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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Not sure of my purpose in posting - just my head is spinning!

104 replies

LilithRises · 21/11/2021 20:00

I'm feeling really upset, angry and horrified. I've only recently been following the cases of Angela Bailey, Kathleen Stock, Keira Bell etc (i've came to the debate late). I feel like scales have slipped from my eyes and the antics of SW have shocked me profoundly. I've been reading about the harm and risks involved in medical transitioning and how there seems to be a psychic contagion (amongst vulnerable girls with various complex issues) to transition and that terrible harm is being done. I've learnt that Stonewall have redefined the concept of homosexuality to same gender rather than same sex attraction. I feel like i've fallen down a mad rabbit-hole. I cant get my head around it.

OP posts:
EmbarrassingHadrosaurus · 22/11/2021 13:16

@CriticalCondition

Bloody hell. I've been aware of this for years now but I'm still shocked almost daily by what's happening.

I looked at that new Guide leader's twitter. How can GG think that a person who tweets about their bra size, posts a close-up photo of themselves with straining shirt buttons saying they need some bigger tops and, as a PP said, posts a picture of their cleavage with 'boobs - do you want to see more?' be considered a good role model for girls?

How, just how?

I'd like to think that in saner times this would trigger all sorts of safeguarding considerations.

In the brave new world we are inhabiting - I'm looking for news of a new GG badge in having the greatest number of subscribers on OnlyFans or similar.

pollywollydoodler · 22/11/2021 13:38

@KittenKong

Well... now a trans woman has been given a senior position in the girl guides.
Have you got a link for that please, I've googled and I can't find it..
TalkingtoLangClegintheDark · 22/11/2021 13:39

But what I am trying to say - is this can send you mad. Its like waking up one day and realising you live in a society in the midst of a mass psychosis and this can send you mad also.

This is so true, LemonSwan. I would estimate that at least once every six months someone (a different woman each time!) starts a thread about how this issue is negatively affecting her mental health, and each time plenty of posters echo her feelings. It’s certainly impacted mine, because yes, I do think we are living in a world in the grip of a mass psychosis, and it’s really scary and really destabilising.

For many of us it also has echoes of types of abuse we’ve experienced in the past, particularly the gaslighting on a mass scale, the DARVO, being accused of being the bad guys when we’re actually the ones being victimised/bullied/abused on a structural level. It’s genuinely massively triggering for some of us who have had to work our socks off to escape from those dynamics in our families or relationships only to find them replicated on a massive scale in society at large.

Of course, in this world where fake suicide stats abound and biologically male trans people are constantly portrayed as the most vulnerable of the vulnerable, and we are supposedly a terrible threat to their MH, the impact of a world captured by “trans rights activism” on our MH is generally not acknowledged at all.

And if it were, I’m sure it would go the same way as our experiences of DA and sexual violence and we would be accused of “weaponising our trauma”. For our own evil, power-crazed ends.

I would say the majority of those who promote this ideology are determined to portray us as the baddies, the bigots, the evil overlords. It’s a really dehumanising strategy and it’s important to fight that lie along with all the others, for the sake of our own mental well being.

Genderists often accuse us of trying to dehumanise trans people but as usual it’s a classic reversal (acknowledging that someone who is male is, actually, male is as far from “dehumanising” as you can get in a culture as biased towards males as ours is) because they are the ones busily dehumanising us, as is obvious from the slurs, insults and threats that are thrown our way, the constant need to paint us as unfeeling bigots, the point blank refusal to acknowledge that we might actually be starting from a place of basic humanity, respect, compassion.

And however much we know it’s all bullshit, the sense that we’re up against a constant barrage of this dehumanising scapegoating can nevertheless take its toll on some (many?) of us almost as much as the issue itself and the misogyny that underlies it.

So yes! We do absolutely need to be aware of and prioritise our own MH if it starts to stagger under the weight, and trust indeed in the “power of the exponential tag team” to carry on the fight when we can’t. Take breaks if and when you need to. Our numbers are growing and will only keep on growing as the truth begins to emerge.

(I only meant to write a quick post but I think I’ve ended up tubthumping again Grin)

Fariha31 · 22/11/2021 13:40

I first noticed something was up about 2016 but it took me a while to really take it in.
I suppose I kept thinking it was just in one arena and was probably some mistake or I had misunderstood somehow and someone would be along soon to be the adult and clear up any nonesense, but then it kept coming up in other areas too, its like those dreams you have where you notice a cockroach or shard of glass or something and its only one but then you notice another and another and then there everywhere.
Its a weird experiance. I never in my life thought I would live through something so out there as what is going on now.

TalkingtoLangClegintheDark · 22/11/2021 13:40

Oh... yes.. the GG divisional leader who has tweeted previously offering to show people more of their new breasts....

Holy shit.

TalkingtoLangClegintheDark · 22/11/2021 13:47

I never in my life thought I would live through something so out there as what is going on now.

Me neither, Fariha.

Or that I would see this kind of “progressive” authoritarianism take hold in the UK.

CreepingDeath · 22/11/2021 13:50

pollywollydoodler

It appears to be confirmed here, as per a previous poster.

twitter.com/sian_j67/status/1462647151884910593?s=21

CreepingDeath · 22/11/2021 13:56

I know how you feel OP, it's like pulling back the curtain to something pretty horrendous. Once you see you can't unsee and all that. I also need to take a break sometimes, but always come back because this is too important to ignore.

The most infuriating thing is the complete absense of logic and common sense in previously sensible and educated people. WHY oh why is everyone just going along with this? It's not kind or progressive, its nuts! As Posie Parker said before, I used to think you had to be smart to be a politician - apparently not!

I look back on posts on here from 2015/2016 from wonderful women on here who were sounding the alarm, and I'm ashamed that I had no idea what was going on!

I'm in Ireland, where Self ID is the law, and has been since 2015, most people don't even know that! It was brought in by stealth by a cowardly government.I voted in the same sex marriage referendum around that time, and I had no idea this legislation was being snuck in through the back door. I'm so angry that we weren't consulted on this.

CriticalCondition · 22/11/2021 14:16

I just tried that sentence with the word 'woman' instead of 'person'.

'How can GG think that a woman who tweets about her bra size, posts a close-up photo of herself with straining shirt buttons saying she needs some bigger tops and, as a PP said, posts a picture of her cleavage with 'boobs - do you want to see more?' be considered a good role model for girls? '

It's interesting isn't it? Because I'm pretty willing to bet that there aren't many Guide leading women in their mid 50s with Guide Leader in their twitter profile doing that. And if they did, a pretty dim view, quite rightly, would be taken of it.

I'm sorry OP. It's a long haul. I've seen some real shifts over the last few months as more people wake up and this can be openly challenged. But this stuff was getting baked into policies under the radar for years and it will take years to unpick.

TalkingtoLangClegintheDark · 22/11/2021 14:18

It was heinous the way that was done in Ireland, CreepingDeath. There wasn’t even the chance to spread awareness or organise at all before it was a done deal. And tacked onto the gay marriage vote - all straight out of the Dentons playbook. I’m so angry on your behalf.

WarriorN · 22/11/2021 14:22

Welcome and 💐.

It is quite a shock.

I used to use the analogy of the matrix where the lead character suddenly sees the world for what it is.

Except both the writers(? Directors?) of the trilogy are now transwomen.

There is a level of shock and processing to go through which is very disheartening. What's amazingly heartening is that, just as in the past, women at grassroots everywhere are organising and sharing info online here, and elsewhere as well as behind the scenes, daily, to tackle this.

WarriorN · 22/11/2021 14:23

In 3 years you too will be admin of the local Facebook feminist group, and sending weekly emails to various MPs!

WarriorN · 22/11/2021 14:24

@TalkingtoLangClegintheDark

Oh... yes.. the GG divisional leader who has tweeted previously offering to show people more of their new breasts....

Holy shit.

Yes I've just had the pleasure of finding out about that one.

KittenKong · 22/11/2021 14:27

[quote Theeyeballsinthesky]Found it! twitter.com/sian_j67/status/1462647151884910593?s=21[/quote]
But offering to show your boobs??? Of I was in that position and made the same offer, I’d be out the door faster than you could say ‘oh dear god, NO!’

HereticFanjo · 22/11/2021 14:35

It's horrible but you're not alone Flowers The wheels will eventually come off the bus. It all starts with people opening their eyes as you have done.

LilithRises · 22/11/2021 15:45

Thanks everyone for taking time to comment and post - i've been taking note of all the suggestions and words of advice (especially around MH). It does seem like a global mass psychosis - the double speak, erasure of words, redefinition of language is like a scene out of 1984. I think George Orwell would himself be terrified!

OP posts:
KittenKong · 22/11/2021 17:11

I don’t know if anyone here has any contacts in GG but there have been some rather unpleasant /tasteless retweets from the new GG personage, alongside an explanation of their nickname, which is most unladylike...

Come on GG... or are they just trying really hard to get away from the ‘middle age, white, frumpy, out of touch, church attending woman’ image type?

Leafstamp · 22/11/2021 21:50

Article re GG leader

4w.pub/trans-identified-male-now-a-senior-leader-at-girl-guides-uk/

DoubleTweenQueen · 22/11/2021 22:03

Popping in to say hi and place mark.

Have been brought into the light with a jolt, the last two weeks.

DoubleTweenQueen · 22/11/2021 22:05

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MrsOvertonsWindow · 22/11/2021 22:12

@DoubleTweenQueen I've just posted some resources for you on the other thread you posted on.

DoubleTweenQueen · 22/11/2021 22:23

@MrsOvertonsWindow Thankyou -will look up

Waitwhat23 · 22/11/2021 22:37

Ah, I see the Misognistic Monitors have been by - they are not very fond of the word rhyming with skulk you used in a pp (as accurate as it might be) @DoubleTweenQueen.

Leafstamp · 22/11/2021 22:55

I don’t understand the problem with the word cult, given that one meaning is as follows:

a person or thing that is popular or fashionable among a particular group or section of society.

DoubleTweenQueen · 22/11/2021 23:02

@MrsOvertonsWindow

Some of the information and ideas of ‘resources’ provided in schools, as described and shown on the Safe Schools Alliance site, has resonance with our situation.

I feel physically sick and am shaking.

Have copied a lot of the guidance notes and factsheets though, as well as our school’s compaints procedure.

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