Scotland GRA

[Cismyfatarse]

Can I ask people to fill this in? Scotland is probably going to vote against the needs of women and girls. We will then need to raise money for the court battles.

https://yourviews.parliament.scot/ehrcj/gender-recognition-reform-bill/?utmsource=twitter&utmmmedium=spehrcj&utmmterm=&utmcontent=38d44a5a-ba1c-4271-b2ce-b222beca97b8&utmm_campaign=ongoing

Oh dear Elaine basic language seems to be beyond you. So I'll spell it out really simply in the hope you can understand.

The statement " I'm NOT heterosexual, I'm NORMAL " states that you regard NOT being heterosexual as being NORMAL and therefore, by reasonable assumption, BEING heterosexual as being the OPPOSITE ie ABNORMAL. Which is the definition of HETEROPHOBIA.

I put lots of capitals in there to help you follow the simple logic.

And just for clarity, it is NOT transphobic to state that adult human females are women, no clarifier needed. This is because transwomen are not women, they are transwomen. So two separate classes of people with their own perfectly descriptive word. I fully support the rights of transwomen to be treated with respect and dignity the same as I support the rights of women to the same.

I am not suggesting they would lie to get a GRC. I am suggesting that someone who is willing to lie and cheat will not get a GRC to commit a crime, they'll find quicker and easier ways.

Quicker and easier? Under self-ID, what could be quicker and easier than signing a declaration? Takes just a few minutes.

You do realise that you're making a good case for keeping the GRA as it is, with at least some gatekeeping to keep out the sexual predators, don't you?

@CatherinaJTV

At least the men's rights activists on the thread show the lurkers just how easily they dismiss the effects of men being allowed to appropriate our sex class.

I am a women's rights activist. There is nothing feminist about the genital policing mindset that underlies anti-GRC reform activism. Already, women are being challenged/assaulted for not presenting "feminine" enough.

Do you have any evidence of these challenges and assaults? Seems pretty unlikely to me.

The first quote is implying that "hetero" is the norm, it's inherently homophobic to suggest that homosexual people aren't normal

People are saying "I'm not cis I'm a woman who needs no qualifier". It's normalizing being cisgender to suggest that all women are cis, again, inherently transphobic

Most people on the planet are heterosexual so that is as a species, 'the norm'. Not one person here has suggested that this means in any way that being gay is somehow abnormal.

Cis is nonsense. Women are female. We don't need a qualifier to distinguish us from a subset of men.

Using the term 'cisgender' is simply you forcing your religious beliefs, that you think people can somehow mind over matter themselves to being the opposite sex, onto everyone else.

This poster just started a goady thread about how it's transphobic not to sleep with trans people, now deleted, so I wouldn't expect too much.

no, I am not suggesting they would lie to get a GRC. I am suggesting that someone who is willing to lie and cheat will not get a GRC to commit a crime, they'll find quicker and easier ways. That has nothing to do with trans people and it would be so nice if we could have discussions about GRC or other trans related issues without descending into violent [sexual] fantasies.

So people will lie and cheat about everything else but no one will ever lie and cheat to get a GRC. Uh huh. 🤔

In order to make good laws we must talk about worst case scenarios to prevent against people being harmed. That you call them fantasies is very telling.

@Ereshkigalangcleg

This poster just started a goady thread about how it's transphobic not to sleep with trans people, now deleted, so I wouldn't expect too much.

Why am I not surprised by that Eresh...

I really hope that poster does as suggested on the other deleted thread and starts the same thread on AIBU. I really would love to see what the general boards would make of it.

People spent years training as a priest or football coach to get access to vulnerable people

Yet they won't want to do through a few months low cost process up get a GRA?

Sorry but GRA will be by far the easiest route

@mudgetastic

People spent years training as a priest or football coach to get access to vulnerable people

Yet they won't want to do through a few months low cost process up get a GRA?

Sorry but GRA will be by far the easiest route

And of course making the process quicker and easier, so that it's open to anyone, not just those suffering from gender dysphoria, won't encourage sexual predators to do this.

I do wonder about the motivation of the people who want change of legal sex to be as quick and easy as signing their name.

I do wonder about the motivation of the people who want change of legal sex to be as quick and easy as signing their name.

I misread that at first, so my response is slightly on a tangent.

I read a thread from a poster in Australia, I think it was, on Ovarit, ranting about the fact that due to gender lobbying it was easier and cheaper to change name+sex than to change name alone.

It seemed a valid life hack for someone wanting to change name to change name+sex twice to get the name they want with their original sex, than to use the usual name change application. Save hundreds of Aussie dollars on the bureaucracy.

I have a friend who worked in investigating serious sexual crime. One thing that he said stayed in my mind and that was he was constantly amazed to the lengths men would go to to commit abuse. They would literally dedicate their life to getting into trusted positions or positions that would provide opportunity.
Self id is an open invitation to these men. Anyone who says otherwise is in a state of denial or believes the consequent abuse of women and girls is of no matter.

@WifeOfTiresias

Oh dear Elaine basic language seems to be beyond you. So I'll spell it out really simply in the hope you can understand.

The statement " I'm NOT heterosexual, I'm NORMAL " states that you regard NOT being heterosexual as being NORMAL and therefore, by reasonable assumption, BEING heterosexual as being the OPPOSITE ie ABNORMAL. Which is the definition of HETEROPHOBIA.

I put lots of capitals in there to help you follow the simple logic.

And just for clarity, it is NOT transphobic to state that adult human females are women, no clarifier needed. This is because transwomen are not women, they are transwomen. So two separate classes of people with their own perfectly descriptive word. I fully support the rights of transwomen to be treated with respect and dignity the same as I support the rights of women to the same.

Ok, there's been a trivial misunderstanding and the conversation has suffered for it.

When I said "don't call me heterosexual, call me normal" I meant it in the same way as "don't call me Valerie, call me Val". As in "I reject the word heterosexual, I am normal"

I'm we can agree that this is homophobic.

That's not what you said at all Elaine. You are now trying to rewrite your posts.

And no we don't agree

Done, many thanks for the link.

@Apollo441

I have a friend who worked in investigating serious sexual crime. One thing that he said stayed in my mind and that was he was constantly amazed to the lengths men would go to to commit abuse. They would literally dedicate their life to getting into trusted positions or positions that would provide opportunity. Self id is an open invitation to these men. Anyone who says otherwise is in a state of denial or believes the consequent abuse of women and girls is of no matter.

I have also worked in this area and completely agree. The majority of sexual offending is by men (penis havers since we have to state this now) and - in news that will shock no one - they will go to great lengths to abuse safeguarding measures in place and put themselves in positions of trust in order to facilitate such abuse.

Thanks, everyone, for filling it in. We can still make a difference.

The majority of sexual offending is by men (penis havers since we have to state this now) and - in news that will shock no one - they will go to great lengths to abuse safeguarding measures in place and put themselves in positions of trust in order to facilitate such abuse.

This paper describes how some paedophiles even if seek gender reassignment as a means to gain access to children.

www.cambridge.org/core/journals/the-psychiatrist/article/gender-reassignment-5-years-of-referrals-in-oxfordshire/6B5F217162ABD9B3189F2EB82787034E

Reasons for non-referral to a specialist centre included being deemed not ready for transitioning (either determined by the individual or because the person was not currently living in the desired gender role), being homosexual but not having gender identity disorder, having an autism-spectrum disorder with a significant degree of impairment such that the real-life experience criterion was not met, and seeking gender reassignment to facilitate or normalise paedophilia. This latter small group described gender reassignment as a means by which to increase their intimate contact with children, which they viewed to be more socially acceptable in a female role.

Waiting for guidance from MBM and FWS, OP. But will be filling it in, for sure.

Has there been any guidance issued from FWS yet? Waiting to fill this in.

I haven't seen anything yet. When is the deadline?