R4 right now

[DappledThings]

Safe spaces being challenged. I only just turned on so not sure who is talking but she is being questioned well.

Angela Raynor, dodging the question and giving misleading answers

Webb flufffed that by talking about "safe spaces" instead of single-sex spaces. He also didn't wrap up for the audience on what he took as the actual content of Raynor's evasive and waffly answer. 5/10.

As always framed as trans rights , rights for everyone nothing about actual women’s safety from men. Compare and contrast to Vera Baird talking earlier about what needs to be done by the police to monitor the violent men who they know in their area . Angela did talk movingly about emotional damage she suffered which was an interesting side step. But Labour have to stop obfuscating on the GRA conflicting with women’s safety.

She was asked if there should be any spaces where biological males should not be allowed to go.

She couldn't answer.

Disappointing how easily he let her off

Also Raynor was absolutely categorical about there being no conflict between women's rights and trans rights*. Webb needs a follow-up question for when someone comes out with this.

• whatever that is supposed to mean, although from Raynor it includes self-ID

Angela Rayner, throwing women under the bus, doing her bit to ensure that labour remain unelectable and condemning us to a future of unchallenged Tory rule

She says in this interview in the Times that Labour is commited to updating the GRA to include sel ID:

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/e049ffc0-1abc-11ec-8d6d-67649e90fafa?shareToken=3722d18dc0d0c75d1e6ac03b0542e462

Signed on to join in.

Angela, it is so simple. All you have to do is to acknowledge that there are women, vulnerable men and trans people who at some point in their lives need safe spaces. Those safe spaces don’t have to be the same spaces, it is possible and necessary to have safe spaces which are solely for the people who need them. By denying this, or rather fudging the answer, you immediately redesignate safe spaces as unsafe because that is what they become as soon as you allow open access.

Unless you recognise this simple fact you are never going to initiate action that means that everyone has access to the protection they need.

@OldCrone

She was asked if there should be any spaces where biological males should not be allowed to go.

She couldn't answer.

She could have answered. She wouldn’t, because she knows that to answer honestly following Labour policy would immediately make the Labour Party unelectable, because women’s votes far outweigh the woke and the trans.

Ângela continuing labours ongoing mission to never get elected again!

'Angela Rayner is one of the most powerful women at Westminster'. To use that power to dismantle women's few and hard-won rights - at no inconvenience to herself - thereby risking the safety of society's most vulnerable women in particular is disgraceful. Like a lot of labour's professional northerners, AR dines out on being down with the working class but she's utterly out of touch.

I appreciate Justin Webb's general efforts on this issue, but I thought he allowed Angela Raynor too much wiggle room today. I wish broadcasters would give a concrete example eg do you believe a biological male should be able to become a domestic violence worker when most abused women want support from a single sex service?

Every time these twits speak, they open eyes. The Tweenies and young folk who were weaned on this are now getting to an age when they can see the injustices in society (first hand) - they are experiencing (first hand) sex-based bias and exclusion. They are coming up against people who don’t prostate themselves as soon as they make demands or throw their toys out of the pram. Hopefully they are now wondering ‘what the hell???’.

She places great store by having been a care worker. I wish someone would ask her if she thinks an elderly frail woman should have the right to personal care from a female carer.
As an aside all this glammed up self publicity in the Times (yes that's the Murdoch press) just lowers my already rock bottom opinion of her.

Shame my grandmother is no longer with us. I’d love to have watched her explain why she has no right to ask for a female personal carer (she had a stroke and dementia). I’d give her 3 minutes with grandma. She would have made mincemeat of her.

@KittenKong

Every time these twits speak, they open eyes. The Tweenies and young folk who were weaned on this are now getting to an age when they can see the injustices in society (first hand) - they are experiencing (first hand) sex-based bias and exclusion. They are coming up against people who don’t prostate themselves as soon as they make demands or throw their toys out of the pram. Hopefully they are now wondering ‘what the hell???’.

I agree, I think in years to come many of these young people will look back and think WTF in regards to some of the stuff they are spouting. Just like I do at stuff I said in my teen years. Unfortunately for them it's all out there on Twitter forever more.

At 19 years of age I didn't think Feminism was needed, I thought it was a load of overreaction. Now at 37 I think it's needed more than ever. And I cringe at the young women so happy to give away their rights and spaces to anyone who wants them.

That's also why I'm gobsmacked that governments, media and institutions are taking it seriously. When have we ever listened to teenagers without rolling our eyes and telling them to come back to us in 10 years and say the same thing with a straight face?

Therefore there must be more of an agenda here...follow the money and all that.

Sometimes I just wonder if it’s all just one massive social experiment being carried out by our alien overlords (well come on, how is this less believable that the rot people are spouting right now?)

Angela Rayner is no friend. Wasn't she on record as "keeping her seat warm" for a trans activist?

She places great store by having been a care worker. I wish someone would ask her if she thinks an elderly frail woman should have the right to personal care from a female carer.

I think this would be a better question to ask her than a vague one about safe spaces, or even single-sex spaces.

I'd like to hear her explain why a frail elderly woman should have to accept personal care from someone looking like beardy Alex Drummond, just because he says he's a woman.

@GCmiddle

I appreciate Justin Webb's general efforts on this issue, but I thought he allowed Angela Raynor too much wiggle room today. I wish broadcasters would give a concrete example eg do you believe a biological male should be able to become a domestic violence worker when most abused women want support from a single sex service?

Maybe even ask if a man should be counselling female rape victims whether a woman wants him or not and further should a man be CEO of a previously woman only rape refuge?

Helen Joyce (author of Trans) was scathing about people in institutions being paid to uphold the Equality Act not doing their jobs. The transcript of an excellent webinar hosted by Baroness Nicholson will shortly be on her website childrenandwomenfirst.org. 2 hours long, featuring Posie, Jean, Helen, Sonia and Glinner. Really worth listening to.

Angela Rayner is no friend. Wasn't she on record as "keeping her seat warm" for a trans activist?

Lily Madigan

@Ereshkigalangcleg

Angela Rayner is no friend. Wasn't she on record as "keeping her seat warm" for a trans activist?

Lily Madigan

Yep. Didn't want to name and shame but they have disappeared of late....

I suspect there is a reason Madigan has disappeared. There were a lot of stories circulating for a while.