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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Bristol Council goes for broke

104 replies

PearlClutch · 06/07/2022 16:18

Not quite sure what they're up to, but it doesn't seem very legal.

twitter.com/Womens_Voices_/status/1544654522831749120

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Igmum · 06/07/2022 17:22

Bloody hell Bristol. Some great good sense from the Tory councillor there and two others made very good points but the rest were just insane and the Chair was determinedly interrupting all of the non-GC speakers. This cannot be legal. And where's their Equalities Impact Assessment? 🤦‍♀️

WeeBisom · 06/07/2022 17:29

I’ve read Maya’s judgment today, and this declaration by the council violates the equality act. You can’t get people to “affirm” that trans women are women, just like you can’t get people in a council to affirm that Jesus Christ is our lord and savour.

As for the part which says gender critical views can be held but not expressed, this is incorrect. The judgment held that gender critical beliefs themselves (such as a belief that trans women are not women and are male) is not inherently offensive or bigoted and may be expressed so long as it is not done in a harassing fashion. (To give an example , there was a case where an evangelical Christian was permitted to say that she thought gay sex was a sin so long as her discussion was respectful and it didn’t turn into a targetted harassment of saying to a particular gay person they were a sinner).

this means that gender critical beliefs are protected and may be expressed. A person may freely say they don’t believe a trans woman is a woman, because that in essence is the very core of gender critical belief. This whole “you can believe it but not express it” point is specious bullshit… the entire point of having free beliefs is the ability to express them.

I think there is going to be much wailing and gnashing of teeth when the full implications of this are realised. We are no longer forced to go along with the idea that a man is a woman because he believes it is so, and we have the full right to politely express that we don’t believe trans women are women. We are just going to have to learn to live together !

Tabitha005 · 06/07/2022 17:30

dropthevipers · 06/07/2022 16:31

What the fuck is non binary healthcare when it's at home?

No-one knows and anyone who appears as though they even have half a clue will change their mind by the weekend anyway.

Tabitha005 · 06/07/2022 17:33

@WeeBisom succinct and eloquent. I've been thinking about Maya's judgement all day and musing on the 'belief' element.

McDuffy · 06/07/2022 17:35

Manchester had a similar motion in February Hmm

stayingpositiveifpossible · 06/07/2022 17:47

Oh God.

sweetgrapes · 06/07/2022 17:48

So go big or go home?
Hopefully they are going home.

Davyjones · 06/07/2022 17:53

Expensive accommodation
expensive cost of living
and all this

won’t be moving to Bristol

they say it’s grim up north but it’s cheap and you don’t see hide nor hare of this crap

GerryAtrick · 06/07/2022 17:58

Labour mayor and labour and greens the highest number of seats.

Why doesn't that surprise me?

PearlClutch · 06/07/2022 18:05

Comment from Anya Palmer, of Maya Forstater's legal team:

'Seriously, Bristol City Council? You're going to need a bigger legal team.'

twitter.com/anyabike/status/1544594946736504833?cxt=HHwWgoC-ofS6wO8qAAAA

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Herja · 06/07/2022 18:07

Useless fucking pricks, as ever.

I swear the only thing that council has ever achieved successfully was deliberately fucking up driving in the city centre (about 20 years ago, as a deliberate policy to make it car un-friendly. Worked great before that).

LaughingPriest · 06/07/2022 18:08

I’ve read Maya’s judgment today, and this declaration by the council violates the equality act.

Yep, exactly this.

GC beliefs are that sex is real and immutable. So that will no longer be allowed to be taught?
Anyway, today I identify as trans (agender or bi-gender), and I perceive that motion to be transphobic. I assume they will be overturning it due to its own rules.

It's just absolutely depressing how much public money will be pissed away trying to resolve this.

TheBiologyStupid · 06/07/2022 18:14

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

Yup, once every five years or so...!

suckingonchillidogs · 06/07/2022 18:16

I couldn't bring myself to vote for anyone if there's an election any time soon, it's so depressing. Unless there's a Monster Raving Loony candidate.

OneOfThoseOldFashionedWomen · 06/07/2022 18:24

And this is why I don't think getting rid of the Conservatives is so simple. If you vote Labour/Green in Bristol you are voting for people that believe in WrongThink.

Orangesarenottheonlyfruit · 06/07/2022 18:33

I've been lurking on the sidelines of this issue but this has tipped me over the edge, especially as it is in my backyard. What can I do to protest about this madness?

Shehasadiamondinthesky · 06/07/2022 18:38

What they fail to understand is that 98% of people just don't give a shit.

donquixotedelamancha · 06/07/2022 18:42

Unless there's a Monster Raving Loony candidate.

The Lib Dems field candidates in most areas.

AngelicaElizaAndPeggy · 06/07/2022 18:44

Someone's taken a long time to type all that out.

I'm sure it's all very worthy but I just don't really care about trans rights. I'm not trans, don't know anyone who's trans, if they want to be trans then crack on but it just doesn't interest me.

Sorry if that makes me a shit person, but I feel like there are other things taking up my capacity for worry right now. Like the war in Ukraine, the cost of living crisis, women's rights to abortions being threatened in the US and the fact that the Earth is literally cooking. I feel like all this trans stuff is fiddling while Rome burns.

OneOfThoseOldFashionedWomen · 06/07/2022 18:53

Angelica it's even worse than that. They are protected, they do have human rights, gender critical people support their rights and on the whole would fight and support those rights. They are not allowed to be discrimated against and quite rightly. So it's not worthy.

However women are also allowed their rights, their rights to single sex provisions. Rights that trans activists wish to take away. This motion by BCC does more to harm trans identifying people than help.

PearlClutch · 06/07/2022 18:56

Orangesarenottheonlyfruit · 06/07/2022 18:33

I've been lurking on the sidelines of this issue but this has tipped me over the edge, especially as it is in my backyard. What can I do to protest about this madness?

Get active. Join groups. Write to decision makers.

I would get in touch with the councillor in my OP.

twitter.com/SteveSmith98

Contact Women's Voices and/or other feminist groups; there will be some local to you.

Write to every MP and councillor you can that's nearby. Make appointments to see them in person.

I expect there will be a legal challenge to some of the things in that - it's an open goal for anyone who wants to put to use the Maya judgement ...

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PearlClutch · 06/07/2022 18:57

AngelicaElizaAndPeggy · 06/07/2022 18:44

Someone's taken a long time to type all that out.

I'm sure it's all very worthy but I just don't really care about trans rights. I'm not trans, don't know anyone who's trans, if they want to be trans then crack on but it just doesn't interest me.

Sorry if that makes me a shit person, but I feel like there are other things taking up my capacity for worry right now. Like the war in Ukraine, the cost of living crisis, women's rights to abortions being threatened in the US and the fact that the Earth is literally cooking. I feel like all this trans stuff is fiddling while Rome burns.

Trans people have the same rights as everyone else; as is right and proper.

What motivates me is that I'm being told - quite bluntly, in this case - that I am not allowed to hold my own views, express them openly, or have the rights afforded to me in the Equality Act upheld.

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IdiotCreatures · 06/07/2022 18:58

Will they be producing a similar manifesto for homeless people?
As I am sure that homelessness effects a lot more people in their area and I am also sure, that like most councils in the UK, they have a huge backlog of people waiting on suitable housing.
🙄

PearlClutch · 06/07/2022 19:03

iDK, do the homeless people have a nice, snazzy flag and some cool slogans to chant?

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FemaleAndLearning · 06/07/2022 19:12

Fuck me have they lost the plot. Compelled speech, not allowing others to hold their own beliefs.