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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

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Original poster

AIBU to actually be starting to like the term cis?

671 replies

newnameday · 28/09/2021 10:24

Hopefully this is allowed. Not bashing anyone.

I hated the term cis however this morning it hit me that we may be better embracing it if we can't eradicate it.

We have TWAW etc. But in the next however many years, we may find it easier, for example you're on a dating site "cis woman seeking cis man" therefore you will (hopefully) link with genetically male partners. Rather than "seeking a man" and you may possibly end up with a trans man. Again, no judgement or bashing, however I only ever wanted to be with someone who was genetically male, it's just my preference and I should be able to state this in a simple way.

So you would be able to request a man (if happy with cis or trans man) or woman, a cis man/woman and the subsections of lesbian or gay.

Prepared to be told IABU and sure that someone will likely be able to point out why this is bad. I'm not wanting this to be a bashing thread. I'm just starting to think the term may become useful in the not-too-distant future.

Also prepared this may end up deleted.

OP posts:
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Original poster
newnameday · 28/09/2021 18:55

@herecomesthsun

This thread started in AIBU

There was a major gear change when it ended up in the Feminism: sex and gender discussions board, and the sense of who had been arguing what in the conversation got a bit lost Wine

though it has been a very interesting read.

I think you deserve a 🍷

Let's all chill now, I completely forgot why I was against the cis term in the first place. I've now been reminded, and fully agree with the lack of gender identity etc. I'm still not sure we won't end up with something other than just women thrust upon us and thought best if we took control but I'm stepping out of the fight. I will remain "woman" as others have pointed out 😊

OP posts:
Alltheprettyseahorses · 28/09/2021 18:56

Good grief, no! I'm not changing my biological sex class name just because some males feel like joining in. I have neither interest in nor intention of putting others' whims over my own existence. I am not a support unit. I am an equal human being, or at least I should be.

DoNotGetADog · 28/09/2021 18:59

@newnameday

DoNotGetADog

I have read the whole fucking thread, and made a number of comments, and I can’t see the OP’s issue with your comment, or how it is apparent that you haven’t rtft!

Because the poster was saying I may want to denigrate myself. After I've said multiple times that I hold my hands up and I was wrong. I don't need to be told again and again. And I obviously don't want to "denigrate myself" as I've agreed with posters that I wasn't thinking it through.

Also, as they've admitted they haven't read it, I guess my assumption wasn't wrong.

This is more in reference to your above comment “there’s a handy view OP option.” The discussion has moved on quite a lot from just being about what you think. Anyone can contribute their opinion at any stage.
334bu · 28/09/2021 19:00

Well I've learnt something new. Always thought "wimmin "was just the Scots plural of "wumman" Never knew that feminists had adopted it.

Original poster
newnameday · 28/09/2021 19:00

[quote JoodyBlue]@newnameday fair dos :) I hadn't read the full thread. To be fair I have read hundreds of threads walking through these arguments over the years. Given a lot of thought to the subject, sadly still taking up a lot of headspace that could be given to something more creative. Sometimes I feel like I'm going mad. Sorry if my post seemed to be driving a point home. I'm glad my own post was unoriginal though not suprised[/quote]
It is hard to keep up with a thread where a lot of posts are identical. Which is when it gets frustrating, as the points have been made, I've admitted fault, yet still told I'm BU 😅 it's not just me, I get annoyed on other AIBU when people do it when the OP has confirmed they were unreasonable!
It's definitely an interesting topic and I have plenty of thoughts and feelings on it, but not for this thread 🤐 I just thought something briefly and wanted my head to get a wobble.

As I said in my very first post, I was sure I would be put back in my lane.

OP posts:
Ereshkigalangcleg · 28/09/2021 19:03

The discussion has moved on quite a lot from just being about what you think. Anyone can contribute their opinion at any stage.

Yes especially as its now in FWR where things tend to be broken down in more detail by the experienced posters.

Original poster
newnameday · 28/09/2021 19:05

DoNotGetADog

I agree anyone can post and it has moved on.

However the post I quoted was directed at me. It said "if YOU wish to..." and I was clarifying if they read my posts, they would see that it HAD moved on and I DO NOT wish to use cis.

Therefore if my posts were read before they posted to me then it would have saved the bother as I was already on the same side.

That's all.

OP posts:
Original poster
newnameday · 28/09/2021 19:06

@334bu

Well I've learnt something new. Always thought "wimmin "was just the Scots plural of "wumman" Never knew that feminists had adopted it.
I just thought it was like internet slang or a dialect thing.

New for me, too!

OP posts:
JoodyBlue · 28/09/2021 19:10

I think it comes from 2nd wave feminism :) It is affectionate. Also, should say that I haven't read the whole thread to see context - lols. So will retire now in case I get myself into trouble.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 28/09/2021 19:15

It said "if YOU wish to..." and I was clarifying if they read my posts, they would see that it HAD moved on and I DO NOT wish to use cis.

But you can use "you" in the general sense. I don't think people are really thinking about you personally, to be honest.

Original poster
newnameday · 28/09/2021 19:16

@JoodyBlue

I think it comes from 2nd wave feminism :) It is affectionate. Also, should say that I haven't read the whole thread to see context - lols. So will retire now in case I get myself into trouble.
I thought it was a demeaning thing tbf. Like "men keeping their lil wimmin in the house" or something. Refreshing to see I was wrong!
OP posts:
Original poster
newnameday · 28/09/2021 19:19

@Ereshkigalangcleg

It said "if YOU wish to..." and I was clarifying if they read my posts, they would see that it HAD moved on and I DO NOT wish to use cis.

But you can use "you" in the general sense. I don't think people are really thinking about you personally, to be honest.

You can, but in the sense of the thread and the post itself, it did not read like a generalisation. It seemed like a direct response to my OP. In which case, reading my replies would see my stance changed.

I would not read that post as a general "if others wish to..." which I think would have been a lot different.

OP posts:
YoBeaches · 28/09/2021 19:20

It's a redundant term in my view. If TWAW then there is no CIS.

It's a term TRAs hung themselves on because they know it's not liked. Trym no to embellish the history of language, It's the paraphernalia they use to try and normalise TWAW.

But it's mute when you follow their illogic through.

herecomesthsun · 28/09/2021 19:23

@JoodyBlue

I think it comes from 2nd wave feminism :) It is affectionate. Also, should say that I haven't read the whole thread to see context - lols. So will retire now in case I get myself into trouble.
Yes and @EdgeOfACoin is right the derivation is wifman, though it does sound as though "womb" is in there somewhere.
ANewCreation · 28/09/2021 19:27

'Cis' we are told just means 'not-trans'.

So according to this theory there are trans women and 'not-trans' women.

According to some statistics, transgender people make up about 0.6% of the UK population.

By using cis, someone indicates that they are happy to define 99.4% of women against a characteristic that 0.6% of them claim to lack or have.

According to some other statistics, Chinese people make up about 0.7% of the UK population.

If I say that I live in the UK and am a "not-Chinese" person you know nothing useful about my age or my ethnic or cultural or physical background or sex.

Aside from the pejorative stuff, it’s just not a useful metric to use.

And if someone believes that TWAW - and 99.4% of UK women are 'not-trans' women (NTW) - doesn't that then follow that they believe that TWANTW...

anon12345678901 · 28/09/2021 19:31

[quote VladmirsPoutine]Transwomen can and do face violence. See BBC article here from just today

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-birmingham-58718183[/quote]
What does that have to do with the word cis though?

I hate it, won't use it. I was born a woman, I am a woman, That's all there is to it.

RufustheBadgeringReindeer · 28/09/2021 19:43

@DoNotGetADog

Obviously I see the problem, as you would know if you read the full thread 🤦‍♀️ or at least my posts. Nothing you have said is new to the other posters.

I wasn’t aware that on MN the rule was that you had to have read every single post and come up with a totally unique point to be allowed to contribute to the discussion, OP.

I think its polite to read them all IF you can

But i certainly think people can offer their own opinion..whether it’s similar to someone else’s or not

Cailleach1 · 28/09/2021 19:44

Hmm. I'm trying to think of a comparison.

Cis doe. To distinguish it from a buck. You don't need to as stating it is a doe does that already.

No need, is there?

RufustheBadgeringReindeer · 28/09/2021 19:44

It must be irritating when you changed your mind ages ago OP 😊

Happened to me on a thread and boy was it annoying!

PurgatoryOfPotholes · 28/09/2021 19:46

The fundamental issue is one I haven't seen addressed, unless I missed it.

On dating apps, you can't say "cis women/cis men only".

Original poster
newnameday · 28/09/2021 19:47

RufustheBadgeringReindeer

But i certainly think people can offer their own opinion..whether it’s similar to someone else’s or not

I 100% agree that people can have the same/similar opinion.

However, when the OP has said "ok I agree, everyone, I don't want to use that word, I've seen the error of my ways" to then say "well you can use that word if you want..." is a bit unnecessary. I've already said I don't want to use the word. There's no need to say I may use the word.

OP posts:
Original poster
newnameday · 28/09/2021 19:49

@RufustheBadgeringReindeer

It must be irritating when you changed your mind ages ago OP 😊

Happened to me on a thread and boy was it annoying!

I know. I get so frustrated for people when this happens. Especially when a 1K thread could be 300 posts abs allow people to actually read it 😅
OP posts:
Original poster
newnameday · 28/09/2021 19:51

@PurgatoryOfPotholes

The fundamental issue is one I haven't seen addressed, unless I missed it.

On dating apps, you can't say "cis women/cis men only".

Yep, a few people mentioned you wouldn't be allowed to do this.

Annoying as if you really wouldn't want to be with a trans man then surely you're saving everyone's time by stating it up front. To me, it's like saying "seeking man/woman" but apparently we can't even whittle it down to our preferences.

OP posts:
PurgatoryOfPotholes · 28/09/2021 20:01

I'm told you can say "trans women only" on Her. Or "cis women and trans women". So it's a deliberate decision on their part.

FlyingOink · 28/09/2021 20:01

we may find it easier, for example you're on a dating site "cis woman seeking cis man" therefore you will (hopefully) link with genetically male partners
Not RTFT (I am going to) but what's to stop a transwoman identifying as a cis woman or a transman identifying as a cis man?

We've already seen males identifying as female, and vice versa so male/female have been appropriated.

We could rename women as giraffes and some man will decide he wants that word too. It doesn't matter what language we choose to use (except it does, because there's a cost in terms of accessibility, comprehension, and the law) if identifying as something is accepted by some people as enough to be that thing.