but can you specific why what means? Saying 'quack science' isn't specifying anything. Can you still not do that? I genuinely can't tell from your vague pasted text what it is you mean.

Talking therapies? Psychoanalysis? It seems odd to want to ban that en masse.

Come back and join us. There's a good group of Greens who are fighting back.

There are elections coming up for deputy leader and positions on GPEX (the executive) and we have gender critical Greens standing for all but one of the roles (should have been all of the roles but that's another story).

We need members who understand the importance of sex based rights and anyone who joins the party by the end of July will be able to vote.

That's because "GC issues" such as male demands for access to lesbians' bodies as their right, or the right for lesbians to have female-only meetings, are very obviously issues pertaining to the gay community.

That's good news cariadlet - I would be completely done with Greens but if there's hope... anyone know how Dawn Furness's case against them is going?

I know that she's very happy with her lawyers and feels she has a strong case but she can't say too much at the moment.

There are crowdfunders for Dawn, Emma Bateman and ShahrarAli if anyone is able to support any of them.

Which is defined as what exactly?

What even is quack science? Do you mean homeopathy, or massage, or are you just banning exorcisms? Because as far as I can see, exorcisms should be banned outright not just for trans people so is it not better to seperate out these quack therapies that should be banned completely?