Dr Michael Webberley

[DomesticatedZombie]

• haven't had a chance to keep an eye on his tribunal, but from what I'm reading:

'Dr Michael Webberley applied for voluntary erasure from the GMC register. The Tribunal say it is "unfortunate" that was not determined prior to the hearing today.

MW had two requests for postponement declined & has now provided new medical evidence for an adjournment'

twitter.com/tribunaltweets2

I'd be happy to chip in a bit for the Tribunal Tweeters.
I wonder if Sonia Sohda is on this, she has been excellent

I do hope this will be widely reported in the press/BBC etc, especially some of those shocking statements from the endocrinologist.

I guess it depends if there were journos there - can they report anonymous tweets? And they buggered about with the timings of it, and required 14 days notice to request access etc ...

I'd also be interested in helping the tribunal tweeters.

Placemarking. Nothing to add except I hope they throw the book at him.

Indeed! Would also be happy to chip in with a contribution to the tweeters' expenses.

Anyone got an idea of how to contact them. I am clueless with twitter. No idea how to DM.

They don't accept direct messages on Twitter (probably very wise).

I am hoping that their clients are seeing this for what it is (rather than a personal attack) and are getting the help they need.

God just catching up on this. Even more shocking than HW. And not even showing up to defend himself. Panel’s questions in relation to bridging a gap in the service and it being the lesser of 2 evils makes you realise what a sterling job mermaid’s have done convincing people that going through puberty is “evil” and how PBs are “reversible”.

I am wondering if there could be a criminal prosecution here, even if the victims don't press charges. There are cases of domestic abuse where the prosecution proceeds even if the victim doesn't cooperate. Who would be in the position to report this as a crime?

@BenCooperisaGod

I am wondering if there could be a criminal prosecution here, even if the victims don't press charges. There are cases of domestic abuse where the prosecution proceeds even if the victim doesn't cooperate. Who would be in the position to report this as a crime?

Wasn't that surgeon who was carving his initials into the organs of people he was operating on, to 'brand' them, prosecuted criminally? Despite the individuals affected not knowing it had happened.

I still feel bad about the mini pen I stole from Argos (dared to by my brother) back in the late 80s. How can these people experimenting on children for profit, and their supporters, feel no shame?

Wasn't that surgeon who was carving his initials into the organs of people he was operating on, to 'brand' them, prosecuted criminally? Despite the individuals affected not knowing it had happened.

Fined £10,000.

www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/jan/12/surgeon-burned-initials-livers-two-patients-fined-simon-bramhall-assault-transplant

The Webberleys wouldn't even notice a fine like that. In 2018 Helen Webberley had to pay over £25,000 in fines and costs for running an illegal clinic, and she just carried on afterwards.

www.southwalesargus.co.uk/news/17272360.abergavenny-doctor-helen-webberley-fined-12k-illegal-transgender-clinic/

Having a criminal record seems to have had no effect on her either.

That's a good example @PearPickingPorky.

I do hope we see Police involvment after this tribunal, looking at harms and the money trail. Dr RQ seems to be saying that harm was done that should not have been done.

I guess one difficulty for the police is spotting what is criminally negligent behaviour by a doctor when it isn't something as obvious as operating one someone without cancer. Just being a bad or controversial doctor doesn't make you criminal. It requires something like the MPTS (ie other doctors) to spot. Can the MPTS refer cases to the police?

I suppose the CPS would have to make judements about being criminally negligent in the pusuit of profit?

Just to echo thanks for the tribunal tweeters and the people sharing it on here. The endocrinologist’s words are like the grown ups finally arriving. It’s a relief to hear medics be aghast as we have all been on these boards.

@BenCooperisaGod

I am wondering if there could be a criminal prosecution here, even if the victims don't press charges. There are cases of domestic abuse where the prosecution proceeds even if the victim doesn't cooperate. Who would be in the position to report this as a crime?

The issue with perusing prosecution isn't whether someone wants to "press charges" it would be in getting evidence.

Uncooperative witnesses are not obliged to tell the police much until they are on the stand and that makes building a decent criminal case hard. With DV victims there are usually other witnesses or the victims withdrawn accusations that police can use.

And what is being proved in a criminal case is normally very different from a professional practice case (criminal cases normally require some sort of intent to do harm or to gain through dishonesty or similar, professional practice normally requires that you didn't follow guidelines/accepted or good practice regardless of intent), so most of the evidence here would probably not be as relevant to all the critical elements of a criminal prosecution.

Which isn't to say it must be impossible, but it's not straightforward.

Does anyone have an idea of what criminal law might have been broken? Maybe something related to prescribing controlled substances? Fraud? I haven't seen anything that would normally stand up as assault.

Care Quality Commission has in the past taken on criminal cases of doctors accused of gross negligence.

www.cqc.org.uk/what-we-do/services-we-regulate/find-family-doctor-gp

I don't know how this might work in this case, though.

www.cps.gov.uk/legal-guidance/ill-treatment-or-wilful-neglect-offences-sections-20-25-criminal-justice-and-courts

One thing that struck me - the fact that he was also wrongly treating men with testosterone for non gender reasons has made this hearing more likely, and will make it more likely they will find against him. Children's gender medicine has been surrounded by a cloud of mystery. It came out in the keira judicial reviews and Sonia Appleby case. It has been treated differently than other areas - less evidence underpinning treatment, a weird language that obfuscates whats going on, the feeling that its so so specialist other doctors can't judge, verbosity and slippage in testimonies by key people (thinking of polly carmichael). The testimonies about gids were not as bad as this but they had a flavour of it. Wasn't there evidence that a 10 Yr old had been on pb's? And the strange way consent worked between the parties & poor record keeping. By comparison webberly is much worse but the children/gender stuff doesn't seem so out of place given that context. But giving men seriously high testosterone because they ask for it, with a shopping list to choose from. It's jarring. There's no hiding that in the cloud of mystery. The comparison is medicine with norm standards. That's why we're here.

Excellent point, Manderley.

I'd donate to tribunal tweets. Has anyone found a way?

[quote DomesticatedZombie]www.cps.gov.uk/legal-guidance/ill-treatment-or-wilful-neglect-offences-sections-20-25-criminal-justice-and-courts[/quote]
I did wonder about this. I think the guilty mind aspect of ill-treatment might be tricky (though who knows what they’d find in private communications if they could get a warrant to look), but RQ’s evidence about untreated symptoms seems to fit willful neglect? It’s only 5 years max though. So fraud might be better, but then evidence from victims more critical?