LGB Alliance to plan helpline with Lottery funding

[pombear]

Fantastic news.

I would link to their Twitter announcement, but in usual state of play, Twitter has marked it ' may not be appropriate for people under 18'. A helpline planned for 13 to 25 year olds, planned by a panel of experts in child protection, education, helpline delivery, fundraising and psychology.

Yep - shut them down (much better to have helplines planned by IT workers who took their child to Thailand...)

As LGB Alliance state there is no dedicated national service of its kind for young LGB people in the UK.

I'm sure the Lottery Fund will be getting a lot of feedback right now, given the outpouring of hyperbole against LGB Alliance right now on Twitter.

So they may appreciate feedback from those who may see this as a positive move too:

""We really value your feedback. If you have a comment or complaint about the services that we provide, or if there's something important you think we should know, we'd love to hear it. Please email us at [email protected]"

I mentioned three achievements from the past two decades - which you've now rejected as immaterial because they are "historic".

They're not immaterial - they're just as much LGB Alliance's achievement as Stonewall's, given the way that the people involved back then have ended up split between the two organisations.

The current Stonewall organisation is running down the goodwill generated by the historic actions of both current LGB Alliance and Stonewall members.

LGB Alliance is continuing the original work of Stonewall supporting gay and lesbian rights.

The current Stonewall is undermining its original work by calling homosexuals "sexual racists".

Secondly, they have very few volunteers and most of them are motivated more about having a go at trans people than actually helping gay people.

Again, please provide evidence for this?

Where are you getting this information from that has been verified as to its accuracy?

And please provide evidence that 'most of them are motivated more about having a go at trans people'. Because we are on page 15, and there has been nothing, nothing as yet to show this. Just a whole lot of hyperbole and supposition.

Thirdly, young people are very trans inclusive, so the phones will not exactly be ringing off the hook.

Perhaps you might be surprised to also realise that young people are also some of the least tolerant people in the UK. You can look up the Dr Frank Luntz study published by yougov in July 2021, and the follow up study in December 2021.

I also think that this was a finding in the moreincommon data just released.

www.moreincommon.org.uk/media/p5uln04a/britons-and-gender-identity-data-tables.pdf

P. 22 is the question: How would you feel if your child, sibling, or close family member came out as gay/bisexual/lesbian?

The age group 18-24 reported that 5% would be angry and 6% would be disgusted.

25-34 was 3% & 4%
35-44 was 4% & 4%
45-54 was 2% & 2%
55-64 was 3% & 4%
65+ was 1% & 2%

And by the way, on page 24 that same group reported they would feel 'disgusted' at 7% which again was higher than the other age groups for the question How would you feel if your child, sibling, or close family member came out as transgender?. They also reported higher on 'unbelieving' and 'angry'.

thank you by the way for Starlee* for mentioning that study upthread.

There are several threads on MN looking at the data now. Maybe Starlee would like to check those out. Considering the analytic qualifications of many MN'ers, this is a good place to see what that data says.

So... again, hearache please provide evidence that young people will not be calling LGB Alliance because they are 'very trans inclusive' when it seems very clear that these young people are facing some very negative reactions from 'other young people'.

Before I read the rest of the thread I want to thank you for this. I think the LGB Alliance need my wee donation more than the Trussell Trust do right now so I just went on and changed it. Thank you.

I mentioned three achievements from the past two decades - which you've now rejected as immaterial because they are "historic". Well they are not that historic because most LGBT people remember a time before marriage equality. Thank you Stonewall for everything you've done for us!

Coming back to this.

I have not dismissed these events as immaterial. Please show me where I did, and if I need to correct my statement I will.

I said, and you even posted it in your answer:

You wrote, "you can discount the things they have not achieved recently for LGB people as one of the largest charities / educators about LGB people for decades".

I said specifically 'recently'. Maybe you missed that even though you posted it. My sentence may not have been clear, and I will take that criticism as it is very true. Just to put it back into context.

I said "So, you can discount the things they have not achieved recently for LGB people as one of the largest charities / educators about LGB people for decades, because of their work in 'Afghanistan'?"

Let me rephrase it.

So, you can ignore that Stonewall has delivered significant LGB targeted successes, despite them being one of the largest charities / educators about LGB people for decades, because of their work in 'Afghanistan'? ie. you can accuse LGB Alliance of not achieving anything in comparison to ???. What has Stonewall achieved in the UK since LGB Alliance's creation just for LGB people (despite having the amazing goodwill and power that they have earned for decades).

Is that clearer?

I have been also very clear in stating that these events may well have been supported by the founders of the very organisation you seek to portray as 'hateful' and of being of no relevance.

Please post successes that Stonewall have achieved just for LGB people since LGB Alliance has been created .... such as have they denounced those abusing and threatening lesbians for rejecting male partners for example. Have they done this one simple thing?

yes. I believe they were instrumental in that.

Hi Starlee or Hearach

You might well have missed my earlier question so thought I will ask again.

My oldest used to say that they were a transgirl but, for the last year or so, says that they now see themself as non binary. They also say that they are gay.

From your experience of the current thinking in the LGBTQ+ community, would you say that means my oldest's gay sexual orientation is more likely to be towards male people (ie same sex attracted) or female people (ie same gender attracted)?

Thanks for any clarity you can give.

So, you can ignore that Stonewall has delivered significant LGB targeted successes, despite them being one of the largest charities / educators about LGB people for decades, because of their work in 'Afghanistan'?

oh Ffs. Has not delivered.

They are right. No young child has gender dysphoria.

Again, the problem here is that you think statements of fact such as “sex is real, and fixed” are transphobic.

Have you heard of a place called Northern Ireland? You might want to Google when it legalised gay marriage (abortion too while we're on the subject).

And yes, you are right, I am extremely prejudiced against transphobes.

I have no idea who your child is attracted to. That's up to them to figure out. What a weird question.

Have you heard of a place called Northern Ireland? You might want to Google when it legalised gay marriage (abortion too while we're on the subject).

oh dear … still doubling down and missing the points I raised.

Look… there is a squirrel…. Is it a red squirrel or a grey squirrel… no matter, it is still a squirrel.

And yes, you are right, I am extremely prejudiced against transphobes

yeah ok . I am sure you feel righteous and morally superior too!

You seem still unable to engage with the substance of the issues and every post just reiterates that you cannot.

You seemed to be unaware than NI only legalised gay marriage a few years ago. This is not a squirrel. It is a fundamental right for LGBT people and it reveals how out of touch you are with the community - hence the support for the LGBA.

and the distraction continues.

Nothing else to offer?

And what has Stonewall contributed that has tipped the balance regarding abortion in NI that feminist groups have not? Seems like you are trying to attribute fighting for abortion to be a primary Stonewall issue.

Oh … look … a squirrel!!!

While you are here, any evidence that the founders I listed were not fighting with Stonewall specifically or with an aligned group to achieve those events you mentioned???

Anthing other than sparple?

And that tweet you posted… any progress on engaging with the original thread, in the original context ?

or just further misrepresentation?

From that entire thread you post that?

Why am I not surprised?

Sparple away!

Take yourself down to a gay bar and chat with a few of the locals.

What century are you living in? There have been no gay bars since the mid-noughties, when straight people began to take them over. I can remember going down Canal Street in 2008 and in every lesbian bar there was at least one transwoman, too often standing alone and glowering in a corner.

Well Pluvia… I just took this inane suggestion as confirmation that some posters cannot conceive that other posters on this thread know either trans people or LGB people.

It is hilarious really.

^Take yourself down to a gay bar* … errrr no need. How about I discuss it with my colleagues and my family and friends? Oh that is right, we need to educated because we have absolutely no LBG people or trans people in our lives.

Because if we did, they would have ‘educated’ us to agree with the posters posting these inane comments… because no LGB or trans person can hold an opinion that differs from the publicised line.

The relationship between the L & the G & the B has always been wonderfully harmonious and everything is awesome!!!!

In contrast, the LGBA was set up with the sole purpose of opposing gender identity, it is the stated reason for their existence, as in their mission statement, they are based on discrimination and hatred of another minority, protected group of vulnerable people.
Supporting them is supporting the opposition and discrimination of trans people.

Rewording the bullshit doesn't stop it being bullshit.

Science doesn't agree with you. www.dictionary.com/e/choice-change-convert-lgbtq-harmful-language/

I've never said their bodies are wrong, and it's wrong to tell kids that they are. Being "born in the wrong body" is how many trans people describe how they feel, their words, not mine.

That really makes no sense whatsoever. Trans lives are being excluded and discriminated against in the same way black lives are, and so both groups are currently in need of extra help to fight that discrimination.

@Helleofabore The T is not being "forced teamed with the LGB?" The majority of LGB people WANT the T included, you and the LGBA are the minority who are trying to force them out.

"Yet.... even you admitted in that post that being 'T' was not like being 'LGB"'.
You stated it clearly: 'In the past far too many trans kids never knew about gender identities and grew up thinking they were LGB although something still felt 'wrong'.'"
Admitted? I've never denied it, of course trans and LGB are different things, although some people are both trans and LG or B.
Kids in the past didn't have access to info like they do today, they assumed they were gay because that's all they'd heard about. And then finally they realise, often after many years, sometimes decades, that they are actually trans and everything becomes clear. THAT is what you will be told over and over again if you actually listen to trans people talk of their own experiences, they're not my words.

As for the rest of your post, you don't agree with my replies, well that's your problem, not mine.

@Artichokeleaves "And yet lesbian and gay people are being told by the same TQ+ political agenda that they cannot be L and G, homosexuality is like racism, they know wrong and it's all bias and prejudice that they must unlearn, and they must 'learn to cope' with straight sex so they do not distress a TQ+ person who wishes to maintain the uninterrupted illusion of their preferred sex and so identifies as being gay and wanting sex with a gay person."

What absolute rubbish! No-one is telling them they "cannot be L and G, homosexuality is like racism" etc or that they "must 'learn to cope' with straight sex".
You don't seem to realise that a large number of trans people are also LG or B. www.lgbt.cusu.cam.ac.uk/trans/the-t-within-lgbt/