FB Groups and JK

[SusannaQueen]

Ok, I'm just having a rant and I know FB groups are free to set their own rules.
I've been following a fab FB group, (Home for Peculiar Artists 2), post goes up from admin saying this is a reminder, we don't allow anything Harry Potter or JKR related, if you don't know why then educate yourself. Lots of supportive replies.
I'm on the group in my real name, so I'm not going to weigh in, but it hugely fucks me off, so many people just believing lies with no dissent allowed. Just makes me think this whole thing is insurmountable.

@Waitwhat23
Characterizing trans women as "fetishists and predators" and saying that acceptance of trans women is "giving cover to predators" is quite transphobic.

twitter.com/WomenReadWomen/status/1382726124464074752

@Wavedancer99

Comparing people that do not agree with trans ideology with racism? Really?

Get in the sea.

Oh okay - I'd forgotten I read this rebuttal from Helen before. thehelenjoyce.com/a-wild-ride/

I don't know much about Bilek. I'm in the U.K. and I find the transatlantic muddying unhelpful.

I'm sorry @SusannaQueen - that's bloody infuriating and saddening in equal measures. Women in the arts is a good page to follow

@Clymene

Yes please *@Wavedancer99 - what @Waitwhat23* said.

And while you're at it, could you please provide the receipts for Helen Joyce and Jennifer Bilek?

Thanks!

Sure thing: twitter.com/christapeterso/status/1416599964214448130

[quote CoachBeardless]@Wavedancer99

Comparing people that do not agree with trans ideology with racism? Really?

Get in the sea.
[/quote]
You're the ones who claimed condemning J.K. Rowling's transphobia is "just like saying no blacks or no f*ots".

Who are what ones? What are you talking about?

I haven't said any such thing.

I will say that I do not believe that the sex based rights of biological women are less important than the chosen gender of others, and I believe in sex based women's only spaces.

As do most biological women.

@Clymene

Why do you stay in a group that behaves so atrociously? Would you stay in a group that proudly declared no Jews allowed? No blacks!p? No faggots?

I'm guessing not. Why are you prepared to overlook this hatred of a woman speaking out about her experience of domestic violence?

@CoachBeardless Right here.

I didn't say that, another poster did.

[quote Wavedancer99]@Waitwhat23
Characterizing trans women as "fetishists and predators" and saying that acceptance of trans women is "giving cover to predators" is quite transphobic.

twitter.com/WomenReadWomen/status/1382726124464074752[/quote]
Did you read the tweet that followed that one?

Transgender child rapist Alex Smith, formally known as Matthew Burren, has avoided prison for breaching a sexual harm prevention order due to transgender status, despite the judge stating Smith presents a danger to children.

twitter.com/WomenReadWomen/status/1382770428976926725

A sexual predator avoided being sent to prison by claiming transgender status. Is it transphobic to recognise that sexual predators are now claiming transgender status in order to avoid prison or to be sent to a women's prison?

This is nothing to do with 'acceptance of transwomen' and everything to do with recognising that predators will claim to be transgender if they can gain a benefit by doing so.

Oh. That's not really evidence. Nor have you provided any evidence of JKR's transphobia.

And I'm not @CoachBeardless - she and I don't know one another so please don't confuse us.

I was not comparing people who don't like trans ideology with racism. I was comparing misogyny with racism. Unfortunately for a lot of people - including you - those seem to become a bit muddled.

@Wavedancer99
Why don't you 'educate yourself' by reading JK Rowling's essay?
www.jkrowling.com/opinions/j-k-rowling-writes-about-her-reasons-for-speaking-out-on-sex-and-gender-issues/

And then say what you think is wrong with what she said.

@wavedancer99

The sentence you have quoted is from JKR's essay but makes a lot more sense in context. I'll quote the entire paragraph it comes from -

'But endlessly unpleasant as its constant targeting of me has been, I refuse to bow down to a movement that I believe is doing demonstrable harm in seeking to erode ‘woman’ as a political and biological class and offering cover to predators like few before it. I stand alongside the brave women and men, gay, straight and trans, who’re standing up for freedom of speech and thought, and for the rights and safety of some of the most vulnerable in our society: young gay kids, fragile teenagers, and women who’re reliant on and wish to retain their single sex spaces. Polls show those women are in the vast majority, and exclude only those privileged or lucky enough never to have come up against male violence or sexual assault, and who’ve never troubled to educate themselves on how prevalent it is.'

She is referring to self ID. The predators she refers to are the people (however they identify) who will take advantage of self ID. She states it explicitly earlier in her essay-

'I believe the majority of trans-identified people not only pose zero threat to others, but are vulnerable for all the reasons I’ve outlined. Trans people need and deserve protection. Like women, they’re most likely to be killed by sexual partners. Trans women who work in the sex industry, particularly trans women of colour, are at particular risk. Like every other domestic abuse and sexual assault survivor I know, I feel nothing but empathy and solidarity with trans women who’ve been abused by men.

So I want trans women to be safe. At the same time, I do not want to make natal girls and women less safe. When you throw open the doors of bathrooms and changing rooms to any man who believes or feels he’s a woman – and, as I’ve said, gender confirmation certificates may now be granted without any need for surgery or hormones – then you open the door to any and all men who wish to come inside. That is the simple truth.'

I mean, you'll know that having read the essay? You're not just relying on quotes on Twitter surely?

JKs essay is excellent.

@WonderHen

JKs essay is excellent.

Indeed. It's telling how often, when you ask someone to explain how it is 'transphobic', that you are given a YouTube link to someone's 'interpretation' of it. That's why it's so staggering how many people will state as fact 'JKR is a transphobe' without having actually read the essay in which she discusses the debate about what she said.

Even the GLAAD link given above fails to mention the many, many times throughout the essay that she expresses support and solidarity for trans people. Just completely ignores them.

Even the GLAAD link given above fails to mention the many, many times throughout the essay that she expresses support and solidarity for trans people. Just completely ignores them.

And there isn't even a link to the essay. Almost as though they don't want people to read it because they'll see that it's not transphobic at all.

@Waitwhat23
It's hardly just her essay. And I genuinely don't care how often she starts off with "I'm not transphobic, but..." and follows up with dogwhistles about "freedom of speech and thought" (to be transphobic) or "fragile teenagers" (who should be restricted from being able to transition).

The fact remains that what she's advocating for – the complete exclusion of trans women from women's spaces – is inherently transphobic.

The term TERF is laden with sexual violence. It is the epitome of misogny and has given a platform for misognists, men's rights activists and incels to openly state violence against women with no condemnation - www.terfisaslur.com It's a horrendous slur and I believe was termed so during a court case).

And actual transphobia is a form of bigotry, yes. Factually stating that human beings as a species cannot change sex is not.

@Clymene

Oh. That's not really evidence. Nor have you provided any evidence of JKR's transphobia.

And I'm not @CoachBeardless - she and I don't know one another so please don't confuse us.

I was not comparing people who don't like trans ideology with racism. I was comparing misogyny with racism. Unfortunately for a lot of people - including you - those seem to become a bit muddled.

It is not misogyny to dislike GCers and GC ideology.

And transphobia is a form of bigotry, just like misogyny and racism.

Please can you share evidence of jkr's transphobia?

It is not misogyny to dislike GCers and GC ideology.

Can you explain exactly what you mean by 'GC ideology'?

And transphobia is a form of bigotry, just like misogyny and racism.

And define 'transphobia'.

Single sex spaces are an allowed exemption in the Equality Act 2010 for the safety and dignity of women. Transwomen are male. They have not changed sex. This is not a value judgement. It is a basic fact. They are (legally) excluded from female single sex spaces because they are male. Gender identity does not change that.

The chant of TWAW does not make the need for single sex spaces any less relevant.

@Waitwhat23

Single sex spaces are an allowed exemption in the Equality Act 2010 for the safety and dignity of women. Transwomen are male. They have not changed sex. This is not a value judgement. It is a basic fact. They are (legally) excluded from female single sex spaces because they are male. Gender identity does not change that.

The chant of TWAW does not make the need for single sex spaces any less relevant.

Exactly this.

So anyone who wants single sex spaces is transphobic? So my daughter should change in the communal swimming changing rooms with men because otherwise it would be transphobic.

Right. We saw how well that policy worked in wii spa with the sexual predator getting his dick out in front of the little girl 👍

That's a great policy