Waitrose delivery driver

[MsMoorhead]

Kellie Jay-Keen reported by her Waitrose delivery driver!

@Discovereads that "subset" being about 90% of the total.

I never said KJK actually said that she wanted the driver to lose their job. That’s why I’ve ignored those cheeky questions because its posters being disingenuous by asserting KJK couldn’t possibly want the driver sacked because she hasn’t actually come out and said it.

I said that KJK wants the driver to lose their job because of her actions- she’s posted a public video in which she talks about the incident, the nature of the counter allegations she says she has put in her response letter back to Waitrose, and so on make it clear to me that she is after the drivers job.

The subset of transwomen who have not yet had surgery @Discovereads?

That'd be most of them.

Vast majority of 1600 people really isn't the vast majority of the British public now is it 🙄

I’d like to think MN while rightly tolerant of GC beliefs would not let obvious transphobia stand. Nothing in the incident that happened indicates that the Waitrose delivery driver is likely to physically attack anyone.

make it clear to me that she is after the drivers job

ahhhhh gotcha

one of those ‘tone’ type thingies

I did say "would be happy to say trans women are women" not "literally believe trans women are women".

But fair enough, my estimation very high. I strongly suspect that the vast majority of that 33% neither believe that TW are literally women in the same way that women are women, nor believe that TW should have identical rights to women.

It's a pity that professionalism is, like truth and fact, a rare beast nowadays.

@Discovereads Where did I say that this entitled man was likely to attack someone? I didn't, I suggested that knowing that he is argumentative, unable to respect women's boundaries and willing to refuse a woman's request for him to leave her property immediately. Given that Waitrose now know that about him they are leaving themselves open to massive criticism if they allow him to continue to go on as before. Maybe it is only a 1% or 5% or 25% chance that he would ever assault a woman, but Waitrose have had fair warning that he is the sort of man who might. If he had punched KJK he should be sacked and never given a customer facing role again. In this circumstance I think that he should probably be taken from a customer facing role, and hopefully sacked. But the one thing that needs to be done is that he needs to be kept away from women who are alone.

HoppingGreen
This isn't anything to do with whether it is fine to not have firm opinions on an issue. The driver is trans so definitely has firm opinions, and KJK certainly does.

This is about the social norms of where you initiate discussion. Richard Dawkins has made a reputation for himself on his willingness to argue with creationists. Does that mean that a supermarket delivery driver who believes in Young Earth Creationism is entitled to tackle him on any of it in Richard's own home while delivering his food for the week? Absolutely not!

Simply put I disagree, this incident would indicate that this wdd is likely to physically attack a woman in the right circumstances.

I never said KJK actually said that she wanted the driver to lose their job

She wants the driver sacked now

oh nope, got it wrong…its not a tone thingy. Its cos you said she wants the driver sacked

i see where the confusion is now…you said KJK wants the driver sacked and everyone completely misinterpreted it to mean that you’d said that KJK wanted the driver sacked

got it

Oh no she didn't.

Yes you parsed it like that. You took exception at The Man in the story as you equated him with the Waitrose worker.

But you did not take umbrage at Little Old Lady, equated in an horrendous display of ageism, with KJK. Well, maybe if you were looking offence.

You saw one and not the other. How odd!

MNHQ tend to err on the side if caution, especially if your report contains trigger words, like transohobia. Doesn't mean you have been vindicated, just that you know which buttons to push.

So... the simple fact that KJ spoke publicly about this means that she wants the driver sacked. Despite not ever saying that, or in fact actually saying that she was happy to accept Waitrose deciding not to deliver to her anymore, if that's what they wanted.

Oh! What changed your mind about that post?

I just felt sick after I realised I had summarised portions of @GCRich ’s transphobic post with more detail than I was comfortable with. It was a gratuitously violent fiction and repeating it even to criticise just did not sit right with me.

@RufustheFloralmissingreindeer
”i see where the confusion is now…you said KJK wants the driver sacked and everyone completely misinterpreted it to mean that you’d said that KJK wanted the driver sacked. got it”

Exactly right. Thank you

Such hyperbole. We are all adults. Yes, it was an unpleasant scenario but you didn't actually repeat it. You complained about one half of the people substitutions, hence my post about it.

We may not be able to see it but I do remember what I replied to.

Exactly right. Thank you

no problem whatsoever

glad to help

No but I think a simple “ I do not agree with you, don’t wish to discuss it and I would like you to leave my property immediately” would have been a better way to go than to give this person the reaction they wanted.
No being kind or polite or allowing them to push boundaries but no drama either
But as I said, that wouldn’t really have been podcast worthy would it?

Well they weren’t people substitutions. @GCRich made it explicitly clear they were writing about the waitrose delivery driver in that post and also in their still standing subsequent posts about that post.

He asked her a direct question @Hoppinggreen - when you say women deserve single sex spaces, that includes transwomen does it?

What was she supposed to do? Lie? Say no but I don't want to talk about it, just give me my cheese? What?

Thats my point. You keep repeating the same thing. I am not arguing about.what was written but rather your response.

You noticed that and are incensed on behalf of the Waitrose employee.

But have no such thought about how KJK was portrayed.

Ageism doesn't cross your mind... you have a bias and are repeatedly showing it

That amuses me...

KJK wasn’t portrayed in the now deleted post.

Have no idea why you are going on about ageism.