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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

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Original poster

TWAW men

85 replies

georgarina · 13/02/2022 09:59

There are a lot of male public figures who are very vocal about their TWAW views and that they should have access to women's spaces and opportunities, and have mocked and bashed women like JK Rowling.

Does it not feel weird to them? Like if I, as a white person, were to publicly tell black people "Rachel Dolezal is black and deserves everything you've set up for your equality and protection. She is the victim. Get over it."

Or does it not even register that it might not be their place to comment?

OP posts:
ShrillSiren · 13/02/2022 10:01

Of course it doesn't. Male opinions are always needed on every possible subject and must always override anything else.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 13/02/2022 10:02

In my experience this doesn't ever seem to occur to them. It just doesn't compute that it's the same thing, because a lot of woke-identified men are extremely sexist and have never examined it.

Artichokeleaves · 13/02/2022 10:08

It illustrates the biggest challenge for females here, because it's so automatic and unconscious. The absolute belief that all spaces belong to male people, who uses them should be in the decision and gift of male people, and that female people will have and do what their betters choose to allocate.

And there, in a nutshell, is why female only spaces must exist for equality. With no exceptions. There can always be extra spaces which some females will choose to use, but the female only space stays. End of.

Artichokeleaves · 13/02/2022 10:09

Oh and that a problem for females is only a problem if male people agree its a problem - which will need to mean it impacts on male people and they have direct experience of it. And even then it will have to happen in enough amounts and frequency and severity, and be peer reviewed and signed in triplicate before a committee of male people will meet to discuss perhaps considering doing something about this problem of the females in their care.

I have an overwhelming urge to shout a lot of Anglo Saxon at this point.

Theeyeballsinthesky · 13/02/2022 10:13

I think as other posters have said on here before, as far as men are concerned TW are not ‘proper men’ and as such are womens problem to deal with.

Leafstamp · 13/02/2022 10:23

@Theeyeballsinthesky

I think as other posters have said on here before, as far as men are concerned TW are not ‘proper men’ and as such are womens problem to deal with.
This.
Christienne · 13/02/2022 10:27

They just don’t think about it. Nor about how hypocritical they are, given that most of them would never have a sexual relationship with a TW.

Trans ally in the Tweets, transphobic in the sheets….

ThatsWhenTheCannibalismStarted · 13/02/2022 10:35

It's such a massive tell. If these men really believed TWAW they wouldn't give a shit about them.

ariel333 · 13/02/2022 10:36

I don't think these men accept the reality of male privilege. In their minds women are the true overlords. I've just had one on Twitter saying it was 'apartheid' for women to want single sex spaces. This view of transwomen as the oppressed and women as the oppressors is often expressed.

Original poster
georgarina · 13/02/2022 10:50

@ariel333

I don't think these men accept the reality of male privilege. In their minds women are the true overlords. I've just had one on Twitter saying it was 'apartheid' for women to want single sex spaces. This view of transwomen as the oppressed and women as the oppressors is often expressed.
Exactly. This seems to be the rhetoric. TW are inaccurately seen as more vulnerable than women, and 'inclusion' seems to consist of men and TW. Exclusion and marginalisation of women is accepted under the umbrella of inclusivity, and women are expected to bow out and celebrate biological men taking over what we have created for ourselves. I read that one female swimmer had no problem racing against Lia Thomas, because women unfairly losing was ok as long as Lia was happy.

The biggest tell for me is the attitude of domination and entitlement in pushing women out. It's a male attitude.

OP posts:
Justme56 · 13/02/2022 11:09

Some men are pee’d off that women got access to what were traditionally male only spaces. It’s payback.

Nadjahomesoil · 13/02/2022 11:10

I'd like to see these men sleep with/marry a TW.

Goatsaregreat · 13/02/2022 11:17

Male supremacism isn't it? I'm sure one of our local advocates will be along shortly to scold women for not prioritising the wishes of men. Hmm

Ereshkigalangcleg · 13/02/2022 11:21

I don't think these men accept the reality of male privilege. In their minds women are the true overlords. I've just had one on Twitter saying it was 'apartheid' for women to want single sex spaces. This view of transwomen as the oppressed and women as the oppressors is often expressed.

Yes there are a lot of men with MRA leanings, both "woke" men and "GC" men. I can accept that but I don't automatically see these men as allies, particularly, just because they reject gender identity ideology. I welcome their support on this issue, but that's where it ends.

NecessaryScene · 13/02/2022 13:40

If these men really believed TWAW they wouldn't give a shit about them.

This. With some men, it's almost comical. Like James O'Brien doing radio call-ins - the way he talks to women callers versus the way he talks to "transwomen"...

There's someone who knows exactly who is and isn't a woman.

I don't think these men accept the reality of male privilege.

I was somewhat more sceptical of the concept until I saw this shitshow...

cordeliavorkosigan · 13/02/2022 13:53

I wonder if it's based on " well they are certainly radically different from me because I could never be or want to be feminine- appearing" and yes "not real men so therefore women"
Maybe twaw is a form of transphobia actually :)
Or at least phobia of gender nonconforming people.

ScreamingMeMe · 13/02/2022 14:01

@Theeyeballsinthesky

I think as other posters have said on here before, as far as men are concerned TW are not ‘proper men’ and as such are womens problem to deal with.
I think so. And also because the just see us women as "non men". They are the default.
Helleofabore · 13/02/2022 14:14

I think they look at it as males standing up for males.

Oh… and a way to express their hate of females in an ‘inclusive way.’

You only have to look at the wonderful examples of the visitors that buzzed through late last week. They try to disguise it, but it is always there with that type of poster.

Original poster
georgarina · 13/02/2022 14:20

@Helleofabore

I think they look at it as males standing up for males.

Oh… and a way to express their hate of females in an ‘inclusive way.’

You only have to look at the wonderful examples of the visitors that buzzed through late last week. They try to disguise it, but it is always there with that type of poster.

That's the thing though...it's usually the woke, I-consider-myself-a-feminist men who support it. I genuinely don't think they consciously see it as men standing up for men, but that's what it boils down to. Not caring about women or taking their issues seriously.
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Thelnebriati · 13/02/2022 14:22

There were several men at Standing for Women in Nottingham today, they led the TWAW chanting, took photos of the women attending, and the pushiest one told a CSA survivor she was 'playing the victim'.

They did not stand out from the trans rights activists, and they were not challenged by them about their behaviour. I hope the video up on YouTube will make some people think about what they are supporting.

Aderyn21 · 13/02/2022 14:25

Funny how they all know what a woman is when they want to have sex or have a baby

Cheekypeach · 13/02/2022 14:27

I’ll believe it when they date and sleep with them as they would a woman (if they’re straight of course). Why should we have to treat them as women in every way, but they don’t?

Original poster
georgarina · 13/02/2022 14:35

@Thelnebriati

There were several men at Standing for Women in Nottingham today, they led the TWAW chanting, took photos of the women attending, and the pushiest one told a CSA survivor she was 'playing the victim'.

They did not stand out from the trans rights activists, and they were not challenged by them about their behaviour. I hope the video up on YouTube will make some people think about what they are supporting.

That's awful.

I just hope that more women will realise what's going on and be more vocal, so preserving our rights can't be dismissed as a radical fringe concept.

And I hope that someday when we look back on this we will see how wrong it was.

OP posts:
Flammkuchen · 13/02/2022 14:45

David Aaronavitch explained it well. Most men are fond of their anatomy and find the idea of being female insulting. Therefore if a man wishes to cut off his penis and be called a woman, that is so outside their frame of reference, that it must be the most hellish thing imaginable, and they can't possibly be a man.

Cheekypeach · 13/02/2022 14:56

I also think TWAW men are using it as a tool to show how ‘progressive’ they are while simultaneously pushing an idea that reinforces putting women in their place, telling them what’s what etc. It’s basically a misogynist’s dream, they can tell themselves they’re progressive while being full of sexist shite. And look woke to those around them.