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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

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Harrop MPTS thread 2

999 replies

Personwithrage · 18/11/2021 11:20

Starting the new thread

OP posts:
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23
Terfasaurus · 18/11/2021 12:36

The doctored screenshot is confusing. Here is what Dr Harrop said. I have been sent a copy of the doctored screenshot, which is an obviously doctored screenshot of E’s FB, placed on a website by the surrogacy dads, but cannot publish as it will identify E.

Harrop MPTS thread 2
pastypirate · 18/11/2021 12:38

Any thoughts on the outcome if this yet?

drspouse · 18/11/2021 12:40

He sounds like he's trying to get away with the classic teenager "oh I'm SO SORRY I was SO WRONG" while meaning not a word of it.

SoniaFouler · 18/11/2021 12:46

Placemarking

yourhairiswinterfire · 18/11/2021 12:48

So his excuses so far seem to be:

  • it was banter
  • ''dark humour''
  • they were asking for it/made me do it
  • muh mental health

Sick of nasty bullies using their mental health as an excuse when they're challenged. It's fucking insulting, actually.

Cwenthryth · 18/11/2021 12:50

Probably got his fingers crossed behind his back.

So they are going to deal with the Vice article once they’ve dealt with all the Twitter allegations then? It’s directly relevant to assessing his current beliefs, attitude and state of mind (and therefore fitness to practice) surely.

Jeeeez · 18/11/2021 12:51

@pastypirate

Any thoughts on the outcome if this yet?
My guess is suspension.

However, I think you then need to prove you've learnt from your mistakes &/or trained further before being allowed to return and this might prove difficult in his case.

Being struck off whilst his medical care is adequate (whatever women may feel about being under his care) seems unlikely. But it's not entirely obvious which way they'll go as he's been so intransigent and won't take instruction.

Ekofisk · 18/11/2021 13:02

Even his own mother told him to wind his neck in:

AH: I did the same thing for a number of tweets for the rest of the day. I belive either was my own mother who said have you seen that tweet you've RTd about E. Within 15 minutes. Further exhibits GMC have got and can see my reply came at 8.40am

Jeeeez · 18/11/2021 13:08

I wonder what she makes of it all?

What IS his relationship with her like?!
[NB I'm not blaming his mother for how he turned out]

BluebellTimeInKent · 18/11/2021 13:15

@pastypirate

Any thoughts on the outcome if this yet?
My bet would be on conditions / undertaking not to use social media.
FindTheTruth · 18/11/2021 13:16

Look what you made me do

Harrop MPTS thread 2
StellaAndCrow · 18/11/2021 13:22

Is saying that you've reflected and are regretful the same as actually reflecting and being regretful?

I mean we all know that's what the GMC wants, but you have to actually show it.

StellaAndCrow · 18/11/2021 13:23

@FindTheTruth

Look what you made me do
Oh wow, that is very illustrative!
ArrrMeHearties · 18/11/2021 13:24

I have followed this whole saga agog at how Harrop has conducted himself but then again he seems to be above the law... Hmm

StellaAndCrow · 18/11/2021 13:26

"AH: I would hope E was already aware of that fact as was public. If it caused E a sense of alarm and distress that public are looking at her Instagram profile that's her problem"

Hmmm that's not very compassionate

FindTheTruth · 18/11/2021 13:30

By @Motorina Motorina's insight pasted from the first thread:

the relevant case law is Cohen v. the GMC, where the panel has to ask themselves:

  1. Is the conduct remediable?
  2. Has it been remedied?
  3. Is it highly unlikely to recur?

It is generally accepted that (if the doctor is willing to make hte effort!) it's relatively easy to remediate a lack of clinical skills. It's a training issue, basically. It's relatively hard to remediate behavioural issues.

There's also case law (Grant v. NMC) that, even if the conduct has been fully remediated, it may be necessary to make a finding of impairment to maintain public confidence in the profession.

If it's established that the practitioner has 'deep seated attitudinal issues' then that would tend to push the panel to erasure. If the charges of threatening behaviour are made out (currently they are allegations which are denied) then it might end up going down that route, particularly given what appears to be a history of warnings which have been ignored.

Interesting times.

To add, the difference is remediating skills and behaviour is something we all know from our own lives. I have, with practice, got much better at making cake. That's skills. I have not - sadly - got any better at not eating all the cake. That's behaviour.

Motorina · 18/11/2021 13:31

In terms of outcome, I think conditions would be unlikely even if no more is found than has already been admitted. Conditions are normally used where there are discreet clinical failings which can be addressed by, for example, further training, audit, or supervision from someone more experienced. It would be unusual - not impossible, but unusual - to use conditions for behavioural or attitudinal concerns.

I think the GMC would also be concerned about whether he would comply with conditions, given he has effectively ignored two warnings so far.

I stuck my flag in a 6-9 month suspension on the previous thread. I still think that's the most likely outcome, but I think the VICE article may - may! - have the potential to push it into erasure territory, particularly if it is established that he wrongfully shared confidential information. Clearly that last is pure speculation at this stage.

In practice, there may not be a lot of difference between suspension and erasure. A suspension would normally be reviewed before it finishes and then the onus is on the doctor to convince the next panel that they have mended their ways. As an illustration, there was a dentist suspended a few years ago initially for a few months (six possibly? I forget) for posting anti-Islamic comments who remains suspended now because, three or four years on, he has yet to convince a panel that the penny has dropped.

A suspension says that hte panel considers that the doctor is capable of returning to unrestricted practice, but that he/she isn't there yet, and the ball is entirely in their court as to whether they ever get there.

Motorina · 18/11/2021 13:32

I seem to have cross-posted with myself Smile

StellaAndCrow · 18/11/2021 13:32

@Personwithrage

There's a general tone coming through this defence that AH still thinks of himself as completely in the right. Despite his "profound regret" and "reflection" he gives absolutely no indication that he things it was wrong
Yes, exactly "AH: I would hope E was already aware of that fact as was public. If it caused E a sense of alarm and distress that public are looking at her Instagram profile that's her problem" doesn't suggest reflection and regret
StellaAndCrow · 18/11/2021 13:36

"AH: it was in reference to C serving papers to E...it refers directly or indirectly...( I didn't understand what he said)
AH: that tweet was only written because C was in the process Es home address to serve high Court papers. I wrote this in what you might call dark humour."

He does not come across as a compassionate person who sees others (particularly women) as fully human.

FindTheTruth · 18/11/2021 13:36

🧁🍰🎂🍮🍭@Motorina thank you for explaining things

💐👏

Redshoeblueshoe · 18/11/2021 13:40

Thank you motorina

FindTheTruth · 18/11/2021 13:44

LIVE TWEET

The Adrian Harrop Tribunal
@tribunaltweets
We are resuming now.
AH asks for more water.
RD: AH I'd like to look at E's tweets towards you, relevant to these allegations. Paragraph 49, D1 p.22.
You said E tweeted you 50 tweets from 30th March to 1st april

FindTheTruth · 18/11/2021 13:45

Abbreviations in the live tweets:

CH - Chair of the hearing

AH - Dr Adrian Harrop

RD - GMC representative Mr Ryan Donoghue

GP - Harrop’s representative Mr Giles Powell.

FindTheTruth · 18/11/2021 13:47

LIVE TWEET

The Adrian Harrop Tribunal
@tribunaltweets

RD: you've not produced these tweets.
(Confusion over pages) AH says he can't see it and needs assistance. Chair clarifies the bundle number and RD says he doesn't know why his bundle is different and it's concerning

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