Page 5 | Harrop MPTS thread 2

ExceptionalAssurance · 18/11/2021 14:27

@PronounssheRa

Forgive me backtracking a bit, but did AH actually say that when E repeatedly asked him to stop (tweeting/contacting her)he didn't believe she really meant it?

Appears so. Harrops behaviour towards E was absolutely relentless at one point. So to say he didn't think E meant it when E asked him to stop is astonishing.

Hope he doesn't have that attitude to requests to stop when he's with patients.

FindTheTruth · 18/11/2021 14:27

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If that means because of using terminology like that that E can be banned from the platform so be it. Anyone who thinks that language is appropriate....it refers to my community to me...I've had that term thrown at me.

I probably responded in an inappropriate way. My tolerance can only go so far.
RD: given number of tweets and content, gmc suggests this was a course of cyberbullying
AH: I don't accept that

Datun · 18/11/2021 14:29

Yep, that's his defence. She deserved it.

And he won't be able to help himself, because he thinks she still does.

Zebracat · 18/11/2021 14:29

I was following all of this at the time, here and on Twitter. Is my memory really shaky, as I recall, E had been served papers, is he really saying that his tweets are responses and that Es were worse? because that is not my recollection.

MissLucyEyelesbarrow · 18/11/2021 14:30

@PronounssheRa

Forgive me backtracking a bit, but did AH actually say that when E repeatedly asked him to stop (tweeting/contacting her)he didn't believe she really meant it?

Appears so. Harrops behaviour towards E was absolutely relentless at one point. So to say he didn't think E meant it when E asked him to stop is astonishing.

But his alternative would be to admit that he knew she meant it, but ignored her - so it's a less harmful admission. He seems to be arguing that his exchanges were part of the normal cut and thrust of Twitter and/or She started it, Mum

WinterTrees · 18/11/2021 14:30

'She deserved it', in combo with 'she told me to stop but I knew she wanted it really.'

Tell us you're a fucking rank irredeemable misogynist without telling us you're a rank irredeemable misogynist.

FindTheTruth · 18/11/2021 14:31

RD: you see here in the guidance, there's introduction section then the advice about social media and I want to work through these points

could you paste in GMC guidance advice about social media? 👏👏👏❤️

FindTheTruth · 18/11/2021 14:32

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AH: the evidence speaks for itself and it shows it simply not the case. If there was any imbalance, it's weighted in the other direction.
(Goes on to say it wasn't him being heavy handed, it was other direction. Says him cyberbullying is absurd.

RD: want to focus on insight as you've spoken a number of times.
AH says he needs to take a moment to check his blood sugar.
Adjourned for ten minutes

MissLucyEyelesbarrow · 18/11/2021 14:33

@FindTheTruth

RD: you see here in the guidance, there's introduction section then the advice about social media and I want to work through these points

could you paste in GMC guidance advice about social media? 👏👏👏❤️

The relevant bit is:

65 You must make sure that your conduct justifies your patients’ trust in you and the public’s trust in the profession

The rest of it is about not identifying patients or slagging off colleagues.

EmbarrassingHadrosaurus · 18/11/2021 14:34

the VICE article may

I was taken aback by that VICE article and the confidence in styling gender critical opponents as Nazis and transphobes.

The forced teaming of this (confidently stated but still a matter of his perspective alone) transphobia with racism put me in mind of one of AH's sock puppets. Am I confusing AH with someone else or was there a sock puppet that was portrayed as a person/woman of faith/colour?

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3794194-Dr-Adrian-Harrops-revenge-porn-bullying?msgid=93088035

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3354331-Dr-Adrian-Harrop-thread-the-third-yes-weve-edited-the-title?msgid=80867627

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3354331-Dr-Adrian-Harrop-thread-the-third-yes-weve-edited-the-title?msgid=80870667

FindTheTruth · 18/11/2021 14:35

Thanks MissLucy

BreadInCaptivity · 18/11/2021 14:35

Checking in.

He's not sounding very remorseful is he....

As far as I interpret it, he's saying he was goaded into making those tweets against E.

Surely that's not a great defence on the basis it suggests an inability to control your emotions/behaviour when someone behaves in a way/or expresses an opinion you don't like.

What happens if a patient pushes his buttons?

Terfasaurus · 18/11/2021 14:36

I have the screens re the f*ggtt comments. My tech skills aren’t up to editing out E, but he’s being disingenuous if he’s claim that she directed a slur at him.

She has a history of using that word in the context of actual witch-burning.

Motorina · 18/11/2021 14:37

@FindTheTruth

RD: you see here in the guidance, there's introduction section then the advice about social media and I want to work through these points

could you paste in GMC guidance advice about social media? 👏👏👏❤️

It's at www.gmc-uk.org/ethical-guidance/ethical-guidance-for-doctors/doctors-use-of-social-media

sashh · 18/11/2021 14:40

My GP had an old dog that used to come into the surgery and lie under his desk. You would not know she was there and I can't remember when / how I found out about her.

She was a very sweet old spaniel and one day when we were talking about my depression I asked if I could take her for a short walk/stumble (I walk with a stick, and struggle with that some times).

Someone complained about the dog (I think they saw me coming back) and he was reprimanded and sent on a course to address his unprofessional behaviour.

Compared to AH's behaviour it was nothing (in fact I think he should have been allowed to keep her in the office as a stress relief animal) so if AH only gets a slap on the wrist I will not be happy.

Motorina · 18/11/2021 14:40

Defence really seems to be ‘She made me do it’

I think it's a bit more nuanced than that.

There's a difference between, 'I sought out these people and tried to destroy them, because I hate what they stand for'. And 'This was an argument in which hateful things were said by both sides. I regret my share in that, but I said what I did in response to hurtful things said to me.'

I think the GMC's position is nearer to the former, and his is nearer the the latter.

It's valid context. But it's up to the panel to decide how much weight to give that context when they come to make their decisions.

CriticalCondition · 18/11/2021 14:41

I think I've seen that remark by E which includes the word that AH objects to as homophobic. It was used in an entirely different context and to mean the bundles of sticks used at a witch burning.

Is he a bit dim?

PronounssheRa · 18/11/2021 14:43

@CriticalCondition

I think I've seen that remark by E which includes the word that AH objects to as homophobic. It was used in an entirely different context and to mean the bundles of sticks used at a witch burning.

Is he a bit dim?

No, disingenuous in an attempt to discredit Es evidence

MissLucyEyelesbarrow · 18/11/2021 14:44

@BreadInCaptivity

Checking in.

He's not sounding very remorseful is he....

As far as I interpret it, he's saying he was goaded into making those tweets against E.

Surely that's not a great defence on the basis it suggests an inability to control your emotions/behaviour when someone behaves in a way/or expresses an opinion you don't like.

What happens if a patient pushes his buttons?

What happens if a patient pushes his buttons?

I don't think that's a strong argument when - so far as we know - he has never been the subject of complaints by patients. As discussed in the first thread, doctors can be total arseholes in their private lives, but OK with patients. AH has been a doctor since 2012, and his (unfortunate) current employers will be aware of the GMC action against him, and will have been asked about any concerns, so they would have come to light. There are no allegations about his care of patients before the Panel. .

So the GMC are arguing that his behaviour has undermined patients' confidence in him (as, of course, patients don't know whether or not he is going to be an arsehole in consultations or only on SM), but they are not arguing that his behaviour is evidence of poor clinical care.

FindTheTruth · 18/11/2021 14:47

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We are back.
RD: just want to look briefly at the issue of 'insight'. You've said your insight was partial in 2018/2019
AH: yes
RD: when do you think your insight has begun to develop
AH: to a significant degree in the last 6 months

AH: My org is fantastic org and had some xonvis with senior members an dlooked at why I conducted myself in a certain way. Looked at triggers in situs and why that was a maladaptive way of viewing the situation. Only ever wanted to do the right thing

AH: it was maladaptive and it was wrong and I was point scoring and gaming idea. It felt joyous scoring these points.the likes, the retweets, I was given awards for it. It made me feel a rush of adrenalin and dopamine. I thought I was doing the right thing. I realise now

Having done that work ...(getting upset) sorry...I've learnt since then and I understand it all in such a different way and that's only started to hit home in last 6 months.

Betty91 · 18/11/2021 14:49

I think the tribunal have seen the tweet he's referring to re. word faggot and it wasn't used as a slur. His hyperbole about people dying in gutters hearing that word shouted at them... really shouldn't wash.

FindTheTruth · 18/11/2021 14:50

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This whole things been going on for 3 and half years and I've reflected back on the responses I made and my insight was well behind and the significance of what I was doing was just not there. Its become much more crystal clear in last 6 months

These screenshots are such a source of embarrassment to me...its embarrassing and an immense source of regret. It's only recently I've started having regular meetings with supervisors that things ha e come into sharper focus. I've made considerable steps to stop the conduct

FissionMailed · 18/11/2021 14:50

AH: This whole things been going on for 3 and half years and I've reflected back on the responses I made and my insight was well behind and the significance of what I was doing was just not there. Its become much more crystal clear in last 6 months"

I wonder if that crystal clear was aided the actions he's now in the middle.of..

FindTheTruth · 18/11/2021 14:51

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I know stopping wasn't enough, deleting my account and I know...sorry...I've gone beyond the realms of the question.

AlfonsoTheUnrepentant · 18/11/2021 14:52

Oh, please.

Is he going to start to weep, now?