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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

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Original poster

Mhairi Black and 'gingers'

123 replies

DomesticatedZombie · 22/02/2022 17:18

order-order.com/2022/02/22/mhairi-black-compares-intersex-people-to-gingers/

I didn't realise Miriam Cates has a degree in genetics.

Anyway, here is Mhairi Black using a term I find pretty distasteful. 'Gingers'? Isn't this equivalent to 'Blondes'? Applied as a descriptor like this it winds me up.

As does her using of people with intersex disorders as a cheap, and irrelevant, point scoring exercise.

OP posts:
RJnomore1 · 22/02/2022 19:24

She is a decking national embarrassment.

FemaleAndLearning · 22/02/2022 19:34

@CornedBeef451

The same statistic of percentage of intersex and red heads was quoted in my workplaces LGBTQ+ awareness training. Clearly parroting the Stonewall nonsense.

I pointed out that wasn't true and that DSD is the correct term to use in the chat section but I don't imagine they'll review to data as they're so Stonewalled they can barely function.

I had something similar thing on a work blog post for LGB and T week/ month or something. I commented saying intersex was not the term used now and linked to DSD files for more info. The author shot me down and said it wasn't up to parents to decide what words to use for their children!
FemaleAndLearning · 22/02/2022 19:34

families not files

Lorelaithe1st · 22/02/2022 19:37

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Gingernaut · 22/02/2022 19:40

This reply has been deleted

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TyrannosaurusRegina · 22/02/2022 19:41

She's a bloody idiot. She is so rude and speaks to people terribly. She doesn't really have much to say apart from shouting emphatically and thinking that she's making some kind of point and all the snp zombies cheer, which just eggs her on.

SpikeySmooth · 22/02/2022 19:42

Ignorance breeds stupidity, and MB has plenty of both.

Gingernaut · 22/02/2022 19:43

The 'assigned at birth' disgnation IS for so-called 'intersex' people, who were described as male or female before the advent of genetic testing.

It's rarely used in medicine now as, at the first sign of the child having one of a number of DSDs, genetic testing is done to determine genotype and any treatment

Appletreechocolatecake · 22/02/2022 19:44

She is a nasty, nasty piece of work. None too bright, a bully and lazy to boot. And the fact she was elected as MP and a highly experienced politician lost his seat to her is evidence that some Scots would vote for a monkey if it had an SNP rosette on.

The monkey would probably do a better job to be honest.

Appletreechocolatecake · 22/02/2022 19:47

And agree that she is an embarrassment to Scots. I remember when she first went down to Westminster and complained there wasn’t any decent food for her to eat and she had to eat chips and gravy.

To go from some of the intelligent, educated politicians Scotland has sent down to Westminster to a loud mouthed boorish bully like her is just tragic.

Justme56 · 22/02/2022 19:49

I’m confused. I thought being trans was something to do with some innate gender identity and nothing to do with a medical condition.

ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 22/02/2022 19:52

@Justme56

I’m confused. I thought being trans was something to do with some innate gender identity and nothing to do with a medical condition.
It is simultaneously absolutely not a medical or mental health condition, and such a serious condition that transpeople are literally dying due to the lack of trans healthcare.

In the same way that the GRC is just an unimportant piece of paper that changes nothing, but is also of the utmost importance that it is made easier to get.

WarriorN · 22/02/2022 19:57

Watching that I genuinely think she thinks that trans = people who are intersex. She was shaking her head in disbelief and if she truly understood she wouldn't ask the question.

MangyInseam · 22/02/2022 20:07

@WarriorN

Watching that I genuinely think she thinks that trans = people who are intersex. She was shaking her head in disbelief and if she truly understood she wouldn't ask the question.
Lots and lots of people believe this. I think it's a very large proportion of progressive types who support this stuff - well over half, anecdotally and I would be surprised if it was over 90%. They think it relates to some kind of brain differences and this is known scientific fact.

It's difficult for regular posters here to credit this as it seems so clearly unsupported but in the general population it's still a very common viewpoint.

MangyInseam · 22/02/2022 20:08

Darn, should say wouldn't be surprised if it's over 90%.

Schlerp · 22/02/2022 20:09

Why are people calling MB uneducated? I get she’s a bit of a dick these days and speaks utter guff when it comes to gender issues but I’d guess a first from University of Glasgow would suggest not only was she well educated but bloody clever too.

I liked her at first and I was so relieved to see an engaged young woman, who happened to be a lesbian get a seat in parliament. I liked that she wanted to eat chips with the cleaning staff and admins rather than fine dining with the stuffy MPs.

Gender pish aside I think she does a reasonably good job and I say that as someone politically homeless. Her predecessor was far too comfortable in his seat and complacent and he suffered.

If MB continues along these lines she will find herself in a similar position.

Original poster
DomesticatedZombie · 22/02/2022 20:12

Ginger is a derogatory term. People who are genetically red-haired have no more control over this than anyone else has over any other genetic factor. In most contexts the term is offensive.

Ah, okay, so I hadn't imagined it, thanks. Bit stunned at an MP in parliament using language like this.

And I'm another who had been happy to see Black elected, as a young woman and a lesbian, and have been so utterly crushed to see her become such an enemy of women. She seems to see the world in very simplistic, short-sighted terms, and be utterly unwilling to consider nuance, or alternative views from her own (ill informed) beliefs.

OP posts:
Original poster
DomesticatedZombie · 22/02/2022 20:28

Looking back at her history, I'm wondering now why exactly I thought she was ever likely to be a good representative politician. What was taken as passion and vim now looks more like the boorish rhetoric of a tiresome drunk in a bar: confrontational, full of swagger and an overinflated sense of their own importance, and lacking any coherence.

www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scottish-news/revealed-what-snp-candidate-paisley-5118483

OP posts:
monroeagogo · 22/02/2022 20:42

@Abhannmor

What a disappointment she has turned into.Confused

Amen

WarriorN · 22/02/2022 20:53

Lots and lots of people believe this. I think it's a very large proportion of progressive types who support this stuff - well over half, anecdotally and I would be surprised if it was over 90%.

Yes they really do. Non medical friends (apart from one who did peace studies and was at greenham) all think it's a type of dsd. And older teacher colleagues who've seen kids gender role play know the difference. Some younger ones have been stonewalled.

Kirsty Blackman doesn't though. I know she knows the difference. Note her speech was all "let's be kind and they don't have a voice." Because she knows she doesn't have a leg to stand on. And had to pick a side to further her career.

WarriorN · 22/02/2022 20:58

This is why the idiocy of certain YouTubers trying to force everyone to call a number of women with dsds men, is a ridiculously stupid idea for this movement.

Not only are they vile and horribly incorrect but as many of the public and those in public life don't actually understand the difference between trans I'd and a person with a dsd (even Margaret Atwood unless Hadley has helped there) it's going to ruin and smear feminist working hard on this.

I felt that Miriam Cate could have been clearer and said, "you're not describing trans people there" to Mhairi. There's a difference.

CatherinaJTV · 22/02/2022 21:02

@Appletreechocolatecake

She is a nasty, nasty piece of work. None too bright, a bully and lazy to boot. And the fact she was elected as MP and a highly experienced politician lost his seat to her is evidence that some Scots would vote for a monkey if it had an SNP rosette on.

The monkey would probably do a better job to be honest.

She is sharp as a tack and well spoken, she's on top of her brief and engaged for her constituents, as well as wider politics.
WeeTorag · 22/02/2022 21:08

@DomesticatedZombie

order-order.com/2022/02/22/mhairi-black-compares-intersex-people-to-gingers/

I didn't realise Miriam Cates has a degree in genetics.

Anyway, here is Mhairi Black using a term I find pretty distasteful. 'Gingers'? Isn't this equivalent to 'Blondes'? Applied as a descriptor like this it winds me up.

As does her using of people with intersex disorders as a cheap, and irrelevant, point scoring exercise.

That video is unbelievable!

Does anyone have a link to watch the full debate? Not sure how to find footage from that house.

Thanks! 🙏

OP posts: